While my LAV 111 is VOR'd waiting parts (metal barrel and a PE set), i've decided to start this little number. Picked it up on E-Bay for $65.00 (alot less than that Revell Leopard 1A5! )
I must say you get alot of small resin with this kit!
It comes with the AFV Club Scorpian turret, metal barrel and a small decal sheet with 2 CFR Plates and the bridge classification.
It comes with the newer style tires and the rear turret bustle rack.
The AFV turret also comes with the turret storage box. If memory serves the bustle rack is early , so if yopu want to use that you need the early LAV tire set from MLM.
Not sure, but i think i'll build a monotone late style with the box and bigger tires.
Here's some more "sprue " shots,...
cheers
Hosted by Darren Baker
Hobby Fan Canadian AVGP "Cougar"
sauceman
Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 09:14 AM UTC
Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 09:26 AM UTC
Looks like an intresting build, the only one piece of advice i can give you is make sure you wash the Hobby fan resin off before you start, other wise you may have problems when you try and super glue it together.
They suprisingly still have quite a bit of release agent on them even if they look dry
cheers
Keith Forsyth
They suprisingly still have quite a bit of release agent on them even if they look dry
cheers
Keith Forsyth
GaryKato
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 11:19 AM UTC
Maybe you could do an in-box review of the kit?
junglejim
Alberta, Canada
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 12:32 PM UTC
"The AFV turret also comes with the turret storage box. If memory serves the bustle rack is early , so if yopu want to use that you need the early LAV tire set from MLM."
Hi Rick - other way around. The early ones had the Scorpion style bin, while the later ones used the open mesh bin. I think you'll generally find the ones with the mesh bin also had the wider XML's. This was one of my first mastering jobs, you'll notice the Hobby Fan XML's resemble the MLM ones, they were my "v.1" tires . The tool placement was a guess on my part, since it's so rare to see them fitted. If you need any info or pics, let me know.
Jim
DT61
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 12:34 PM UTC
Rick,
I remember the first time I saw an AVGP Cougar was on ex in Wainwright in 1980. They had just entered service and one came down the road where we ambushed it with a carl gustav lol. Good luck with the build and I will be watching your progress.
Darryl
I remember the first time I saw an AVGP Cougar was on ex in Wainwright in 1980. They had just entered service and one came down the road where we ambushed it with a carl gustav lol. Good luck with the build and I will be watching your progress.
Darryl
LeoCmdr
Alberta, Canada
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 01:32 PM UTC
Check Issue 20 of AFV Modeller.....my article "Canuck Cougar". I used the Hobby Fan Cougar kit for the project to model the exact Cougar I commanded in Bosnia with UNPROFOR in 1994. You can download the article in PDF from the AFV Modeller site for 1 UK Pound.
Any questions on the build give me a shout. I have two more of the Hobby Fan Cougars to build....the next one will be an SFOR version.
Any questions on the build give me a shout. I have two more of the Hobby Fan Cougars to build....the next one will be an SFOR version.
sauceman
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 02:04 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Looks like an intresting build, the only one piece of advice i can give you is make sure you wash the Hobby fan resin off before you start, other wise you may have problems when you try and super glue it together.
They suprisingly still have quite a bit of release agent on them even if they look dry
cheers
Keith Forsyth
Thanks Keith, almost started to build then I read your response. They are soaking in detergent as i write this!
Quoted Text
Maybe you could do an in-box review of the kit?
Hmmm, I don't know if I can write good'er enough for an official review. I'll let you know how I feel about that.
Quoted Text
Hi Rick - other way around. The early ones had the Scorpion style bin, while the later ones used the open mesh bin. I think you'll generally find the ones with the mesh bin also had the wider XML's. This was one of my first mastering jobs, you'll notice the Hobby Fan XML's resemble the MLM ones, they were my "v.1" tires . The tool placement was a guess on my part, since it's so rare to see them fitted. If you need any info or pics, let me know.
That's too bad, I was hoping to use the bigger tires AND the storage bin .
The mesh bin supplied is a little hard to figure out. It looks like some kit surrounded by a cam net? That casting seems a little weak in this example. The cam net looks like dirt more than anything, maybe a casting flaw? Maybe I can put a tarp on it or something?
Darryl, Wainwright in 1980? Your dating yourself LOL.
