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Another Sherman or two..
thebear
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 09:36 AM UTC
I haven't got much done yet but I thought I'd show what I've got done so far ..the first is the Formation M4A2 on the Academy Achilles kit and the second is the Formations M4A1 with appliqued armor ..
you can see I filled in two air bubbles at the bottom ..No big deal here...

The toughest part was the joint between the hull and the transmission cover ...I could have used a third hand here but it came out pretty good...

I added the engine deck and gas caps ..I've started to add the chains to the pins..

I've gouged the rubber on the road wheels with a file while sanding them ,I've added two strips of styrene and drilled the four bolt holes ...

I've thinned out the skids and added the bolts ..

I added some dents to the deflector on the back end.

Got a bit more done on my M4A1 the turret is pretty well finished and some of the hull details have been added ...


I've painted the inside of the hull black and added some screen under the exhaust

I added the bolts that are missing from the Italeri hull.Also I made the Tamiya drive sprocket fit .
And last I've built up the bogies using the Formations part italeri arms and wheels from Academy.

So let me know what you think..

Rick
GunTruck
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 09:56 AM UTC
I like 'em both Rick! And you are right - we're right at the same stage in building too. This is fun! I don't have the Formations Models M4A2 conversion for the Academy kit - does it go together as well as their conversion for the Italeri kit?

Gunnie
thebear
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 10:08 AM UTC
I tell you the front end is tough ,but it can be done ..Things are pretty well lined up but it wasn't easy..I almost gave up and used the Academy part but I made it . The rest of the kit is just like the M4A1 ..Beautiful!! Okay Rob made one mistake but I'm not telling anyone ...lol (not really his fault)

Rick
TreadHead
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 10:12 AM UTC
Howdy thebear,

Thx for the post, I'm just lovin' your pics. I have read only good things about Formations products. And I have been seriously considering trying out a few of them because of their reviews. But I would really like to know specifically what is so good about them?
From the photograph's they appear well moulded, but is there an inclusion of items/accuracy that elevates them?
I'm also getting a kick out of your bogey pics. I have been wanting to do a photo/build up article on super detailing the Tamiya Sherman bogies, but have hesitated because of so many better informed 'Shermanholics' out there that I would be concerned about putting my size 10 1/2's in my Boca!
From looking at the photo (5th one down) of the bogey from the side showing your completed unit, I can see that the arm has better detail on the end section, but there are also two bolts on the underneath side that I cannot see from the angle of the shot. There are also four bolts on the inside of the arm (to the left of your pic) that hold the arm to the main casting. Also, aren't there depressions and additional bolt heads at the base of each of the wide groove's on the front of the main casting?
How did you add "dents" to your resin deflector?

Your early 'small' hatch M4A1hull is sweet looking. I especially like the applique armour, but the weld beads look a tad oversize to me (but what the heck do I know). Also, on the right side of the A1 (eighth pic down), is that double split weld seam accurate? I'm trying to remember if the vertical one was there or not.....
Nice added bolt detail to the Italeri hull.

And lastly (I'm probably becoming a pest), are you planning on thinning out the front leading edge of the fenders?

Again, thx for the dandy pics........I needed a Sherman fix!

See what you guys have done to me!!!

Tread.
thebear
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 10:32 AM UTC
Hi Thread Hmmm lets see if I can answer all these questions...I'm trying to figure out which bolts are what ..I did add 4 bolts inside the part holding the return roller. The three bolts are there on the Academy bogeys I think it is just the angle...but I'M not sure about the other two bolts that you are talking about ... You might be right but I'm not too sure which ones you are talking about...
As for the weld beads ..Maybe a bit thick but I like em..I've seen these types of weld marks.
The deflector is part of the achilles kit and was heated and the eraser from a pencil was used to deform the plastic.
And last but not least I really think it is the angle of the picture cause my fenders are paper thin..you can see through them in the light ..
Thanks for all the kind words.

Rick
TreadHead
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 11:24 AM UTC

Quoted Text

"... Hi Thread ...I'm trying to figure out which bolts are what ....but I'M not sure about the other two bolts that you are talking about ... You might be right but I'm not too sure which ones you are talking about..."


