I'm sure the original intent was good, but let's face it, a full 40% of the threads on the front page are stickies. Many have not been added to since 2011. None have been added to in the month of December. One has not been addressed in almost two years. I just read the one on "How to build a T-62" and honestly, not much there on actually building it or correcting the kits currently out there.
I think most of the forums work pretty well by asking questions and getting them answered. Does that sometime mean duplication? Sure it does, but what does that really hurt? A question asked two years may have far different answers than one asked today. Personally, I think it might be nice to see most of the current, more relevant threads on the front page where they can get the attention they deserve. If any life or death information gets pushed back in the process, there's always the search function.
Яusso-Soviэt Forum
Russian or Soviet vehicles/armor modeling forum.
Russian or Soviet vehicles/armor modeling forum.
Hosted by Darren Baker, Jacques Duquette
Just A Suggestion...
18Bravo
Colorado, United States
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Posted: Wednesday, December 12, 2012 - 06:38 PM UTC
Jurjen
Groningen, Netherlands
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Posted: Wednesday, December 12, 2012 - 06:58 PM UTC
I totally agree..
Far more recent topics are now too fast pushed back to the second page, just because of the stickies (with some 'recent comment' in 2011?) I think it is good to combine all the 'how to model' in onesticky.
Jacques?
Far more recent topics are now too fast pushed back to the second page, just because of the stickies (with some 'recent comment' in 2011?) I think it is good to combine all the 'how to model' in onesticky.
Jacques?
RustySteel
Connecticut, United States
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Posted: Wednesday, December 12, 2012 - 11:30 PM UTC
Make that three. Maybe make a folder, if that's possible, that contains all of the stickies. And if possible to chat within that folder without going into sticky then chat about general ways to make Russian/ Soviet armor.
Minsk94
Wisconsin, United States
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 01:36 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Does that sometime mean duplication? Sure it does, but what does that really hurt?
Yes, it does hurt. Because the search on armorama sucks already, and when you need to find some info you have to look through all the duplicates. This is why some of the people prefer to ask again instead of digging through all that mess.
As far as the original intent goes,it would work great if people instead of opening new topics to ask their question would post it into the "sticky" thread. It would also make the search easier.
Another reason why it doesn't work is because the moderators of the forum don't enforce use of those sticky threads.
Just my 5 cents...
18Bravo
Colorado, United States
Joined: January 20, 2005
KitMaker: 7,219 posts
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 05:37 AM UTC
As an example, here are some current threads: Zvezda T-90, 17 responses. The stickied "How to build T-90" thread - 15.
T-72 thread, 60 responses. Old sticky on T-72, 23 responses. Nothing posted since May 2011.
Current thread on T-34/76, ten responses. Sticky on Soviet WWII tanks - eight, and not responded to in almost two years.
I don't care if you agree if disagree, but 200 fence sitters? Speak out for what you believe in.
T-72 thread, 60 responses. Old sticky on T-72, 23 responses. Nothing posted since May 2011.
Current thread on T-34/76, ten responses. Sticky on Soviet WWII tanks - eight, and not responded to in almost two years.
I don't care if you agree if disagree, but 200 fence sitters? Speak out for what you believe in.
todorovicandreas
Austria
Joined: May 01, 2007
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 06:05 AM UTC
I´m with you on this, Robert. As those "stickies" are not really used or "up to date", I won´t miss them. And we would have more space on the first page for current topics. Good idea Robert, thanks for bringing this up.
All the best,
Andreas
All the best,
Andreas
seb43
Paris, France
Joined: August 30, 2005
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 06:09 AM UTC
Wake up Guys
What is the business model of such website??
Generate traffic so you can claim how many visitors are on the site to sell ads.
If you ease the search that you will remove posts so reducing views so less income.
This is a commercial website not a public library.
My two cents
Seb
What is the business model of such website??
Generate traffic so you can claim how many visitors are on the site to sell ads.
If you ease the search that you will remove posts so reducing views so less income.
This is a commercial website not a public library.
My two cents
Seb
junglejim
Alberta, Canada
Joined: February 18, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 06:44 AM UTC
Really?! Ten 'stickies' to scroll past is a concern? I'd rather have them there then not, but it would be nice if more people used them. The answer to 'who makes the best T-72 for instance should be covered in the T-72 thread so it doesn't have to be asked over and over...