Quoted Text
Check Issue 20 of AFV Modeller.....my article "Canuck Cougar". I used the Hobby Fan Cougar kit for the project to model the exact Cougar I commanded in Bosnia with UNPROFOR in 1994. You can download the article in PDF from the AFV Modeller site for 1 UK Pound.
Any questions on the build give me a shout. I have two more of the Hobby Fan Cougars to build....the next one will be an SFOR version.
Hey Jason, I was in UNPROFOR as well LOL. Attached to 1 SVC BN in camp LOVE-BAT !
I might call on you for some reference pics if you don't mind. I do like to model after actual vehicles when I can.
cheers
LeoCmdr
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 02:56 PM UTC
Ah, yes, the sea side campground in Split.....I laughed so hard when I went down there in charge of bringing back a bunch of uparmoured Grizzlys and no one in camp had their weapons loaded....meanwhile I had one up the spout the entire time.
sauceman
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 03:13 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Ah, yes, the sea side campground in Split.....I laughed so hard when I went down there in charge of bringing back a bunch of uparmoured Grizzlys and no one in camp had their weapons loaded....meanwhile I had one up the spout the entire time.
It was in Primosten actually. The workshop was 30 minutes down the road in Shibenik.
It really sucked having to chose between snorkelling, winsurfing, or biking into town for an icecream after work LOL.
I did make it up to Visoko a few times trailing convoys in the wrecker. Having to sleep in mod tents inside that old factory overnight was nasty! Sure was glad to drive back sea-side the next day
cheers
LeoCmdr
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Posted: Monday, December 31, 2007 - 04:16 PM UTC
Good God Man!!!.....How did you make it out of there without?...PTSD.....Post Traumatic Suntanning Disorder.
Ya, Visoko....interesting place.
Ya, Visoko....interesting place.
gcdavidson
Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 10:52 AM UTC
Rcik, I can't comment on the HF Turret, but I am building a COUgar using the LAV-TUA hull and the M-113 FSV turret. With the FSV turret, there were a lot of little changes I had to make to bring it up to Cdn spec. In no order, they were:
- barrel cover
- wire cutters
- grenade box brackets
- hatch bump stops
- rebuild turret basket
- co-ax
- AMU
With the HF kit being a Cougar to begin with, you likely won't have to make all those additions. I found the best way was to try and model a particular vechicle, as I noticed many time that Cougars within the same unit had slight differences (ie, may or may not have jerrycan rack, wire cutters, mirrors, mesh engine grills etc)
If you go with a late Cougar, and opt for the turret basket, you might want to try making one out of brass wire and strip. If you make a jig, it is really easy to get the bends identical:
- barrel cover
- wire cutters
- grenade box brackets
- hatch bump stops
- rebuild turret basket
- co-ax
- AMU
With the HF kit being a Cougar to begin with, you likely won't have to make all those additions. I found the best way was to try and model a particular vechicle, as I noticed many time that Cougars within the same unit had slight differences (ie, may or may not have jerrycan rack, wire cutters, mirrors, mesh engine grills etc)
If you go with a late Cougar, and opt for the turret basket, you might want to try making one out of brass wire and strip. If you make a jig, it is really easy to get the bends identical:
gcdavidson
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Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 10:54 AM UTC
BTW, I am loving the old "one-eye" stories floating around this thread. Should I be wearing my helmet and frag vest before posting?
LeoCmdr
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Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 11:43 AM UTC
Graeme,
Nice turret basket....can you put the dimensions on that jig?....that is what I have planned for mine.
The Hobby Fan Cougar turret is basically the Scorpion turret as is the AFV Club M113A1 FSV turret....still lots of changes and add-ons needed for the turret in the Hobby Fan kit.
Nice turret basket....can you put the dimensions on that jig?....that is what I have planned for mine.
The Hobby Fan Cougar turret is basically the Scorpion turret as is the AFV Club M113A1 FSV turret....still lots of changes and add-ons needed for the turret in the Hobby Fan kit.
Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 12:21 PM UTC
....If no ones looking
This was a "cut and shut "---12 hour "Scratch-bash " for a "Theme show---*CATS*"a few years ago .....lots wrong ---but when you ain't got refs at hand and so short a time
Btw ...the paint was still tacky when pic was taken
aye
BARV
(GOSMG)
gcdavidson
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Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 12:47 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Graeme,
Nice turret basket....can you put the dimensions on that jig?....that is what I have planned for mine.