Here's a photo of the bolts on the underside of the arm I was talking about. The Tamiya arm (as moulded) really doesn't have enough room to accomadate two bolt heads, so you have to add a small piece of additional sheet to build it out.

In this photo you can also see the four bolts that mount the arm to the main cast piece.

Tread.
WeWillHold
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 12:34 PM UTC
Rick

Your usual solid work here again.

Nice suspension 101 pics, with the detailing. The bolts and thinned skids are a nice touch.

The deflector dents--heat?? or if not, how did you do them?

Also, what are you using for your bolt heads?

Please keep us posted as you move through these builds.

Steve
andy007
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 12:49 PM UTC
looking very very good Rick, I am glad you have shared these pics with us. Those formations kits sure look good. What is the price for the Marines M4A2 conversion?
csch
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 09:14 PM UTC
Hi thebear:

Great job you got going on there. Those Formations kits really looks very good. I think that I will try with an Early M4A1 Conversion.
Congrats.
tazz
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 10:24 PM UTC
hi rick, its comeing out really nice.
i like all the little deatils u added.
i like what u did to the boggies.
cant waite to see more pics
TreadHead
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 10:33 PM UTC

"...Also, aren't there depressions and additional bolt heads at the base of each of the wide groove's on the front of the main casting?
..."

If you look at the center of this pic, you can clearly see the "depressions w/ boltheads" I spoke of......



Tread.
thebear
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Posted: Monday, August 16, 2004 - 11:41 PM UTC
Oh those bolt heads ...Nope didn't do them ...Yet! I was going to do them next...(yeah sure I was... ) I'll see if I can find bolts small enough to add there...As for the indentations at the bottom of the bogey ..I've never seen that before on any other Sherman.Strange!?!? The four holding the return roller assembly are there though... What I used for the bolt heads is the smallest hexagon shaped piece of styrene strip that i found at my local hobby shop and I just cut them off with my exacto knife chosing the ones that look the right thickness and then sanding them all even after I finished. Steve I just heated it with a lighter and dinged it up with the eraser from a pencil.
Andy I think it cost me about $55.00 U.S plus shipping but it is worth every bit of it ...I got the Tarawa parts for mine but you could also get the ordinary kit which will easily be made into a Commonwealth vehicle ....
Thanks for the kind words all ...Now I'm off to play golf for the day ...FOUR!!! or is that FORE? I'll be back tomorrow ...

Rick
TreadHead
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Posted: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 - 07:54 AM UTC
Howdy Rick,

I know I'm being a bit anal about this whole 'bogey' thing, but in the case of the Sherman, the bogies are so visually dominant compared to just a set of multiple road wheels like german steel (not much you can do to 'accurize' a disc of metal).
For what it's worth, the photo I provided is from an M4A3, and was very kindly provided to me by our own Hollowpoint when I was looking for some bogey detail pics. In fact, the author of the base article from whence the photos came, removes the plastic skids entirely and replaces them with bent flat stock brass.
I just felt that was unneccessary, because a 'thinning' of the provided plastic skids works just dandy!
And, regarding the three bolts in the 'depressions'. I have a technique I use that replicates that very well, and you don't have to place bolt heads in there either.
I can elaborate if you are interested, if not...I understand.
Also, for the bolt heads. I use Grandt Line bolt/rivet heads. And I can't say enough good things about them! I have tried using hex rod stock cut with my Xacto, and it always looks like some carnival clown decided to get into the hardware business.....but then, maybe I'm getting too anal again.

regards,

Tread.
TreadHead
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Posted: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 - 08:02 AM UTC
One more thing...

in this photo
of your excellent bogey work. In each wheel, towards the outer edge, at the base of wide, indented 'groove' of the wheel spokes. There should be two small bolt heads on the outer rim as well (for a total of twelve per wheel ).
Here's a pic of what I'm talking about.....


Tread.