Jim
Jim
18Bravo
Colorado, United States
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 10:06 AM UTC
By your logic, in the Armor/AFV forum, we should have separate "Who has the best M60A1, M60A3, M1A1, M1A2, Challenger, Merkava, Leopard, Tiger, Panther, Sherman, Chaffee..." stickies as well.
There's more to "How to build" a thing than stuffing it into convenient drawer. Even if every did shoehorn their question into an existing "Sticky" thread, you still have these arch that thread, don't you? IMHO, better to search a title for a specific question, (thus satisfying the commercially lucrative need to have people do searches) than to go to a hardly used thread and have to read all of the posts anyway until you find the relevant one, or in most cases, not. Expecting every build question to fit into that category is not realistic, hence, few use it.
As a further example, and I don't remember who post it, so I'm not picking on him, there's mention of the Trumpeter T-62 supplying a separate bow plate with engineering mounts. That would have been a perfect time to explain why that particular piece they include is useless. Yet no mention is made of the fact. The reason I haven't posted this in the past is because I anticipated exactly such a response. Honestly, it's my site. As I said a few weeks ago, I have other interests these days. If trying to help make the site a little more user friendly is a crime, well then less knowledge gets shared to those who have questions. Apparently I'm not the only one who thinks so.
There's more to "How to build" a thing than stuffing it into convenient drawer. Even if every did shoehorn their question into an existing "Sticky" thread, you still have these arch that thread, don't you? IMHO, better to search a title for a specific question, (thus satisfying the commercially lucrative need to have people do searches) than to go to a hardly used thread and have to read all of the posts anyway until you find the relevant one, or in most cases, not. Expecting every build question to fit into that category is not realistic, hence, few use it.
As a further example, and I don't remember who post it, so I'm not picking on him, there's mention of the Trumpeter T-62 supplying a separate bow plate with engineering mounts. That would have been a perfect time to explain why that particular piece they include is useless. Yet no mention is made of the fact. The reason I haven't posted this in the past is because I anticipated exactly such a response. Honestly, it's my site. As I said a few weeks ago, I have other interests these days. If trying to help make the site a little more user friendly is a crime, well then less knowledge gets shared to those who have questions. Apparently I'm not the only one who thinks so.
junglejim
Alberta, Canada
Joined: February 18, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 06:15 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I don't care if you agree if disagree, but 200 fence sitters? Speak out for what you believe in.
Well, I'm sure you're condescending "holier than thou" response will encourage many others to respond
Jim
Kharkov
Joined: April 09, 2011
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 09:01 PM UTC
Armor/AFV - 460,720 posts
Russian - 40,718 posts
I tend to agree, I think the 'How to' threads are a damn good idea, but there is simply not enough posting on the 'Dark side' (lol) to make them work, so some of them are starved of information, and get either no posting or very little, and they do take up alot of room on the first page.
The 'How to model Soviet WWII Tanks' is a little bit pointless tbh, and gets very little posting, and tbh that's the problem on the Russian side, ie a lack of posting, but things are starting to hot up a bit, there are some nice new kits on the way (BMP 1, T-80), so it would make sense to maybe free up some room on the front page.
On the subject of posting, and lack of it, is it any wonder when you consider that the Reply Box is almost nothing more than a second thought, when you do a Reply/Post the box is just swamped by advertising, which just reduces the box down to a stupidly small size (you can't even judge your paragraph size, lol)
And yes, I am fully aware that this site runs on advertising, but for that advertising to work, and to gain more you need visitors, and to gain visitors you need posting, so how did the Reply/Post box end up so bad ??
So, yeah, more space on the front page would be good, hell who knows, it might even result in more posting on the Russian side, something that is badly needed.
That's my opinion while still sitting on the fence, giving an opinion while not sitting on the fence tends to result in 'unpleasantries' from my experience.
Spiderfrommars
Milano, Italy
Joined: July 13, 2010
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Posted: Thursday, December 13, 2012 - 10:36 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextDoes that sometime mean duplication? Sure it does, but what does that really hurt?
Yes, it does hurt. Because the search on armorama sucks already, and when you need to find some info you have to look through all the duplicates. This is why some of the people prefer to ask again instead of digging through all that mess.