PM me your mailing address and I'll pop the jig in an envelope for you.
LeoCmdr
Alberta, Canada
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Posted: Tuesday, January 01, 2008 - 01:02 PM UTC
Graeme,
Thanks..PM sent.
Steve,
Nice Cougar representation for just bashing it together.
Thanks..PM sent.
Steve,
Nice Cougar representation for just bashing it together.
sauceman
Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 - 03:16 PM UTC
Well the turret is almost done.
Please don't hesitate to post corrections, deletions, additions that are required!
Now as I said I would like to use the newer style tires and the turret box instead of the basket. Is this anyway realistic? Was a there any overlap?
And the instuctions don't call for the searchlight, should I leave it off?
Thanks in advance for your help!
cheers
Please don't hesitate to post corrections, deletions, additions that are required!
Now as I said I would like to use the newer style tires and the turret box instead of the basket. Is this anyway realistic? Was a there any overlap?
And the instuctions don't call for the searchlight, should I leave it off?
Thanks in advance for your help!
cheers
DT61
Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 - 03:27 PM UTC
Rick,
The joys of getting older and showing your age Still remember the poor veh commander, as the thunder flash went off in the car g tube. The driver hit the brakes, and the poor guy in the open turret hatch slammed forward. Nothing worse than crazy dug in sappers
D
The joys of getting older and showing your age Still remember the poor veh commander, as the thunder flash went off in the car g tube. The driver hit the brakes, and the poor guy in the open turret hatch slammed forward. Nothing worse than crazy dug in sappers
D
gcdavidson
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Posted: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 - 04:19 PM UTC
Rick, all my refs show the basket replaced the bin prior to the XML tires coming into service. Maybe someone will swap you a set of skinny wheels for the Michelins?
Also, I think your turret ammo boxes may be flipped around. My pics show the sloped edge to be on the trailing side.
The turret wire cutters (not always fitted) should have more of a rake to them, mk 1 eyeball says about 70 degrees.
Great to see all this Cancon lately!
PS - Jason; you should be gettin' jiggy wif it by Friday.
Also, I think your turret ammo boxes may be flipped around. My pics show the sloped edge to be on the trailing side.
The turret wire cutters (not always fitted) should have more of a rake to them, mk 1 eyeball says about 70 degrees.
Great to see all this Cancon lately!
PS - Jason; you should be gettin' jiggy wif it by Friday.
LeoCmdr
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Posted: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 - 04:25 PM UTC
Rick,
Holy Moly...you are a building mad man.
-the wire cutters are not totally correct....the welded lower mounts need to be longer and should be angled.
-don't use the British night sight...not part of the Cougar.....there is a bolted counter weight that was added on the Canadian Cougars.
-the antenna mounts are too long and need to be shortened.
-you will need to add the rubberized cover over the barrel
-it appears you are building a Cougar with the wire basket (as noted by the smoke grenade can racks fitted to the turret sides) then it should have had a C6 mounted for a coax....the mantlet needs to be re-shaped around the coax port.
There can be a Cougar with the wire turret basket and the thinner tires but not with the older style Scorpion turret bin and the XML tires.....the XML tires started appearing on the Cougars during early SFOR......during IFOR all of them had the wire turret basket added to replace the old "coffin bin".
There are other details you can add to the hatches, smoke grenade dischargers, tie downs, and mantlet area.....but I am not sure how much you want to add.
Holy Moly...you are a building mad man.
-the wire cutters are not totally correct....the welded lower mounts need to be longer and should be angled.
-don't use the British night sight...not part of the Cougar.....there is a bolted counter weight that was added on the Canadian Cougars.
-the antenna mounts are too long and need to be shortened.
-you will need to add the rubberized cover over the barrel
-it appears you are building a Cougar with the wire basket (as noted by the smoke grenade can racks fitted to the turret sides) then it should have had a C6 mounted for a coax....the mantlet needs to be re-shaped around the coax port.
There can be a Cougar with the wire turret basket and the thinner tires but not with the older style Scorpion turret bin and the XML tires.....the XML tires started appearing on the Cougars during early SFOR......during IFOR all of them had the wire turret basket added to replace the old "coffin bin".
There are other details you can add to the hatches, smoke grenade dischargers, tie downs, and mantlet area.....but I am not sure how much you want to add.
