Яusso-Soviэt Forum
Russian or Soviet vehicles/armor modeling forum.
Opinions on Trumpeter's T-80 variants.
Phil5000
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Posted: Saturday, July 30, 2016 - 03:45 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi, Phil !

Couple of pics

http://cs616720.vk.me/v616720046/a7ee/CodwPsOomzQ.jpg

http://content.foto.mail.ru/mail/gromoleg/184/i-195.jpg

Both are from Chechnya mid 90-s - as you see, these machines are with camo. So to say there could be any kind of colour schemes - ochre/green/black or white/green/black or overall green just as there can be now no matter BV's or U's.
IMHO best way is to choose a pic You like and try to replicate what You see.

Best Regards !

P.S. Important thing about T-80's that people usually forget - they have rubber pads on INNER running surface of the tracks. A lot of models I've seen - people tend to paint them steel especially when using Friul or other metal tracks.



Thanks Dmitry. My Xact T-80U arrived and it looks gorgeous. There is a nice full colour painting guide with three cammo schemes as well as the green, but there is no info at all about which scheme would be appropriate for which unit, period, theater or even if it's Russian or some other country.
Jacques
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Posted: Saturday, July 30, 2016 - 10:53 PM UTC
Period and theater are all the same now. Green is for intial use of the T-80U or the current (2015 - )change from cammo back to green, which is slowly happening.

Units are hard to find for the T-80U. Notable units, in the past, were the 2nd Guards Tamanskaya Motor Rifle Division in Moscow and the 4th Guards Kantemirowsk Motor Rifle Division in Naro-Fominsk (SE of Moscow).

All of the cammo schemes shown in the instructions were fielded by the Russian Army on at least one tank. Things were in flux with the Russian Army in the 1990's. Green, tan, black is the most common one I have seen.
DmitryMarkov
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Posted: Sunday, July 31, 2016 - 12:20 AM UTC
Hi, Jacques !

Actually, Kantemirovskaya Division was practically always a Tank division rather than Motor Rifle one ;-)

And it was and it remains the main user of U's even now.

So if you wish to build a T-80U, choose a pic of one from 4-th Guard Kantemirovskaya Tank Division ( better use a cyrillic 4-я Гвардейская Кантемировская Танковая Дивизия ) and there would be a happiness for you :-)

( these ones for example :
http://bmpd.livejournal.com/1160717.html )

And please don't be stuck to some boxart ( especially Xact one) - better rely on real photos and either mix the paints yourself or use AK or MiG dedicated paint set.

Best Regards!
Jacques
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Posted: Thursday, August 04, 2016 - 02:18 AM UTC
Thanks Dmitry. It is hard for me to get perfectly accurate information on military units now, so I will assume your information is correct over mine.

You say the 4th is the main user of the -U right now. All reports I have access to about Russian Tank usage seems to indicate that only a very few of the T-80BV or T-80U are in limited use. I would love to be wrong, but is there any way to confirm that the T-80U, for example, is in large scale use currently? Any help you can provide would be appreciated.
Phil5000
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Posted: Friday, August 05, 2016 - 03:52 PM UTC
Hi again guys,

So I've had a good look at both my new T-80 kits now. The Xact T-80U looks great and I can't wait to get cracking on it. But the Trumpeter T-80BV has an issue I'm not happy with. The headlight guards are way thick and only rounded on one side. The T-64A that I've just done had the same thing (wish I'd remembered that little detail). I cut the bars off and attempted to fashion some out of copper wire, with limited success. They look ok from the front but not the top so I planned to cover the top of them with a cam net. The T-80's headlight guards would be more difficult and I can't very well have two models with suspiciously placed cam nets. So I think I'll be shelving the BV until I figure out what to do about it.

If anyone is keen on the Xact T-80U you can get them from Hobbyeasy. A bit pricey but looks to be worth it.
Jacques
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Posted: Saturday, August 06, 2016 - 06:10 AM UTC
Phil, don't know if you have seen this: X-ACT Scale T-80U review
Phil5000
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Posted: Sunday, August 07, 2016 - 08:43 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Phil, don't know if you have seen this: X-ACT Scale T-80U review



I hadn't Jacques, I read one on Modelling News. Shame about the faults you mentioned, the turret, gun and tracks but I'm not all that fussed. The tracks look fine to me. Perhaps they have updated them since you built yours.
Phil5000
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Posted: Sunday, August 07, 2016 - 08:51 AM UTC
Hi guys,

Does anyone have the Trumpeter T-72B/B1, and could you tell me what the headlight guards are like? Are they the right thickness and rounded on both sides? Its a newer kit so I'm hoping they've improved on them since the T-64A and T-80BV. The parts are E25 and E26.

