So, this is a bit of a quandary for me. I was chatting with a friend about all the Cold War Soviet stuff is out there...and I thought a "what if" diorama of a moment during the fighting in West Germany would be something a bit different.

Vehicles are no problem. But troops and crew? That's turned into a bit of a mess. No problem getting tank crews in appropriate summer gear. But infantry? No such luck

There's the old Dragon/DML figures--but they're in winter clothing. There's a new set of ICM figures...in winter clothing! So what to use for infantry, c. 1984?

Any thoughts out there? I've not been able to find something suitable. There are some nice early Chechnya figures in summer gear, but don't think that'd work for 1984.

Cheers,

Tim W.

Have you forgetting about tamiya's modern US Infantry ?

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Have you forgetting about tamiya's modern US Infantry ?

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I think he is refering to Soviet Infantry since any of the Dragon/DML US ODS figure sets would work as US infantry in the '80s as well.

For summertime Soviet infantry, Dragon did a couple sets that would work. You might want to change out the helmets/heads, but that is about it.

VDV Air Assualt Troops


Tamiya also recently reboxed/combined a couple ICM sets that would work too.

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Have you forgetting about tamiya's modern US Infantry ?

---

I think he is refering to Soviet Infantry since any of the Dragon/DML US ODS figure sets would work as US infantry in the '80s as well.

For summertime Soviet infantry, Dragon did a couple sets that would work. You might want to change out the helmets/heads, but that is about it.

VDV Air Assualt Troops


Spetznaz


Tamiya also recently reboxed/combined a couple ICM sets that would work too.

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Have you forgetting about tamiya's modern US Infantry ?

---

I think he is refering to Soviet Infantry since any of the Dragon/DML US ODS figure sets would work as US infantry in the '80s as well.

For summertime Soviet infantry, Dragon did a couple sets that would work. You might want to change out the helmets/heads, but that is about it.

VDV Air Assualt Troops


Tamiya also recently reboxed/combined a couple ICM sets that would work too.

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I like your thinking! I have those sets. I'll ditch the winter sets (use them for Afghanistan or something in future) and kludge the VDV and Tamiya sets, maybe use some Tank figures I have, too.

Right now I have an up-armored T-62 and BTR-70 (not everybody had the good stuff in 1984). Or I can use BMP-2 and T-80.

Thanks again!

Tim W.

For most of us Cold War modellers there is indeed a paucity of good figures; assuming you want action poses (as opposed to what I call "hanging around the tank park" figures) the pickings are still a bit lean. There are the Tamiya 2 x Modern US Infantry sets referred to by Nick and don't forget the Dragon "Paratroops" set which depicts Bundeswehr airborne figures - in action poses - with body armour and NBC suits - the latter of course conceivably quite appropriate for any "What If" scenario.

If you want decent Soviet figures then I don't see much option other than to modify and convert the various WW2 figures of which there are many energetic sets. First you'll need to modify the collar, discarding those figures moulded with a greatcoat over the shoulder (far too much sanding), make your own respirator cases, ammo pouches, etc, then replace the weapons. For c.1984 you'll really need some AK 74s but other than a rare set of Lo Models Motor Rifles Infantry which came with a couple of rifles (the figures were hopeless), I'm not sure where you'll find those. If you set your plans a little earlier of course then the Italeri Modern Weapons set - recently re-released, will provide endless AK 47s.

I have modified some Soviet figures using Milliput or Magicsculpt and even I, ham-fisted individual that I am, managed to make a fair representation of a Soviet camouflage smock, but it's the tedious ammo pouches, straps etc which suck the fun out of it all.

You should be able to utilise - for other NATO nations - the Dragon Gulf War figures easily enough: the British "Desert Rats" set depicts figures in NBC suits (though not masks) and are quite useful; that said, you may have to backdate the webbing for 1984 which will not be a small task as per above (!)

Dragon also make of course several Modern Soviet sets, Motor rifles, Spetznaz and Airborne, but they are not especially combative, though they lend themselves to being modified of course, and will yield up useful weapons.

Lastly, if you do go down the route of modifying and sculpting, remember the useful Hornet Heads.

