I just bought a Tamiya Italian Carro Armato M13/40 in 35 scale
Has anyone done this tank, if so please let me know
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Italian Carro Armato M13/40
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 - 08:03 AM UTC
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 10, 2012 - 03:22 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I just bought a Tamiya Italian Carro Armato M13/40 in 35 scale
Has anyone done this tank, if so please let me know
Hello Horsetank,
I am a Tank Officer in the Italian Army, now retired, and I know very well this tank.
I have collected much material on it and I also the manual's use and maintenance.
If you need any information you can ask me and I will be happy to answer.
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 24, 2012 - 10:05 AM UTC
Good to hear that
I been buying instead of building I also bought the Italian C1 Ariete MBT in 35 scale
I been buying instead of building I also bought the Italian C1 Ariete MBT in 35 scale
Removed by original poster on 03/24/12 - 23:56:33 (GMT).
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Saturday, March 24, 2012 - 11:58 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Good to hear that
I been buying instead of building I also bought the Italian C1 Ariete MBT in 35 scale
Hi David, on this our tank I have a lot of material, even if I never had time to command any units that used it.
Therefore, if you interested in explanations of this tank, you can ask me and, if possible, I'll answer.
SdAufKla
Joined: May 07, 2010
KitMaker: 2,238 posts
Armorama: 2,158 posts
Posted: Monday, March 26, 2012 - 03:11 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I just bought a Tamiya Italian Carro Armato M13/40 in 35 scale
Has anyone done this tank, if so please let me know
I'm building the M13/40 right now bashing together both the Italeri and Tamiya kits.
The worst issue that the Tamiya kit has is with the fenders which are incorrect for the version of the M13/40 that can be built from it. It should have the short fenders with the oval inspection holes in the places where Tamiya would have you add the PE covers. The fenders also need a stiffening rib added to their outter lower edges once shortened.
Once this is done, the side steps require sheet metal guards inside their upper halves (from the area where the step is connected to the hull and down past the curve over the tracks).
Since the fenders are molded to the upper hull part that sandwiches between the superstructure and the lower hull, the superstructure sponsons will need to be filled and, depending on how the fenders are cut, there might be a need for fillers added between the engine compartment and rear lower hull.
The road wheels on the Tamiya kit should have the lightening holes molded as dimples drilled out. A .025 drill bit fits these perfectly. This makes for a great improvment in the appearance of the kit. These road wheel holes are a visually significant characteristic of the real tank. (The Italeri kit wheels have the holes molded through, but they are too small and should also be drilled out using a slightly small bit, about a .0225.)
A final area where the Tamiya kit really needs improving is on the superstructure roof. The Tamiya kit lacks all of the bolt and rivet details there, and the armored guard around the turret ring is quite thick compared to the prototype.
However, with the fenders shortened, the Tamiya kit will build into a fairly accurate M13/40 with all of the final M13/40 series changes. It does suffer from some major dimension and proportion issues, though. Basically, it's just too large.
Without shortening the fenders, though, the Tamiya kit builds into a model of a vehicle that never was.
The Italeri kit isn't an M13/40 at all, but rather an M14/41 as produced during the first half of 1942. It is overall more accurate dimensionally and proportionally than the Tamiya kit, but much if its detail is soft and indistinct. Also, much of the other detail is greatly simplified. To build an accurate M14/41, the fenders need the small PE (or plastic) covers included with the Tamiya kit.
Both kits, built as the versions intended by Italeri and Tamiya, should have only one spare wheel on the right rear hull and the jack should be on the left, opposite side. No jacks on the fenders for either of these versions.
Unfortunately, neither kit is up to current standards of detail and accuracy. I'm picking and choosing from the best details and parts of both kits, and, along with some judicious scratch-building, am attempting to build a back-dated earlier production M13/40.
HTH
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Friday, April 06, 2012 - 12:48 AM UTC
Thanks I just started getting books on Italian Tanks and I been adding Italian tanks to my stash, as you know collecting is it hobby in itself.
I just bought the o Armato P40 Prem Ed from Italeri in 35 scale, lets see when I get around to building them
I just bought the o Armato P40 Prem Ed from Italeri in 35 scale, lets see when I get around to building them
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Friday, April 06, 2012 - 06:05 AM UTC
Thanks
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Friday, April 06, 2012 - 10:19 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Thanks I just started getting books on Italian Tanks and I been adding Italian tanks to my stash, as you know collecting is it hobby in itself.
I just bought the o Armato P40 Prem Ed from Italeri in 35 scale, lets see when I get around to building them
Hi David,
in Italy there are a few examples of P 40 survivors at the World War Two.
One is kept at the Military Museum of Motor Vehicles in Rome-Cecchignola and another, who was first as a "Gate Guardian" at "Scuola Truppe Corazzate" (School of Tank Troops) of Caserta, after the close of this school was transferred to the new "Scuola di Cavalleria e Truppe Corazzate” (School of Cavalry and Tank Troops) of Lecce, where he was put in service again by his mechanics and now it's exhibited, functioning, on the occasion of the solemn ceremonies.