You can start throwing heavy, sharp thing's at me now if you wish....
generalzod
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Posted: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 - 05:41 PM UTC

Quoted Text


And, regarding the three bolts in the 'depressions'. I have a technique I use that replicates that very well, and you don't have to place bolt heads in there either.
I can elaborate if you are interested, if not...I understand.
Also, for the bolt heads. I use Grandt Line bolt/rivet heads. And I can't say enough good things about them! I have tried using hex rod stock cut with my Xacto, and it always looks like some carnival clown decided to get into the hardware business.....but then, maybe I'm getting too anal again.

regards,

Tread.


Tread
I'd be real interested on that depression technique Do those bolts line up with those nuts at the bottom?
Hollowpoint
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Posted: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 - 07:54 PM UTC

Quoted Text

For what it's worth, the photo I provided is from an M4A3, and was very kindly provided to me by our own Hollowpoint when I was looking for some bogey detail pics.


Ack! Tread -- You ain't pinning this all on me!

Actually, there was quite a bit of variation among different bogey makers. The Squadron M4 Walkaround book shows several different kinds, and this page shows some online: http://www.lares.dti.ne.jp/~nadhi/sherman/sus/sus.html

Here's one that's different:

And another (on the same tank, BTW):

And yet another:

Note the different foundry marks, mold seams, etc., yet they all serve exactly the same function. I would think those bolt holes, facing upwards as they do, would have filled up with mud, dirt and debris pretty quickly.I've never bothered to add them, but on a fairly pristine, factory fresh tank, I'm sure they would be visible. I wouldn't count the omission of the holes as an "error" on any kit's bogies -- it's one of those things you could add or skip, in my opinion.
TreadHead
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Posted: Tuesday, August 17, 2004 - 10:12 PM UTC


Quoted Text

"...Ack! Tread -- You ain't pinning this all on me! ..."


Ha!.....I love it. Bob says something like that, and then he provides us three (3) additional pics!!
.......heheheee...

Many, many thx Bob for the additional site as well. Just more Sherman 'candy'.
I guess I just based my interpretation/version of the Sherman bogey on the one provided in the Tamiya kit. If you look closely at the tamiya bogey, there is a pretty obvious upward slope where those three 'depression' bolts would be. And from appearance's in your three provided photos, the slope is not there, that area is actually flat. That is why I chose to go the other route. Now, I don't know if the Academy bogies have the sloped type or not.

Tread.

Oh, also. Thanks for the picture showing the greasing 'zert'. Another accurizing item.

between the upper spokes on the inside of the wheel rim...
thebear
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Posted: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 - 12:38 AM UTC
Thanks Bob ..I was about to go searching for pictures of other bogeys because I had never seen any with those depressions so obvious before..Had I been sleeping all these years?? As for the bolts around the rims ...ehhhhh...I think there will be enough dirt and grime around my wheels that they won't be missed . I will be ordering the new wheels from TMD for a future project. Hey it's nice to see everyone here trying to get it right..I LIKE IT! I use Grantline bolts all the time but for these I wanted flat bolt head without a bolt sticking through...So I went with the rod instead...I just cut enough that I pick and choose the ones that look right the rest go in the trash. Sure Tread I'd love to hear more about your technique ..I just might have a go at that type in the future.

Rick
Hollowpoint
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Posted: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 - 01:30 AM UTC

Quoted Text

If you look closely at the tamiya bogey, there is a pretty obvious upward slope where those three 'depression' bolts would be. And from appearance's in your three provided photos, the slope is not there, that area is actually flat. That is why I chose to go the other route. Now, I don't know if the Academy bogies have the sloped type or not.


Like I said, the various castings have a lot of variety. Some will have the slope, some not. (All of this is part of a vast conspiracy to keep Tread confused -- but you did not hear that from me )

Now Tread's worried about tiny rivets around the rim and zerts! My God ... I've created a rivet counter! Next thing you know, he'll be trying to build those Model Kasten Sherman tracks with 20 parts per link ... we'll get a note from his wife telling us she found him in a pool of super glue with PE and microscopic bits of hex rod and GrandtLine bolts scattered about ... what have I done?????
SS-74
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Vatican City
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Posted: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 - 02:04 AM UTC
Lord Rick,

Awesome works on the shermans, although I am not a sherman expert, but I do recon the great work there which is your usual high standard.

