I wonder if we're ever going to see that Quad Bike!
Hisham
Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
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New German Rocket from Bronco?
Hisham
Joined: July 23, 2004
KitMaker: 6,856 posts
Armorama: 6,363 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 08:19 PM UTC
Try to get it right this time
I wonder if we're ever going to see that Quad Bike!
Hisham
I wonder if we're ever going to see that Quad Bike!
Hisham
slug955
Joined: November 10, 2013
KitMaker: 195 posts
Armorama: 175 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 08:44 PM UTC
Could just be a spoiler following Amusing Hobby's announced release. But AH do take a long time to get to Market!!
SgtRam
Contributing Writer
#197
Joined: March 06, 2011
KitMaker: 3,971 posts
Armorama: 2,859 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:01 PM UTC
A very interesting subject, and would be interested in getting one, but with the latest Bronco pricing policies, will more then likely be not worth the purchase.
Also there is some guy on Facebook already claiming Bronco stole it from his resin conversion. Funny how he can even compare when there are no images of the kit plastic yet.
Also there is some guy on Facebook already claiming Bronco stole it from his resin conversion. Funny how he can even compare when there are no images of the kit plastic yet.
Mongo13
Joined: December 02, 2012
KitMaker: 130 posts
Armorama: 57 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:07 PM UTC
It does resemble the conversion from custom scale.
C_JACQUEMONT
Joined: October 09, 2004
KitMaker: 2,433 posts
Armorama: 2,325 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:12 PM UTC
And a Sherman 1/35 kit looks like a Sherman 1/35 kit from another brand, especially on boxart. 
Cheers,
Christophe
Cheers,
Christophe
Hisham
Joined: July 23, 2004
KitMaker: 6,856 posts
Armorama: 6,363 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:16 PM UTC
Quoted Text
And a Sherman 1/35 kit looks like a Sherman 1/35 kit from another brand, especially on boxart
That's what I was thinking... If it's the same launcher or vehicle or whatever, shouldn't it, at least, resemble it?
Hisham
KurtLaughlin
Joined: January 18, 2003
KitMaker: 2,402 posts
Armorama: 2,377 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:24 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Also there is some guy on Facebook already claiming Bronco stole it from his resin conversion.
Quoted Text
It does resemble the conversion from custom scale.
Sigh. If they are both accurate, faithful reproductions of the prototype, they would resemble each other, I'd think.
It's amazing that some people think that once they (or another company) come up with an idea for an oddball resin kit subject, it then becomes a grievous crime against humanity for a manufacturer to release a plastic kit of that subject. Clearly they should own that idea forever, with no plastic kit of the same subject ever released.
I can't see the pictures from this connection but I presume this thread is about Bronco's Rheinbote rocket. Bronco already released a Flak 41, I believe. Is it so incredible to think that they would take the carriage from that kit and add on the launch rails and rocket to produce a new kit, much as the Germans themselves did?
KL
Mongo13
Joined: December 02, 2012
KitMaker: 130 posts
Armorama: 57 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:32 PM UTC
I myself would buy this in plastic. There's no problem with multiple companies producing the same stuff for me. Just means more buying options.
Chuck4
Joined: November 13, 2013
KitMaker: 403 posts
Armorama: 401 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:32 PM UTC
It seems to just be a flak 41 88mm pedestal and mount, which bronco already offer with an actual flak 41 88mm gun, repurposed with a rocket launching ramp.
Not at all surprising bronco would release this regardless of whether anyone did the same thing in resin before
Not at all surprising bronco would release this regardless of whether anyone did the same thing in resin before
deathdork
Joined: March 26, 2007
KitMaker: 314 posts
Armorama: 296 posts
KitMaker: 314 posts
Armorama: 296 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 09:56 PM UTC
out of ignorance is this another prototype example or did it achieve production and actual field use?
slug955
Joined: November 10, 2013
KitMaker: 195 posts
Armorama: 175 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 10:03 PM UTC
It is a shame guys invest time and effort into releasing models in resin no one thought would ever be seen in plastic. Michael Baldeweg (and Cromwell Models years ago) created a market. Whether by design or not Bronco and Amusing Hobby have stepped into that market. Mainstream models of these and other resins will if not kill off but certainly damage the resin folks willingness to invest time and money into new releases. It has always been the case since mainstream plastic producers realised modellers buy more than Panthers, Tigers, Pz IV's and Shermans. I still have the Accurate Armour Maus and E-100 and Dragons prices will soon catch them up!
dhines
Joined: November 17, 2015
KitMaker: 407 posts
Armorama: 373 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 10:11 PM UTC
With the cruciform Flak base already released, it is reasonable that they would come up with other uses for it to maximize their molds. that is just good business sense. I would buy one when it comes out.
brekinapez
Joined: July 26, 2013
KitMaker: 2,272 posts
Armorama: 1,860 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 10:15 PM UTC
Quoted Text
out of ignorance is this another prototype example or did it achieve production and actual field use?
I've only seen photos of it on the long launch rails, but there are drawings of it on the 41 mount so maybe one was built? Don't know 100%.
Buckeyes57
Joined: September 14, 2010
KitMaker: 135 posts
Armorama: 130 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 11:06 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Also there is some guy on Facebook already claiming Bronco stole it from his resin conversion. Funny how he can even compare when there are no images of the kit plastic yet.
