Mauro, Thanks!
Didn't know that about those numbers.
For those who was looking for the original research - Some of it can be found here: http://akan.ru/index.php/satii/29-4bo

Dear Darren. I am very glad that at us something turns out similar to discussion on a theme. Probably you partly are right, and colors of technics delivered on lend-lizu from your friendly country, could be in a set. But hardly in it. Then it was necessary to the given set to give time frameworks of other order and to refer about the invaluable and important help of the USA bleeding profusely the USSR in war against Germany.
But unless few original colors for a complete set of the declared thematic set?
It is very inconvenient to me to do statements on a theme of colors of technics of the USA in this theme but as this question as was studied by me, I can not agree with a binding № UA 237/238 is dark-olive as corresponding to delivered technicians on lend-lizu. They don't suit these purposes! If details are necessary - I can develop a theme from your consent.
Уважаемый Даррен. Я очень рад, что у нас получается нечто подобное дискуссии по теме. Возможно вы отчасти правы, и цвета техники поставляемый по ленд-лизу из вашей дружелюбной страны, могли бы быть в наборе. Но вряд ли в этом. Тогда надо было данному набору дать временные рамки другого порядка и сделать ссылку про неоценимую и важную помощь США истекающей кровью СССР в войне против Германии.
Но разве мало оригинальных цветов для комплектации заявленного тематического набора?
Мне очень неудобно делать высказывания на тему цветов техники США в этой теме, но поскольку этот вопрос мной так же изучался, не могу согласиться с привязкой № УА 237/238 темно-оливковые как соответствующие к поставляемой техники по ленд-лизу. Они не годятся для этих целей! Если нужны подробности - могу развить тему с вашего согласия.

Excuse, but I am not familiar with James Bell - probably it is a celebrity which I have passed from the attention? He is a researcher?
I ASK correctly me to understand, I don't aspire with the production further Russia. While cares suffice me and frankly speaking to I rather weak businessman - I do not give advertizing, I do not impose the goods, I do not suggest to buy only the, I do not write on the production "Autentik"... Much that I do not do is for me boringly. It is interesting to me to search new and to give knowledge to compatriots as I know only a native language. I will be glad, if me here well understand with mine avto-translate and will show interest to my creativity in historical searches of correct colors.
Извините, но я не знаком с Джеймсом Белла - наверное это знаменитость, которую я пропустил из своего внимания? Он - исследователь?
ПРошу правильно меня понять, я не стремлюсь со своей продукцией дальше России. Мне пока забот хватает и откровенно говоря я весьма слабый бизнесмен - не даю рекламы, не навязываю свой товар, не предлагаю покупать только своё, не пишу на своей продукции "Аутентик"... Много чего не делаю - это для меня скучно. Мне интересно искать новое и дарить знания соотечественникам, поскольку знаю только родной язык. Буду рад, если меня здесь хорошо понимают с моим автотранслитом и проявят интерес к моему творчеству в исторических поисках правильных цветов.
Но всё это - не по теме...

Darren, as the information...
http://s362974870.onlinehome.us/forums/air/index.php?sho wtopic=175255&st=11
I couldn't be registered (for a long time) at other forum and there discussion went without me though on what that a stage I have sent Massimo Tessitori a lot of the unique information.
The information about colors discussed here - partially therefrom.
According to some misters from this forum is too advertizing? But after all there (as well as you) don't have till now my production... Also can believe, I don't aspire to it.
Даррен, в порядке информации...
http://s362974870.onlinehome.us/forums/air/index.php?showtopic=175255&st=11
Я не смог (достаточно давно) зарегистрироваться на другом форуме и там обсуждение шло без меня, хотя на каком то этапе я отправил Массимо Тесситори достаточно много уникальной информации.
Информация про обсуждаемые здесь цвета - частично оттуда же.
По мнению некоторых господ с этого форума - это тоже реклама? Но ведь там (так же как и у вас) до сих пор нет моей продукции... И можете поверить, я не стремлюсь к этому.