As far as the original intent goes,it would work great if people instead of opening new topics to ask their question would post it into the "sticky" thread. It would also make the search easier.
Another reason why it doesn't work is because the moderators of the forum don't enforce use of those sticky threads.
Just my 5 cents...
I agree
BillGorm
New Jersey, United States
Joined: November 02, 2009
KitMaker: 609 posts
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Joined: November 02, 2009
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Armorama: 433 posts
Posted: Friday, December 14, 2012 - 01:17 AM UTC
Armorama is one of my favorite sites but I think a few changes would improve it further (at least the Russo-Soviet Forum):
1. First, keep the "How to build ... " stickies at the top of the page but change how they're monitored. Unlike build logs and general posts, the moderators actively monitor the stickies and cull their content on a regular basis. Off topic comments are nuked or moved to the general comments section. Yes, this would require the occasional judgment call on the part of the moderators, but nothing too terrible ... and I could live with it if the result were more useful stickies. The SU-100 and T34/76 build logs should be moved to the Build Logs section (keep reading).
2. Second, create a Build Logs section where you can scroll through the various build logs. Moderators would monitor this section as they do today (no need to review/cull content). Yes, I know there is a filter you can use to identify build logs but I don't think it's intuitive, probably because it takes other information out of view. In other words, the fact that I want to get to the build logs in a quick and easy way doesn't mean I don't want to continue viewing other content.
3. Third, general conversations, questions, Q&A, etc. go into threads into a third section as they do today. However, moderators can and will merge overlapping threads when it makes sense. I've been spending a lot of time on ModelWarships.com lately and that is exactly what their moderators do. It rarely creates friction as most users realize it is for the good of the site.
So basically I would like to see a three-pane window with stickies at the top, build logs in the middle, and general discussion at the bottom. Simple expand/collapse buttons on each section would address folks whose monitors lack the real estate to display all three sections together. Pretty straightforward ... two sections are specific content, one is more of a town square.
1. First, keep the "How to build ... " stickies at the top of the page but change how they're monitored. Unlike build logs and general posts, the moderators actively monitor the stickies and cull their content on a regular basis. Off topic comments are nuked or moved to the general comments section. Yes, this would require the occasional judgment call on the part of the moderators, but nothing too terrible ... and I could live with it if the result were more useful stickies. The SU-100 and T34/76 build logs should be moved to the Build Logs section (keep reading).
2. Second, create a Build Logs section where you can scroll through the various build logs. Moderators would monitor this section as they do today (no need to review/cull content). Yes, I know there is a filter you can use to identify build logs but I don't think it's intuitive, probably because it takes other information out of view. In other words, the fact that I want to get to the build logs in a quick and easy way doesn't mean I don't want to continue viewing other content.
3. Third, general conversations, questions, Q&A, etc. go into threads into a third section as they do today. However, moderators can and will merge overlapping threads when it makes sense. I've been spending a lot of time on ModelWarships.com lately and that is exactly what their moderators do. It rarely creates friction as most users realize it is for the good of the site.
So basically I would like to see a three-pane window with stickies at the top, build logs in the middle, and general discussion at the bottom. Simple expand/collapse buttons on each section would address folks whose monitors lack the real estate to display all three sections together. Pretty straightforward ... two sections are specific content, one is more of a town square.
Jacques
Minnesota, United States
Joined: March 04, 2003
KitMaker: 4,630 posts
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Joined: March 04, 2003
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Posted: Friday, December 14, 2012 - 10:21 AM UTC
ok...
1. I run the stickies for this forum. The personal builds I have on there are from a LONG time ago when they were very popular threads and they are associated with reviews for the website. I will be looking over both of them to un-sticky them...
2. The stickies are NOT for most popular, they are for most relevant/most used. They get a lot of views even if they do not get a lot of posts, as intended, to hopefully cut down on the "I need help finding" threads...
3. All of them are meant to hold information on the titles subject. That means that if no new information comes out on them, there will be no new postings. That does not make them irrelevant, just not the same conversation matter as a BLOG.
4. The WWII Russian Armor sticky was a catch-all since it would be WAY too overwhelming and it is FAR better covered in LOTS of ways than modern items.
I have taken your comments into account though. Thanks for commenting.
I will talk to Jim about adding a "sort" button for BLOG's, Stickies, etc...that may help if it is possible...