I just saw this kit on an unboxing video yesterday and I'm leaning toward this one instead of the Meng T-72B3 and the Trump T-80BV. Its got the ERA so will look different to my other T-72, I can use the figures I want to use and paint it cammo. And I have one T-80 so another T-72 would be ok.

http://www.1999.co.jp/eng/10307266
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0c-se5uGWco&list=WL&index=29
Phil5000
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Posted: Wednesday, August 10, 2016 - 07:36 AM UTC
Never mind guys. I sold my T-80BV and bought the T-72B/B1. Would prefer the T-80 but the T-72 looks to be the better kit.

Thanks everyone for your help. Its been fun chatting about this. None of my friends are modellers so its nice to have people to talk to about it.
Phil5000
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Posted: Tuesday, August 16, 2016 - 11:25 AM UTC
Hi guys. My T-72B/B1 came today and wow what a beast of a kit. The box is much thicker than any other armour kits I've done, and you open it up you see why. There are so many parts. I admit to feeling a little intimidated by it, but I consider myself a serious modeller and so I will tackle this challenge with confidence. Its going to be a serious undertaking but it will be all the more satisfying when its done.

Removed by original poster on 08/22/16 - 22:07:51 (GMT).
DmitryMarkov
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Posted: Monday, August 22, 2016 - 09:39 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Thanks Dmitry. It is hard for me to get perfectly accurate information on military units now, so I will assume your information is correct over mine.

You say the 4th is the main user of the -U right now. All reports I have access to about Russian Tank usage seems to indicate that only a very few of the T-80BV or T-80U are in limited use. I would love to be wrong, but is there any way to confirm that the T-80U, for example, is in large scale use currently? Any help you can provide would be appreciated.



Kto na eto dast otvet, tot poluchit desyat' let :-)
This means "the one who gives an answer to this, will receive ten years" spoken in a verse form ;-)

Being seriously, there are no ways to obtain such info - it's classified more or less.

Best Regards
Dmitry
Jacques
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Posted: Thursday, August 25, 2016 - 09:02 PM UTC
Exactly. That is the biggest problem when modeling the T-80U outside of Russia. I understand. Better safe than 10 years.


Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Thanks Dmitry. It is hard for me to get perfectly accurate information on military units now, so I will assume your information is correct over mine.

You say the 4th is the main user of the -U right now. All reports I have access to about Russian Tank usage seems to indicate that only a very few of the T-80BV or T-80U are in limited use. I would love to be wrong, but is there any way to confirm that the T-80U, for example, is in large scale use currently? Any help you can provide would be appreciated.



Kto na eto dast otvet, tot poluchit desyat' let :-)
This means "the one who gives an answer to this, will receive ten years" spoken in a verse form ;-)

Being seriously, there are no ways to obtain such info - it's classified more or less.

Best Regards
Dmitry

Augusta
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Posted: Friday, October 07, 2016 - 02:47 PM UTC
Hello guys,

I read somewhere, the T-80's were in use during the chechen war. So Russians made a lots of improvments on the new T-90MS Tagil to match battle feedbacks, especially about the ammo compartment and protection.

But the question is about the T-80's. I would like to buy and make a T-80BV during the chechen war, with russian soldiers on the vehicule on the move during a winter time.

So I have in mind to buy the T-80B from trumpeter ref 05565, the PE sets from Voyager ref PE35654 (for T-80BV) and additional ERA bricks to show the 4 layers on the skirt and 1 more layer on the upper skirt to protect the fuel tanks ref PEA220 or PEA205 (if I remember the correct number is 172 bricks).

So do you think by buying the T-80B and not the T-80BV is correct (V meaning wearing ERA)?

Now about the tracks with or without rubber?

Last question the "skirt" on the front lower hull, for what purpose is it?
RobinNilsson
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Posted: Friday, October 07, 2016 - 03:25 PM UTC
"Last question the "skirt" on the front lower hull, for what purpose is it?"

I could imagine two purposes or combination of both:
1: eliminate the very dark shadow beneath the "bow" of the tank since this dark spot reduces the efficiency of the camouflage, both in the visible spectrum and in infrared (warm tank glacis over a cool shadow over warm ground)
2: reduce the efficiency of some anti-armour weapons, same as skirts on the sides of the tank

/ Robin
Jacques
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Posted: Friday, October 07, 2016 - 09:11 PM UTC
Skirt on the front was used as stand off armor, the same as the side skirts. It was not simple rubber.

As for the kits, neither one will give you a correct T-80BV because of the armor issue on the front glacis. You will not be able to fix it unless you change the area around the drivers hatch and add the 2 cheeks. SO...just buy the T-80BV and go from there OR wait until a correction set or new kit come out. All you would really need to fix it is the hull of a T-80U, but that may be a bit pricey since the ONLY T-80U kit is Xact Scales. You could always buy both kits and put the Trumpeter T-80BV turret on the Xact Scale T-80U hull to make a proper T-80BV (late).
DmitryMarkov
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Posted: Sunday, October 09, 2016 - 06:10 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hello guys,

Now about the tracks with or without rubber?

Last question the "skirt" on the front lower hull, for what purpose is it?



Tracks of T-80's have rubber pads on the inner side - so it has rubber road wheels bandages rolling over rubber track pads. Combined with turbine's qualities it allows the T-80 to be the quietest armoured vehicles among those I've heard.