Good luck with whatever you devise!

Brian

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Have you forgetting about tamiya's modern US Infantry ?

---

I think he is refering to Soviet Infantry since any of the Dragon/DML US ODS figure sets would work as US infantry in the '80s as well.

For summertime Soviet infantry, Dragon did a couple sets that would work. You might want to change out the helmets/heads, but that is about it.

VDV Air Assualt Troops


Tamiya also recently reboxed/combined a couple ICM sets that would work too.

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I like your thinking! I have those sets. I'll ditch the winter sets (use them for Afghanistan or something in future) and kludge the VDV and Tamiya sets, maybe use some Tank figures I have, too.

Right now I have an up-armored T-62 and BTR-70 (not everybody had the good stuff in 1984). Or I can use BMP-2 and T-80.

Thanks again!

Tim W.

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Tim,

I actually think that by 1984 GSFG was pretty much re-equipped with the Good Stuff viz T64, T72,and as you note, T80; personally, I would go, as you hint at, T80, and BMP 2. Of course, T62 would still have been found in any follow-on, 2nd echelon forces I'm sure, so I suppose it depends on what you wish to depict and as it is a What If/Might Have Been, what the hell?!

BTR 80 would be appropriate as well.

I hasten to add I'm no expert and during my service was only on the periphery of the Intelligence world, though I did find it fascinating.

'Looking very forward to what you come up with.

Brian

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For most of us Cold War modellers there is indeed a paucity of good figures; assuming you want action poses (as opposed to what I call "hanging around the tank park" figures) the pickings are still a bit lean. There are the Tamiya 2 x Modern US Infantry sets referred to by Nick and don't forget the Dragon "Paratroops" set which depicts Bundeswehr airborne figures - in action poses - with body armour and NBC suits - the latter of course conceivably quite appropriate for any "What If" scenario.

If you want decent Soviet figures then I don't see much option other than to modify and convert the various WW2 figures of which there are many energetic sets. First you'll need to modify the collar, discarding those figures moulded with a greatcoat over the shoulder (far too much sanding), make your own respirator cases, ammo pouches, etc, then replace the weapons. For c.1984 you'll really need some AK 74s but other than a rare set of Lo Models Motor Rifles Infantry which came with a couple of rifles (the figures were hopeless), I'm not sure where you'll find those. If you set your plans a little earlier of course then the Italeri Modern Weapons set - recently re-released, will provide endless AK 47s.

I have modified some Soviet figures using Milliput or Magicsculpt and even I, ham-fisted individual that I am, managed to make a fair representation of a Soviet camouflage smock, but it's the tedious ammo pouches, straps etc which suck the fun out of it all.

You should be able to utilise - for other NATO nations - the Dragon Gulf War figures easily enough: the British "Desert Rats" set depicts figures in NBC suits (though not masks) and are quite useful; that said, you may have to backdate the webbing for 1984 which will not be a small task as per above (!)

Dragon also make of course several Modern Soviet sets, Motor rifles, Spetznaz and Airborne, but they are not especially combative, though they lend themselves to being modified of course, and will yield up useful weapons.

Lastly, if you do go down the route of modifying and sculpting, remember the useful Hornet Heads.

Good luck with whatever you devise!

Brian

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Whew. You make it sound arduous! I do have quite a few sets of various DML sprues for the VDV--mixing the gear with the new MiniArt "1970s Russians" riding in a truck would give me decent figures with the older gear. Or modify VDV to make them more 80s looking with camo smocks.

And then I found a set of ICM East Germans. That would be different. Have to think about the composition of this one--definitely a "pausing for orders" set up, maybe at a road crossing with signs to Fulda. Thought about doing a built up area--that'd be more work and pretty sure there aren't to many German road signs etc for the modern era. OK, I consider the 80s modern! I'm old!


TW

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For most of us Cold War modellers there is indeed a paucity of good figures; assuming you want action poses (as opposed to what I call "hanging around the tank park" figures) the pickings are still a bit lean. There are the Tamiya 2 x Modern US Infantry sets referred to by Nick and don't forget the Dragon "Paratroops" set which depicts Bundeswehr airborne figures - in action poses - with body armour and NBC suits - the latter of course conceivably quite appropriate for any "What If" scenario.