The tank kept in the Museum of Rome, however, is only the 1:1 scale mock up that was presented to Benito Mussolini to illustrate the new tank "heavy" Italian ("P" stands for “Pesante” ("Heavy") and "40" for the year of conception). For this it is without armament (replaced by a simple shaped tube), without internal fittings and without a motor, in addition to having some variations to the hull typical of the first exemplaries of pre-series that, subsequently, were replaced by the variants present on the tanks armed with series produced and distributed to the combat units.
http://www.masterminiatures.it/walk/p40.php
The camouflage of this tank is not the standard one, which was painted on all the tanks that came from the factory, but a variant with bands and areas bigger.
Here's the link to walk around, which we published on the site messoci available by our dear friend Gian Luca Cocchi , at whose shop we meet together to build and publish the models we produce and all the material that we can retrieve (the photographs of this walk around were taken by Fabio D'Inzeo, a friend and a good modeler who also writes on Armorama).
Just came out of the model of the P 40 tank by Italeri, myself and my friend Gian Luca Cocchi we built it together. I mounted the model and Gian Luca has it colored.
Here's the link of his tank
http://www.masterminiatures.it/gal/p40.php
The camouflage is not the classic one that was painted on all these tanks at the factory, but the "three-colors" broad in vertical bands. This camouflage was adopted by German troops for those italian tanks requisitioned and employed after the September 8, 1943, after the act of the armistice of Italy.
I hope that help you.
Best regards - Gianfranco
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 08, 2012 - 12:44 AM UTC
Thanks for the detailed tips
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 26, 2012 - 06:00 AM UTC
Hi is the Carro Armato P40 Prem Ed the same as the Tamiya 1/35 Italian Carro Armato M13/40
Or a different body or totally different tanks
Or a different body or totally different tanks
SdAufKla
Joined: May 07, 2010
KitMaker: 2,238 posts
Armorama: 2,158 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 26, 2012 - 08:25 AM UTC
Hi David,
The P40 is a completely different tank design than the M13/40.
As Col. Pelliciari pointed out in an earlier post in this thread, the "P" stands for the Italian word for "heavy," and the "M" stands for the Italian word for "medium."
HTH,
The P40 is a completely different tank design than the M13/40.
As Col. Pelliciari pointed out in an earlier post in this thread, the "P" stands for the Italian word for "heavy," and the "M" stands for the Italian word for "medium."
HTH,
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 26, 2012 - 08:02 PM UTC
Ok now I got it Thanks
horsetank
Joined: January 19, 2011
KitMaker: 113 posts
Armorama: 37 posts
Posted: Friday, April 27, 2012 - 11:26 AM UTC
Hi Gianfranco I have a question did tanks have air conditioning
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Monday, May 07, 2012 - 12:12 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi Gianfranco I have a question did tanks have air conditioning
Hi David,
sorry for the delay in answering you, but I have just returned from 15 days at home of my mother-in-law ... and no internet!
The Italian tanks of the Second World War and they of first post-war had no air conditioning and did not even have the heating of the compartment of combat.
I hope that I have satisfied your question and I'm still ready to answer further questions.
Gianfranco
jkb_sprint
Joined: April 23, 2012
KitMaker: 402 posts
Armorama: 394 posts
Posted: Monday, May 14, 2012 - 04:38 AM UTC
Hi guys, i'm planning on building an Italeri 1/35 Carro Armato M14/41, (the kit says 13/40 but i think it is closer to a 14/41), and i got confused over the colour used by Italian forces. Could you tell me which one is correct? Each time i search for the subject i find something else.... I want to replicate a tank from Ariete division in El Alamein.
David sorry for using your topic but since it was for the same subject i thought it would be best not to open a new topic on that.
David sorry for using your topic but since it was for the same subject i thought it would be best not to open a new topic on that.
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 15, 2012 - 12:48 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi guys, i'm planning on building an Italeri 1/35 Carro Armato M14/41, (the kit says 13/40 but i think it is closer to a 14/41), and i got confused over the colour used by Italian forces. Could you tell me which one is correct? Each time i search for the subject i find something else.... I want to replicate a tank from Ariete division in El Alamein.
David sorry for using your topic but since it was for the same subject i thought it would be best not to open a new topic on that.
Hi John,
I will confirm that the Italeri model is not an M 13/40 but it is actually a M14/41 - 1^ series (initial production).
This is highlighted, both by the cap of the collector of the radiator moved backwards (the shape of the collector, however, is still the old one and not "at mushroom" adopted for all the M14/41 to increase the radiating surface), both from the rear ventilation grills, which are longitudinal, not transverse as in the M13/40, both for the simplified protections on the exhaust mufflers.
In fact, it is one of the 190 M14/41(of 695 products) of initial (advanced) production (mid 1941) as it already has fenders along, but still lacks the "chase-mud" lever behind the drive sprocket (adopted from the beginning of 1942).
The base color of the Italian tanks in North Africa is the "Cachi sahariano" (Khaki Saharan), which roughly corresponds to the FS 33434 (matt) and also to FS 20260 (semi matte), on which the crews painted several camouflage schemes once in theater .
I hope to have been of help to you.