The "skirt" has double purpose: it serves both as stand-off armour and it helps to move road dust away from air intakes. Considering dusting is inevitable, creators of T-80 went to TSAGI institute and tested the hull in aerodynamic tube searching for the best position of air intakes where they would "eat" the least possible amount of dust. According to the legend, when TSAGI engineers (used to deal with aviation) saw what the guys from Leningrad brought with them, there was quite a dialogue:
- What's that?
- A tank with a turbine!
- Why did you brought it here? Is it considered to be sort of flying?
- Shure, it is a flying tank! ;-)

However, the other measures of anti-dust protection were also needed, - that's how the "skirt" appeared.


Quoted Text

You could always buy both kits and put the Trumpeter T-80BV turret on the Xact Scale T-80U hull to make a proper T-80BV (late).



Jacques, sorry but I've never had a chance to see any photo of T-80BV with a T-80U-style glassis (with built-in ERA) in Chechnya. If you could share one, I would be grateful. On the other hand, I've seen T-72 combined from T-90 style hull with built-in ERA and T-72B-style turret. But I don't keep that photo.

Best Regards!
Dmitry
Jacques
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Posted: Sunday, October 09, 2016 - 06:20 PM UTC
T-80U and T-80BV use the same standard hull. This has the integrated upper front glacis armor (so it had the "cheeks" on each side of the drivers hatch) but the T-80U has the K-5 glacis armor, not the K-1. My understanding is that all hatches under the hull are the same on both vehicles as well. But this is described as T-80BV (late: post 1984) hull/T-80U standard production hull. So the T-80BV in Chechnya have the same lower hull as the T-80U.

I checked both the Xact scale kit and Trumpeter kit. You cannot easily put the Trumpeter T-80B turret on the Xact Scale kit hull...the Xact Scale kit hull turret "opening" is quite a bit larger. Oh well, easy fix is now not so easy.
DmitryMarkov
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Posted: Sunday, October 09, 2016 - 06:51 PM UTC
Jacques, K-5 is integrated but K-1 is attached on brackets. If I get You right - Your point is to use only base hull parts from Xact not attaching K-5 installation ( C3 part) and use K-1 from Trump / MiniArm ? - if so, than it makes sense.
Jacques
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Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 05:27 AM UTC
Correct. But the Xact scale turret ring is much larger than the Trumpeter turret ring, so that is a problem that would have to be overcome. I know Trumpeter is going to come out with the T-80U and T-80UD sometime, so I will just wait for that.

Honestly, the biggest problem is just that upper front glacis. I may spend the winter trying to figure out a fix and have SP Designs cast it for all those Trumpeter T-80BV kits.
DmitryMarkov
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Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 01:47 PM UTC
I've heard that Xact has an issue with an angle of glassis as well. I've already started Xact kit so I'll build it despite of all it's shortcomings. But I also wait for Trumpy's T-80U. If it will be any better than Xact - I'll build it too - you cannot have too many T-80's :-)

As for BV - I'll try to visit one and measure those "cheeks" with a roulette ( maybe this weekend) - I doubt those would be too hard to make out of Miliput or Evergreen or else.
M4A1Sherman
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Posted: Monday, October 10, 2016 - 02:56 PM UTC

Quoted Text

I've heard that Xact has an issue with an angle of glassis as well. I've already started Xact kit so I'll build it despite of all it's shortcomings. But I also wait for Trumpy's T-80U. If it will be any better than Xact - I'll build it too - you cannot have too many T-80's :-)

As for BV - I'll try to visit one and measure those "cheeks" with a roulette ( maybe this weekend) - I doubt those would be too hard to make out of Miliput or Evergreen or else.



Since I haven't heard any more about Xact doing the Ukrainian T-84 "Oplot", does anyone think that TRUMPETER may produce it in future..?
grunt136mike
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Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 - 06:15 AM UTC
Hi;

I Think it was already discussed that Trumpy; was about to announce the T-84 when they released pic's of A Vehicle that was suppose to be A Surprise. from looking at the Sprue shot's it sure looked like the OPLOT to Me !
"Man" It sure would be Fantastic, if they released the OPLOT, & the BULAT at the Same Time !!

CHEERS; MIKE.
M4A1Sherman
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Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 - 03:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi;

I Think it was already discussed that Trumpy; was about to announce the T-84 when they released pic's of A Vehicle that was suppose to be A Surprise. from looking at the Sprue shot's it sure looked like the OPLOT to Me !
"Man" It sure would be Fantastic, if they released the OPLOT, & the BULAT at the Same Time !!

CHEERS; MIKE.



How about a "Black Eagle"..?
Platycqb
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Posted: Tuesday, October 11, 2016 - 05:40 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Honestly, the biggest problem is just that upper front glacis. I may spend the winter trying to figure out a fix and have SP Designs cast it for all those Trumpeter T-80BV kits.


So I guess, the fix is more than just adding the 2 cheeks around the driver's hatch?