If you want decent Soviet figures then I don't see much option other than to modify and convert the various WW2 figures of which there are many energetic sets. First you'll need to modify the collar, discarding those figures moulded with a greatcoat over the shoulder (far too much sanding), make your own respirator cases, ammo pouches, etc, then replace the weapons. For c.1984 you'll really need some AK 74s but other than a rare set of Lo Models Motor Rifles Infantry which came with a couple of rifles (the figures were hopeless), I'm not sure where you'll find those. If you set your plans a little earlier of course then the Italeri Modern Weapons set - recently re-released, will provide endless AK 47s.

I have modified some Soviet figures using Milliput or Magicsculpt and even I, ham-fisted individual that I am, managed to make a fair representation of a Soviet camouflage smock, but it's the tedious ammo pouches, straps etc which suck the fun out of it all.

You should be able to utilise - for other NATO nations - the Dragon Gulf War figures easily enough: the British "Desert Rats" set depicts figures in NBC suits (though not masks) and are quite useful; that said, you may have to backdate the webbing for 1984 which will not be a small task as per above (!)

Dragon also make of course several Modern Soviet sets, Motor rifles, Spetznaz and Airborne, but they are not especially combative, though they lend themselves to being modified of course, and will yield up useful weapons.

Lastly, if you do go down the route of modifying and sculpting, remember the useful Hornet Heads.

Good luck with whatever you devise!

Brian

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Whew. You make it sound arduous! I do have quite a few sets of various DML sprues for the VDV--mixing the gear with the new MiniArt "1970s Russians" riding in a truck would give me decent figures with the older gear. Or modify VDV to make them more 80s looking with camo smocks.

And then I found a set of ICM East Germans. That would be different. Have to think about the composition of this one--definitely a "pausing for orders" set up, maybe at a road crossing with signs to Fulda. Thought about doing a built up area--that'd be more work and pretty sure there aren't to many German road signs etc for the modern era. OK, I consider the 80s modern! I'm old!


TW

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Tim,

The ICM East Germans are quite an excellent set I think, not least as they're not engaged in warfighting, which to my mind, makes them very useful. It's also easy enough to add their helmets to make them look a little more warlike. They would also benefit from an NBC suit which I recall was carried above an assault pack, all easy enough to modify.

Regarding road signs etc, have a look at the items produced by this firm:

https://www.dio-factory.com/shop/dioramenzubehör-dio-factory/modelle-1-35/

I especially like the telephone kiosk.

There are also some road signs appropriate for the US sector on the side of one of the Tamiya boxes but at the moment I can't recall which one; whilst on card, once mounted on plastic rod or similar and varnished they should work.

One last thing - I was totally wrong about using the Dragon Desert Rats set from the Gulf War - helmets, webbing and weapons would all be wrong for 1984, so scratch that idea!

'Hope this helps - I'm almost considering doing something similar.

Brian

So, this is a bit of a quandary for me. I was chatting with a friend about all the Cold War Soviet stuff is out there...and I thought a "what if" diorama of a moment during the fighting in West Germany would be something a bit different.

Vehicles are no problem. But troops and crew? That's turned into a bit of a mess. No problem getting tank crews in appropriate summer gear. But infantry? No such luck!

There's the old Dragon/DML figures--but they're in winter clothing. There's a new set of ICM figures...in winter clothing! So what to use for infantry, c. 1984?

Any thoughts out there? I've not been able to find something suitable. There are some nice early Chechnya figures in summer gear, but don't think that'd work for 1984.

Cheers,

Tim W.

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So, this is a bit of a quandary for me. I was chatting with a friend about all the Cold War Soviet stuff is out there...and I thought a "what if" diorama of a moment during the fighting in West Germany would be something a bit different.

Vehicles are no problem. But troops and crew? That's turned into a bit of a mess. No problem getting tank crews in appropriate summer gear. But infantry? No such luck!

There's the old Dragon/DML figures--but they're in winter clothing. There's a new set of ICM figures...in winter clothing! So what to use for infantry, c. 1984?