Alex, Thank to you for the link!

No, it can't.

http://www.fed-std-595.com/FS-595-Paint-Spec.html

FS-595 is a collection not a system.

regards

Hi Ralf
You're right, it isn't a system is a collection

But is a HUGE collection probably bigger than RAL code and Pantone chart, so almost all the color shades are encoded.

The link that you posted in fact sayd

"In practice, the FS set is extensive enough to find a good-enough match for almost any color"

So for exemple if I have to explain how looks a Russian color the only way that I can use is saying what is its closer FS code

cheers and many thanks for the link

I've read other reviews of Lifecolor paint sets and their accuracy hasn't been the best either...but also keep mind that once you start the weathering process..the paint color will be significantly different then what you started off with.

Aeromasters produced a rather large line of scale effect paints back in the 90s for 1/48 scale aircraft. They had both enamel and acrylic and are still highly sought after although they have been OOP for quite some time. Scale effect is aquired by mixing a certain amount of white (or light yellow/tan) to the base color. The amount is determined by the scale you wish to scale down to. There is a formula but I don't have it handy with me but it should be easy to find on the net. I just know the smaller the scale the more white that is added.

Roy

You can find an acceptable color for 4BO at your local Lowe's hardware store. You are looking for 'Olympic Premium latex C11-6 Olive Green base 5'. Sorry for all of you international guys that don't have a local Lowe's. The paint also works well with an ab. Dilute with distilled water.

Certainly - a collection of colors! I will risk to you to remind that many countries have a national collection of colors. In USA FS, in Germany - RAL, in England - BS, in Russia - the Card file of Standards of Colour. They are various enough and extremely seldom colors absolutely coincide. Some prefer FS, but it does not mean the ultimate truth! There are other standard ways for the color description.
Конечно - коллекция цветов! Рискну вам напомнить, что у многих стран есть своя национальная коллекция цветов. В США FS , в Германии - RAL, в Англии - BS, в России - Картотека Эталонов Цвета. Они достаточно различны и крайне редко цвета абсолютно совпадают. Некоторые предпочитают FS, но это не означает истину в последней инстанции! Существуют другие общепринятые способы для описания цвета.

The respected! Here the civilized method was mentioned, and unless it does not concern discussed production? On a box there is no information that color of paints corresponds "faded" or with the big term of operation. In that case pertinently to write "faded" and I, looking through assortment of paints LifeColor, met such preventions. But in this set of such instructions is not present that can mean color of a new, factory paint. But I have resulted in comparison as the original factory paint looks - in this comparison the paint from a set strongly differs on color. On an obverse picture of a set the tank without operation traces - new, pure is shown. Who knows, what is the matter?
Уважаемые! Здесь упоминался цивилизованный метод, а разве это не касается обсуждаемой продукции? На коробке нет информации, что цвет красок соответствует "выцветшим" или с большим сроком эксплуатации. В таком случае уместно писать "faded" и я, просматривая ассортимент красок LifeColor, встречал такие предупреждения. Но в этом наборе таких указаний нет, что может означать цвет новой, заводской краски. Но я привел в сравнении, как выглядит оригинальная заводская краска - в этом сравнении краска из набора сильно отличается по цвету. На лицевой картинке набора показан танк без следов эксплуатации - новый, чистый. Кто знает, в чём дело?

Certainly it is possible! I agree - it is possible to find. But it is necessary to know as any original color looks, differently - there can be a discomfiture. And having made exact model it it is possible to spoil wrong color - it is a pity.
Конечно можно! Я согласен - найти можно. Но надо знать как выглядит любой оригинальный цвет, иначе - может выйти конфуз. И сделав точную модель её можно испортить неправильным цветом - жаль.