LeoCmdr
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Posted: Wednesday, January 02, 2008 - 04:55 PM UTC
Do you have an idea about painting?
You will be limited to paint schemes depending on whether you choose the thin tires vs. the XML tires and the turret bin or the wire turret basket.
Let me know and I can help you out.
You will be limited to paint schemes depending on whether you choose the thin tires vs. the XML tires and the turret bin or the wire turret basket.
Let me know and I can help you out.
sauceman
Ontario, Canada
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Posted: Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 08:59 AM UTC
Thanks for the replies, ya Graeme, the ammo bins are on backwards. When I read your post i took a closer look at the instructions, - duh! will fix thsi tonight.
I have a set of the early pattern tires that I think i'll go with along with the battle box.
I'll shorten the AMU's and add the barrel jacket tonight, along with the counter weight. The wire cutters i'm not gonna mess with, too little gain for the work involved.
Jason, do you have a pic of the mantlet area so that i can modify the coax? I think i'll go with an early paint sceme using the Amoured Acorn site as a reference.
cheers
I have a set of the early pattern tires that I think i'll go with along with the battle box.
I'll shorten the AMU's and add the barrel jacket tonight, along with the counter weight. The wire cutters i'm not gonna mess with, too little gain for the work involved.
Jason, do you have a pic of the mantlet area so that i can modify the coax? I think i'll go with an early paint sceme using the Amoured Acorn site as a reference.
cheers
LeoCmdr
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Posted: Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 10:27 AM UTC
If you are using the original style turret box bin then you won't need to modify the mantlet.....it would still have been mounting the old C5 GPMG and not the C6.
But....if you are using the older style turret box ("coffin bin" as it was called) then you shouldn't be mounting the resin smoke grenade ammo cans and racks.....the older original style closed bins included in plastic in the kit should be used......or nothing mounted at all as sometimes they were broken off and not replaced.
But....if you are using the older style turret box ("coffin bin" as it was called) then you shouldn't be mounting the resin smoke grenade ammo cans and racks.....the older original style closed bins included in plastic in the kit should be used......or nothing mounted at all as sometimes they were broken off and not replaced.
sauceman
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Posted: Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 11:15 AM UTC
Quoted Text
If you are using the original style turret box bin then you won't need to modify the mantlet.....it would still have been mounting the old C5 GPMG and not the C6.
But....if you are using the older style turret box ("coffin bin" as it was called) then you shouldn't be mounting the resin smoke grenade ammo cans and racks.....the older original style closed bins included in plastic in the kit should be used......or nothing mounted at all as sometimes they were broken off and not replaced.
OK Jason, plan "B" .01 I have mounted the rear basket and gonna keep the smoke grenades, now all that I should have to do is modify the mantlet for the C-6?
cheers
LeoCmdr
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Posted: Thursday, January 03, 2008 - 01:24 PM UTC
Quoted Text
gonna keep the smoke grenades
Just to clarify.....the smoke grenade dischargers are on all versions.....all that changed was the the removal of the original grenade boxes in exchange for the stowage racks on either side of the turret.
If you have mounted the wire cage basket and leave the resin grenade box racks.....yup, just modify the coax port.
These mods occured in about 1995.....the Cougars in Bosnia with IFOR and SFOR had the mods but also had the ceramic tiles and kevlar blankets.....they were solid green for the most part.
Cougars still in Canada at that time could be found still painted in the three colour standard camouflage or in the single solid green.
The Cougars in Canada did not get the wider XML tires until they were out of service with the Reg Force and they were rebuilt into what was informally called the "Super Cougar" for the Reserves......but that version needs other modifications.
The wider XML tires were used in Bosnia...but not until SFOR days.
So.....with the wire cage basket, smoke grenade racks, modified coax port, and thinner tires......that would be a Canadian based Cougar from about 1995 to 1997ish....in the Reg Force....the Reserves of course used the Cougar much longer.
OK.....so....what you should know is that in the Reg Force Armoured units.....the Cougar was used by each Regiment's Recce Squadrons until the Coyotes arrived......the Reg Force Armoured Regiments went down to 'B' Squadron and Recce Squadron for a few years due to the extra resources needed for the tank Squadrons ....so....there would be limited call signs you could put on your Cougar......we can discuss that when you get to painting and finishing.
Clear as mud?