Any thoughts out there? I've not been able to find something suitable. There are some nice early Chechnya figures in summer gear, but don't think that'd work for 1984.

Cheers,

Tim W.

---

I was thinking of getting together a quick guide for this one day. Half way there though.

You are looking at 1969/73 uniform regulations. The '88 regulations came (for VDV) in 1985 and was primarily for units in Afghanistan, so "Russian soldiers in Chechenya" won't be accurate. Your best bet is modifying WW2-figures, as they are close in terms of uniform. Only catch is the Ssh-68 helmet and it's iconic shape. TANK did some a few years ago, I found them on Ebay. AK-74, as mentioned above, was standard for riflemen.

This would be accurate for Motor rifle (mech. infantry with BTR or BMP) in 1984.


Note: The one on the right is a "combat load".

Also, the belt buckle should be brass, as they were more common than the ones in OD.


Quite common to see coloured shoulder and collar tabs, as the field uniform and Everyday/walking-out uniform was the same (like regulations said it should have been 2 issued uniforms, but the army only issued 1. So soldiers didn't bother changing the tabs).
Though it depends on the situation, sudden outbreak of war - coloured tabs, prepared outbreak - OD. Point is, you're at some liberty here.

Awesome! Thanks for the tips. I was trying to find photos of Soviet troops in Germany in the 80s, but by far most of what I could find was either "modern," e.g. stuff happening now or Afghanistan-related (since that was a hot war).

There's an ICM set that has all the right gear. I can modify WW2 or other figures for poses (see link).

http://armorama.kitmaker.net/review/10789

Too bad Dragon/DML didn't do their motor rifle troops in summer gear!

Cheers and thanks all for the ideas,

Tim W.

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Awesome! Thanks for the tips. I was trying to find photos of Soviet troops in Germany in the 80s, but by far most of what I could find was either "modern," e.g. stuff happening now or Afghanistan-related (since that was a hot war).

There's an ICM set that has all the right gear. I can modify WW2 or other figures for poses (see link).

http://armorama.kitmaker.net/review/10789

Too bad Dragon/DML didn't do their motor rifle troops in summer gear!

Cheers and thanks all for the ideas,

Tim W.

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That set is the most accurate for 1984.
Just note that the driver is a truck/car driver. BTR and BMP crew would dress in infantry uniform, but wear a tankist helmet instead of a regular helmet. Same for officer, in vehicle, he would wear the same helmet.

Hornet got this set:


http://www.hornetandwolf.com/Hornet/headsets/PAGES/HRH04.htm

Also, in case you want more accuracy, the AK magazine puoches are different for AKM (3-cell pouch) and AK-74 (4-cell pouch), but the figures' pose makes it impossible to tell, so you can easily swap the AKM for AK-74 without anyone noticing. It was also standard to have the bayonet w/scabbard attached to the belt, between the grenade pouch and belt buckle.

Thinking of using the T-62 BDD Mod 84 and a BTR.

I know the 62 may not be 100%, but this is a what if.

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Thinking of using the T-62 BDD Mod 84 and a BTR.

I know the 62 may not be 100%, but this is a what if.

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Well Tim, I found this apposite quote from David C Isby's "Weapons & Tactics of the Soviet Army" from 1988:

"The technical significance of the T-64/72/80 follow-on series should not obscure the fact that the T-62 and T-54/55 will also be met wherever the Soviet Army is engaged".

That would be enough for me!

Brian

I also like this figure. An oldie, but a goodie.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Verlinden-1-35-Soviet-APC-Armoured-Personnel-Carrier-Crewman-WWII-509-/171112280875

Work has begun on the BTR.

TW

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I also like this figure. An oldie, but a goodie.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Verlinden-1-35-Soviet-APC-Armoured-Personnel-Carrier-Crewman-WWII-509-/171112280875

Work has begun on the BTR.

TW

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Wow, nice figure, haven't seen it before. The Ebayer got it wrong, that's not WW2, but '69/'73 regulations. The shoulder boards and field bag (contains maps and orders) hanging on his left hip makes him an officer, as that field bag was only issued to officers, from lieutenant and above.