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1967 IDF Magach 2
MichaelHatch
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: June 13, 2013
KitMaker: 31 posts
Armorama: 30 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 01, 2015 - 02:15 PM UTC
Hello.

Here is my latest project, Revell AG's 03206 M48A2C.



This is my second Revell M48 and other than the colour of the plastic, I like these kits. No, they don't have the same level of fine details that the Dragon kits have but they build up easier.



I used a metal barrel because I had it and I'm a fool for metal barrels. The kit's barrel is very nice but it is fixed in elevation.

More photos can be found at
http://s115.photobucket.com/user/Michael_Hatch/library/Modelling%20the%20Arab-Israeli%20Wars/1967%20IDF%20Magach%202

Michael in Cloverdale.

GuyGos
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Netanya, Israel
Joined: April 08, 2013
KitMaker: 71 posts
Armorama: 71 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 01, 2015 - 03:49 PM UTC
Two things:
1.) The early M48s where designated Magach 3, there was never a 2.
2.) Notic the "Y" shaped muzzle of the Israeli M48s. Those were German-supplied tanks and had the same muzzle as the Revell's model.
If you see M48 with the "american" muzzle in affiliation with an Israeli-Arab war than it's Jordanian.
HeavyArty
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Florida, United States
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
Armorama: 13,742 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 01, 2015 - 04:43 PM UTC
Looks like it is coming along nicely. Good job on it and your Magach 3.

According to Brezner, Amiad (December 2008), "Rammed", and other sources, early M48A1s were Magach 1s and M48A2s were Magach 2s. This makes sense. Why would you start a series with Magach 3?

Reportedly, Israel had approx. 150 M48A1s and M48A2s at the start of the '67 Six Day War. After the war, these, and the M48A2s captured from Jordan were all upgraded to Magach 3 standards (replacement of the original 90 mm cannon gun with the British 105 mm L7, lowering the command turret's profile, upgraded communication suite, and replacement of the flammable and weak gasoline engine with a 750 hp diesel engine). By the start of the '73 Yom Kippur War, Israel had approx. 550 Magach 3 and Magach 6 tanks.
rfbaer
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Texas, United States
Joined: June 12, 2007
KitMaker: 1,866 posts
Armorama: 1,696 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 01, 2015 - 10:08 PM UTC
Good info on the Revell kit, thx.
I do have a question, though: does this Revell kit come with the Y-shaped muzzle brake?
Giovanni1508
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Napoli, Italy
Joined: April 17, 2014
KitMaker: 652 posts
Armorama: 600 posts
Posted: Sunday, March 01, 2015 - 10:49 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Two things:
1.) The early M48s where designated Magach 3, there was never a 2.


Hi Guy, this is interesting for me:

According to the book, original M48A2C is the Magach 2.

Magach 3 is all M48A1/A2C/A3 modified (105 mm L7 cannon and so on...)

Do you think this is not correct ?

I'm interested about this matters and sometime I found some confusion looking into the available documentation.

Cheers

Giovanni
GuyGos
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Netanya, Israel
Joined: April 08, 2013
KitMaker: 71 posts
Armorama: 71 posts
Posted: Monday, March 02, 2015 - 02:32 AM UTC
The first M48's where referred as Pattons and the Magach 3 where pattons who were upgraded to A3 standard, with L7 105mm, lower profile TC's cupola and 750hp diesel engine.

As for the Revell kit, 03206 is the one with the correct muzzle.

MichaelHatch
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: June 13, 2013
KitMaker: 31 posts
Armorama: 30 posts
Posted: Monday, March 02, 2015 - 02:39 AM UTC
Hi Guy.

Could you please state your sources in references to Magach naming conventions? I'm going off of the information found in Dr. Manasherob's book “Magach Tanks Of The IDF” volume one. It echos the information in Gino's post.

I went back and checked my photo references about T-shaped and Y-shaped muzzle brakes usages. I must respectful disagree with you. Again using Dr. Manasherob's book and cross checking with Stefan Marx's “The M 48 Main Battle Tank In German Army Service” by the mid 60s the T-shaped muzzle brake was in common use with both the German Army M48A2s and the IDF M48A1 and A2s. I will try to find a good period specific photo of a IDF Magach 2 with the T-shaped muzzle brake for you.

Russel. Yes, the Revell kit, 03206, does come with the Y-shaped muzzle brake.



Giovanni. Has this helped?

Michael in Cloverdale.
SabIngaMartin
Vendor
SABINGAMARTIN PUBLICATIONS
Joined: September 24, 2007
KitMaker: 173 posts
Armorama: 171 posts
Posted: Monday, March 02, 2015 - 03:04 AM UTC
As in my book
Magach 1 is M48A1
Magach 2 is M48A2C

You can build Mahach 2 with T-shape muzzle brake.
However the majority of Magach 2 had the Y-Shape, but there were still enough tanks with T-shape.

The muzzle brake have no contact with the origin of the tank.
Robert

Dr.Robert Manasherob
www.sabingamartin.com
GuyGos
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Netanya, Israel
Joined: April 08, 2013
KitMaker: 71 posts
Armorama: 71 posts
Posted: Monday, March 02, 2015 - 03:28 AM UTC
About the muzzle I've rechecked and admit my mistake there were both T and Y shaped while the T shaped for what I've seen are lesser in numbers.

About the designation I've posted to a group which Michael Mass, curator of the Latrun israeli armor museum, and once he'll answer I'll update.
SabIngaMartin
Vendor
SABINGAMARTIN PUBLICATIONS
Joined: September 24, 2007
KitMaker: 173 posts
Armorama: 171 posts
Posted: Monday, March 02, 2015 - 04:31 AM UTC
No need for such up date (at least for me)

I know what I am talking about and writing in my books

Robert

Dr. Robert Manasherob
www.SabIngaMartin.com

HeavyArty
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Florida, United States
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
Armorama: 13,742 posts
Posted: Monday, March 02, 2015 - 04:43 PM UTC
^^DITTO^^

No further clarification needed for me either.
Giovanni1508
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Napoli, Italy
Joined: April 17, 2014
KitMaker: 652 posts
Armorama: 600 posts
Posted: Tuesday, March 03, 2015 - 02:37 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi Guy.

Could you please state your sources in references to Magach naming conventions? I'm going off of the information found in Dr. Manasherob's book “Magach Tanks Of The IDF” volume one. It echos the information in Gino's post.

I went back and checked my photo references about T-shaped and Y-shaped muzzle brakes usages. I must respectful disagree with you. Again using Dr. Manasherob's book and cross checking with Stefan Marx's “The M 48 Main Battle Tank In German Army Service” by the mid 60s the T-shaped muzzle brake was in common use with both the German Army M48A2s and the IDF M48A1 and A2s. I will try to find a good period specific photo of a IDF Magach 2 with the T-shaped muzzle brake for you.

Russel. Yes, the Revell kit, 03206, does come with the Y-shaped muzzle brake.

Giovanni. Has this helped?

Michael in Cloverdale.


Hi Michael, yes, sure. New informations are always welcome.
Thanks

Giovanni
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