I am doing a Sherman too. LOL. just something OOB and simple to get me back the armor lane.

Cheers

thebear
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Posted: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 - 03:25 AM UTC
Yep Bob I think you've done it ...I thought I was bad ..lol :-) ..Confusing these funny little green things aren't they... I must admit that I did miss the two tiny little bolts holding the return roller though ...I don't know if I have anything small enough for them...we'll see ..
Dave glad to see you getting in on this Sherman build ...hey if you need any info or spare parts just ask ...It'll be my pleasure if that all it takes to get you back into the Armor models..

Rick
TreadHead
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Posted: Wednesday, August 18, 2004 - 09:41 AM UTC

Quoted Text

"...Hey it's nice to see everyone here trying to get it right..I LIKE IT!..."


Indeed.


Quoted Text

"... I use Grantline bolts all the time but for these I wanted flat bolt head without a bolt sticking through...So I went with the rod instead..."


I understand Rick. But, what I do for places where I don't want any threaded rod sticking out is; When I place the rack of Grandt Line boltheads down on my cutting surface (a block of REN shape), I simply cut off the little piece sticking out before I slice the bolthead off the tree. Then I take the remaining bolthead and apply a microscopic drop of glue (via a special plastic bottle with a hypodermic needle applicator I picked up at Caboose Hobbies) on the underside and gently put in place......


Quoted Text

"...Sure Tread I'd love to hear more about your technique ..I just might have a go at that type in the future...


No problem. I will try to put something together.




Quoted Text

"...(All of this is part of a vast conspiracy to keep Tread confused -- but you did not hear that from me )..."


LMAO!!!!! :-) :-) :-) .....seeeeeee, I knew you guys were up to something!!


Quoted Text

"...Now Tread's worried about tiny rivets around the rim and zerts! My God ... what have I done?????..."


:-) :-)

You are indeed the 'Witche's Brew' Bob!........

Tread.
thebear
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Posted: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 - 04:30 AM UTC
Okay guys I'm slowy getting this Sherman ready for painting I've added some PE and most of the main build is finished ..I've still got a few tools to add and I just finished scratch building the Jerry can holder on the back but that was after these pictures ..For Tread I added one bolt instead of two cause I didn't feel like redoing the whole return roller mount but at least one is there .

I told you the bolts were there..hehehe

I've added some details to the front ...The guards are from an old Verlinden kit with solder wire and Aber chains for the plugs.

I've added grab handles and springs to the hatches still need some adjusting and the locking straps too.
[imghttp://www.nutsnbits.com/rcraig/Dsc01057-zoom.jpg[/img]
Some of the details up close ..I've made the welds from putty...as before the chain is from Aber and the plug was made with a punched out circle and a grant line bolt added to the top of it . This is an extremly close shot ...looks better in real life ..lol

Here are some of the tools added ..A bit hard to remove from their backing but look awesome once on the kit. Still have a few to add.

And last but not least some of the chains added to the fuel caps ..again these are from Aber.

Enjoy and as always your comments are welcome ..Good or bad ...

Rick
USArmy2534
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Posted: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 - 09:50 AM UTC


Here is the missing link (heh pun...I'm on a role tonight).
The overall detail looks supurb, though I'd hope it would as its a resin and PE set and it must have cost you a mortgage payment and then some. You might want to realign the above hatch, however I'm guessing its not already glued down - at least at the time of this picture. Also, please don't tell me you coiled the spring yourself. I for some weird reason decided it would be fun to do it on my Sherman and it took forever - but it was fun
Jeff
ex-royal
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Posted: Tuesday, September 07, 2004 - 09:54 AM UTC
saaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaweet. Rick I love all the work you've done mate. Really nice!!!! I have one of these in my stash...I really should drag it out. I have some QMD decals for it too
Cheers,
Bryan
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