Is there a link to this? Sounds like something I would like to read.
slug955
Joined: November 10, 2013
KitMaker: 195 posts
Armorama: 175 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 11:27 PM UTC
This is Michaels site. The same missile was released by Cromwell Models some years ago. HTH.
http://www.customscale.de
http://www.customscale.de
Chuck4
Joined: November 13, 2013
KitMaker: 403 posts
Armorama: 401 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 11:34 PM UTC
Quoted Text
It is a shame guys invest time and effort into releasing models in resin no one thought would ever be seen in plastic. Michael Baldeweg (and Cromwell Models years ago) created a market. Whether by design or not Bronco and Amusing Hobby have stepped into that market. Mainstream models of these and other resins will if not kill off but certainly damage the resin folks willingness to invest time and money into new releases. It has always been the case since mainstream plastic producers realised modellers buy more than Panthers, Tigers, Pz IV's and Shermans. I still have the Accurate Armour Maus and E-100 and Dragons prices will soon catch them up!
Why shouldn't plastic prices catch up to resin prices for subjects that won't sell many copies? There is much higher upfront cost to developing a plastic kit compare to a resin kit?
SgtRam
Contributing Writer#197
Joined: March 06, 2011
KitMaker: 3,971 posts
Armorama: 2,859 posts
Posted: Monday, May 23, 2016 - 11:52 PM UTC
Quoted Text
out of ignorance is this another prototype example or did it achieve production and actual field use?
I have read that some were launched at Antwerp some time in 1944.
slug955
Joined: November 10, 2013
KitMaker: 195 posts
Armorama: 175 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 12:04 AM UTC
Why shouldn't plastic prices catch up to resin prices for subjects that won't sell many copies? There is much higher upfront cost to developing a plastic kit compare to a resin kit?
[/quote]
Errr. Each resin kit is hand made. You may need to produce several to get one that's marketable. You cannot push a button and out pops a kit. Masters have a limited life. I am not a producer but can well imagine the work involved, which makes resins expensive.
[/quote]
Errr. Each resin kit is hand made. You may need to produce several to get one that's marketable. You cannot push a button and out pops a kit. Masters have a limited life. I am not a producer but can well imagine the work involved, which makes resins expensive.
CMOT
Editor-in-Chief
Joined: May 14, 2006
KitMaker: 10,954 posts
Armorama: 8,571 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 12:32 AM UTC
I have added large images of all the details that Bronco has supplied on this model in the news story I just made live. Take a look and it may help you decide whats what.
Chuck4
Joined: November 13, 2013
KitMaker: 403 posts
Armorama: 401 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 12:43 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Why shouldn't plastic prices catch up to resin prices for subjects that won't sell many copies? There is much higher upfront cost to developing a plastic kit compare to a resin kit?
Errr. Each resin kit is hand made. You may need to produce several to get one that's marketable. You cannot push a button and out pops a kit. Masters have a limited life. I am not a producer but can well imagine the work involved, which makes resins expensive.[/quote]
Yes, and the steel or aluminuml injection molds aren't cheap either. If the subject would sell only a few copies, depreciating a metal mold probably translates to comparable per unit cost.
Littorio
Joined: September 15, 2004
KitMaker: 4,728 posts
Armorama: 504 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 12:55 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted Textout of ignorance is this another prototype example or did it achieve production and actual field use?
I have read that some were launched at Antwerp some time in 1944.
There's one of these at the RAF museum Cosford along with some other German AA missiles/rockets.
Chuck4
Joined: November 13, 2013
KitMaker: 403 posts
Armorama: 401 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 12:57 AM UTC
An unguided rocket carrying a 50lbs warhead to a target 150 miles away. Clearly a formula for victory.
slug955
Joined: November 10, 2013
KitMaker: 195 posts
Armorama: 175 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 01:01 AM UTC
Yes, and the steel or aluminuml injection molds aren't cheap either. If the subject would sell only a few copies, depreciating a metal mold probably translates to comparable per unit cost.[/quote]
Plastics producers buy and sell moulds, like Trumpeter bought the Tristar moulds, so must have a good long life. The added costs are labour intensity.
Plastics producers buy and sell moulds, like Trumpeter bought the Tristar moulds, so must have a good long life. The added costs are labour intensity.
brekinapez
Joined: July 26, 2013
KitMaker: 2,272 posts
Armorama: 1,860 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 01:08 AM UTC
The molds for plastic kits can soar north of $50000 very easily, with many crossing the $100K threshold. Most resin molds do not approach that.
slug955
Joined: November 10, 2013
KitMaker: 195 posts
Armorama: 175 posts
Posted: Tuesday, May 24, 2016 - 01:54 AM UTC
You do not seem to grasp the fundamental differences. A plastic injection mould is cut from a CAD drawing. A resin mould is cast in silicon rubber or similar from a master model. The master's life is limited. Here is a link to the creation of a master model by Gert Brandl.
http://www.customscale.de/aktuelle-projekte-und-ideen/paper-tanks-1946-geschützwagen-12-8cm-pak-krupp-auf-panther-fahrgestell/
http://www.customscale.de/aktuelle-projekte-und-ideen/paper-tanks-1946-geschützwagen-12-8cm-pak-krupp-auf-panther-fahrgestell/
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