Great! I agree! The Aeromaster - hurrah!!!
But how to be, if I independently want to check up results of clarification by what occurs on the real technics? It can't be расчитано any primitive formula of addition of white color. Add 15 % white in black and in the bottom color of deck planes of USA WWII. At you the identical result will turn out not!
Прекрасно! Я согласен! Аэромастер - ура!!!
Но как быть, если я самостоятельно хочу проверить результаты осветления с тем, что происходит на реальной технике? Это не может быть расчитано никакой примитивной формулой добавления белого цвета. Добавьте 15% белого в чёрный и в нижний цвет палубных самолётов США WWII. У вас получится не одинаковый результат!

I have just found this interesting discussion. I have researched the modeling colors for a long time and as you are all aware, their authenticity is in many cases far from truth.

I have read here some very interesting information. But here I will try to clarify something. FS595 is very good and useful only for applying on aircraft, vehicles etc., which were or still are painted with paints which comply to FS.
In FS numeration, you have already explained what is the purpose of the first two digits, but I haven't see the proper explanation for last three digits. You can transfer this into layman's terminology as dark and light colors, but it is not quite like this. Last three digits represent per mil (‰)of reflected light in the spectrum of the base color determined by second digit. Although, none of these digits do not show you the character of color, ed. where is that color positioned in a hue range. For example, Grey color should be combination of black and white and it is... but is this the case with FS? No it is not! Grey color in federal standard could be with different character, like it could be with blue, yellow, red character or with different combination of these. That mean that theoretically, you can have a wide range of 36440 color. You can have the same "lightness" that correspond to 440, but color could be reddish, bluish, greenish, brownish etc.

So FS is just "standard" as the name say and not the system.

For all other purposes you can still use it, but you will hardly be even close to something that we all want to achieve... authenticity! It is actually very easy to see that different standard have different paints. Just compare Celomer, RAL, BS381 color chips and you will see that you will find the visually similar colors on the finger on one hand.

I don't say that for modeling purpose, close enough is not good. It depends on modelers affinities. But modeling community carry on an burden of researching and investigating in order to find the truth and it shouldn't be something based on modelers personal perception, but on evidences and science work.

So I can and I will make a model according to my personal perception of beauty and according to my own will and wish... but it would be WRONG and I should NEVER CLAIM that that is AUTHENTIC model... unless it is based on verifiable research and I can support that with material evidences.

It wouldn't be the first time that "respectable member of modeling community" establish the nonsense as a reference for future modelers... and that is very, very bad.

So, I look on this discussion as something that I can learn from. Advertisement, run for a money and massive commercialization of our hobby, are leading us evidently in the wrong direction (IMHO). But shell we follow that way or we should price the real values and real results and researches? My model is mine, and I'm making the models to satisfy myself, not somebody else. And that is the exactly the best part of our hobby... total individuality and enjoying the same. I could like or dislike some models, including mine, but like or dislike actually doesn't have anything with the authenticity and with the truth.

I am glad that I have had a chance to read this kind of discussion. Kind that is very often suppressed on many forums, in order not to be reproached some of the potential sponsors. This IS a big plus for Aeroscale and I salut.

This is a very interesting discussion. I'm totally not familiar with the 'real' and 'original' colours used on military hardware. However, we all want to replicate these vehicles to our own wishes and to create something that pleases us.

What I found most interesting in this discussion is the use of 'authentic'. What do we exactly mean with it? A quick search shows that it is used as followed:

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/authentic
a : worthy of acceptance or belief as conforming to or based on fact
b : conforming to an original so as to reproduce essential features
c : made or done the same way as an original

However, the question is: When can you 'claim' that a paint colour is authentic? In my very humble opinion - you can sure claim this - but - if you can't support your statement with decent research and examples people probably doesn't agree because authenticity is nothing more than a social construction. Us people define whenever something is 'authentic' or not...

Therefor 'authenticity' is always biased (as this discussion clearly proves). Sadly, 'authenticity' sells and is often (mis?) used by marketing people.

Michael totally hits the nail with his commemt:



This dicussion is just about our own perception of reality - that's all - we shall probably never agree on if these colours are authentic (or not). The only important thing is to keep in mind that 'authenticity' is mostly used for marketing reasons - and that you should be aware of that.

Cheers,
Jurjen