1. I run the stickies for this forum. The personal builds I have on there are from a LONG time ago when they were very popular threads and they are associated with reviews for the website. I will be looking over both of them to un-sticky them...
2. The stickies are NOT for most popular, they are for most relevant/most used. They get a lot of views even if they do not get a lot of posts, as intended, to hopefully cut down on the "I need help finding" threads...
3. All of them are meant to hold information on the titles subject. That means that if no new information comes out on them, there will be no new postings. That does not make them irrelevant, just not the same conversation matter as a BLOG.
4. The WWII Russian Armor sticky was a catch-all since it would be WAY too overwhelming and it is FAR better covered in LOTS of ways than modern items.
I have taken your comments into account though. Thanks for commenting.
I will talk to Jim about adding a "sort" button for BLOG's, Stickies, etc...that may help if it is possible...
Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 05:14 AM UTC
There are several possible outcomes to this. One would be to use the forum/group system to filter discussions on specific topics or issues. For example a group on "How To" or "Historical Tank Info", etc. would allow people to find these topics more easily via the group system. We already have two groups (WW2, Cold War), additional groups can easily be added. For one I am realizing that perhaps a Post-USSR group might be nice for 1991+ tanks and AFV's.
I did like the idea about blocks for stickies, blogs and regular posts though. Nothing this drastic is going to happen overnight though. That's a major re-coding of the forum system.
Cheers,
Jim
I did like the idea about blocks for stickies, blogs and regular posts though. Nothing this drastic is going to happen overnight though. That's a major re-coding of the forum system.
Cheers,
Jim
AgentG
Nevada, United States
Joined: December 21, 2008
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Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 05:24 AM UTC
Why worry about about this?
I think someone needs a life.
G
I think someone needs a life.
G
Silantra
Putrajaya, Malaysia
Joined: March 04, 2004
KitMaker: 2,511 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, December 18, 2012 - 04:58 PM UTC
wow...amazing all reponses from this tiny issue... well here's my suggestion that perhaps could please everybody..
maybe the our fellow moderator can make an index thread and make this the only sticky thread..
the index can contains all the previous sticky or any other relevant or reference thread that existed in this site as well as other site...
this is not hard to do...
my 2 sen
Zaidi
maybe the our fellow moderator can make an index thread and make this the only sticky thread..
the index can contains all the previous sticky or any other relevant or reference thread that existed in this site as well as other site...
this is not hard to do...
my 2 sen
Zaidi
Jacques
Minnesota, United States
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Joined: March 04, 2003
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Posted: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 - 06:03 AM UTC
The only problem I have with a index thread is making it easy and visible not only to regular readers, but also the casual skimmer who flies through here. Being able to easily see the stickied topics at the top, with a good list of references and tips on all models in the topic (ie T-64 has advice on both SKIF and Trumpeter kits) in the thread, means we might attract more modelers. My specific aim is to get as much help and interest to as many people as possible and grow the enthusiasm for "Red Army" modeling more than anything. I eventually want to go to AMPS Nationals and see more T-80 tanks than Panthers. Now that is a dream!
BillGorm
New Jersey, United States
Joined: November 02, 2009
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Posted: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 - 08:01 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Why worry about about this?
I think someone needs a life.
I hope this isn't directed at me. I like Armorama plenty in its present form but someone raised an interesting question and I offered my two cents.
AgentG
Nevada, United States
Joined: December 21, 2008
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Posted: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 - 08:29 AM UTC
It was directed at the OP, but if the shoe fits.......
G
G
BillGorm
New Jersey, United States
Joined: November 02, 2009
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Joined: November 02, 2009
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Posted: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 - 08:32 AM UTC
I need to get a life because ... I offered input on how this site might be improved? OK.
Posted: Wednesday, December 19, 2012 - 09:55 AM UTC
It is fine the way it is, if you have to click to the second page so be it.
Cheers Rob.
Cheers Rob.
Jacques
Minnesota, United States
Joined: March 04, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, December 20, 2012 - 06:42 AM UTC
Well, as the Moderator, I do like these threads (from time to time) as they give input as to how readers see things. It got me to unsticky my old blogs and make a suggestions to Jim that seems to have his brain whirring. That is a good thing. Don't go getting all uptight now guys...make a suggestion and sit back to see what it inspires. And then go build a T-55 as your penance.