Cheers - Gianfranco
jkb_sprint
Joined: April 23, 2012
KitMaker: 402 posts
Armorama: 394 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 15, 2012 - 06:22 PM UTC
Hi Gianfranco, thank you very much for your very detailed reply. Although i searched a lot about this tank, i missed the detail about the chase mud. Italian WW II armor is a mislooked subject by many and good info is not vey easy to find. In my opinion those tanks are very interesting in a modelling point of view. Plus the fact they had to fight, (at the later part of the war, when most of these designs became obsolete), against much more powerfull and numerically superior tanks, which is the reason for their bad reputation. It took a whole lot of courage for those crews to get in, start their engines and go fight. The Ariete division destruction/sacrifice at El Alamein is a very good example.
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Wednesday, May 16, 2012 - 08:25 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hi Gianfranco, thank you very much for your very detailed reply. Although i searched a lot about this tank, i missed the detail about the chase mud. Italian WW II armor is a mislooked subject by many and good info is not vey easy to find. In my opinion those tanks are very interesting in a modelling point of view. Plus the fact they had to fight, (at the later part of the war, when most of these designs became obsolete), against much more powerfull and numerically superior tanks, which is the reason for their bad reputation. It took a whole lot of courage for those crews to get in, start their engines and go fight. The Ariete division destruction/sacrifice at El Alamein is a very good example.
Hi John,
thanks for the compliments.
I am a Tank Officer now retired and my father was also an NCO tank crewman who fought in North Africa in World War II.
He fought not on the M 13/40 but on the smaller L 3/33-35, and he was captured in June 1941 when the British attacked and captured the "Redoubt Capuzzo" on the border between Libya and Egypt.
That's why I'm particularly fond of all Italian tanks, especially those who were employed during the Second World War by our valiant tank crews.
Here is a picture of my father on a tank L 3/35 during a training exercise in Parma in 1935, shortly before leaving for Africa (my father is on the right):
Cheers - Gianfranco
Fotouno
Joined: May 18, 2012
KitMaker: 3 posts
Armorama: 2 posts
Posted: Friday, May 18, 2012 - 03:35 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextI just bought a Tamiya Italian Carro Armato M13/40 in 35 scale
Has anyone done this tank, if so please let me know
Hello Horsetank,
I am a Tank Officer in the Italian Army, now retired, and I know very well this tank.
I have collected much material on it and I also the manual's use and maintenance.
If you need any information you can ask me and I will be happy to answer.
Fotouno
Joined: May 18, 2012
KitMaker: 3 posts
Armorama: 2 posts
Posted: Friday, May 18, 2012 - 03:37 AM UTC
Hello, my father was a carrista in wwll in Africa. I've been fascinated with this tank.
Negrillo
Joined: September 06, 2006
KitMaker: 58 posts
Armorama: 54 posts
Posted: Friday, May 18, 2012 - 04:17 AM UTC
Hi Gianfranco,
Excellent photo of your father in his CV 35 serie I, with a little work this version can be made from Bronco`s CV 35 serie II kit.
Regards
Stirl
PS Did your father ever serve in Spain ?
Excellent photo of your father in his CV 35 serie I, with a little work this version can be made from Bronco`s CV 35 serie II kit.
Regards
Stirl
PS Did your father ever serve in Spain ?
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Monday, May 21, 2012 - 04:21 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hello, my father was a carrista in wwll in Africa. I've been fascinated with this tank.
Hi Peter,
but your father was an Italian army tank crewman? In which unit he has served? In which period he was in North Africa?
My father was sent to North Africa in late 1935 and was captured in June 1941 by the English units who conquered the "Redoubt Capuzzo."
When the "Redoubt Capuzzo" was captured, he was taken to a prison camp in India and he was released only in 1946 because he never wanted to collaborate with the British.
If you want more info on this little tank, I am at your disposal because I know it very well.
Cheers - Gianfranco
Il_Colonnello
Joined: March 08, 2012
KitMaker: 140 posts
Armorama: 140 posts
Posted: Monday, May 21, 2012 - 04:50 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextHello, my father was a carrista in wwll in Africa. I've been fascinated with this tank.
Hi Peter,
but your father was an Italian army tank crewman? In which unit he has served? In which period he was in North Africa?
My father was sent to North Africa in late 1935 and was captured in June 1941 by the English units who conquered the "Redoubt Capuzzo."
When the "Redoubt Capuzzo" was captured, he was taken to a prison camp in India and he was released only in 1946 because he never wanted to collaborate with the British.
If you want more info on this little tank, I am at your disposal because I know it very well.
Cheers - Gianfranco
Hi Stirling,
I am happy that the photograph of my father have enjoyed you.
Here is another picture of my father, always on an L 3/33 (1st series) while it's doing driving school at the School for NCO of the Tank Corps in Parma in 1935.
I know I can get the 1 series of this tank from the Bronco kit (I have all the versions made by both the Bronco, both other local kitmaker, which they produced in resin the complete kits or the conversion kits for any version of this small tank (Model Victoria, Italian Kit, Model Cri.El, Brach Model, Royal Models, etc ...)
Cheers - Gianfranco
P. S.: My father don't fought in Spain, but only in North Africa.
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