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Armor/AFV: Modern - USA
Modern Armor, AFVs, and Support vehicles.
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M151A2 MUTT Help
jimb
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New York, United States
Joined: August 25, 2006
KitMaker: 2,539 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 - 03:33 PM UTC
I have a Tamiya M151A2 MUTT on my workbench (ok, i's been in progress since 1986, but who's counting), and I have some painting questions. This is going to be a 1980s era MUTT from either the 3AD or 2ID. So my first question is: what color should the under carrage be? Green? My second question is: what is the best way to paint the tires? The instructions say Flat Black, but that seems a little dark for 1/35. My last question (for now) is: is the Eduard M151A2 photo-etch good for a photo-etch first timer?

Thanks in advance!

Jim
landy
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England - South West, United Kingdom
Joined: October 30, 2005
KitMaker: 2 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 20, 2007 - 07:53 PM UTC
hello
i tend to use german grey for my tires or tamiya nato black
which is a litttle less dark.not sure about mutt undersides
but military vehicles tend to be coverd in base protection
like an underseal,then they get coverd in crud[ mud ,dust]
hope this is of some use
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 12:03 AM UTC
There's an old Eduard etch set for the Tamiya or Academy M151. That's a pretty good primer for a new modeler. I think it added a new dash board, front bumper and the antenna guard. Try bending the front bumper before cutting the plastic bumper off. If you mess it up, you still have the plastic one in place.
m75
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California, United States
Joined: July 20, 2002
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Posted: Thursday, June 21, 2007 - 04:09 PM UTC
The M151 series trucks were painted one color at the factory. Depending on the year of manufacture, that could have been semi-gloss OD (24087?) for 60s through late 70s, then a switch to the dark flat green that also formed one of the base MERDC colors. It was easier to paint them at assembly. The repair parts were also painted in the appropraite color for the time of manufacture as well. That's why an NOS part from a package on the 1:1 scale truck might not be the same color as the restored truck the part will be applied to.

I can't call them MUTTS, as I never heard that term until Tamiya released their kit in 1980 or so. It's always been the M151 1/4 ton truck. By the way, most of them were out of service by the early 1980s, replaced by the HMMWV truck line, so choose your markings appropriately!
CaptainA
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Indiana, United States
Joined: May 14, 2007
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Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 12:15 AM UTC
Ditto the German Gray for the tires. Then I use MIG black smoke, light mist of clear flat, and if it looks to black, some dust colored pigments and another mist.
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
Armorama: 9,071 posts
Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 01:37 AM UTC

Quoted Text

The M151 series trucks were painted one color at the factory. Depending on the year of manufacture, that could have been semi-gloss OD (24087?) for 60s through late 70s, then a switch to the dark flat green that also formed one of the base MERDC colors. It was easier to paint them at assembly. The repair parts were also painted in the appropraite color for the time of manufacture as well. That's why an NOS part from a package on the 1:1 scale truck might not be the same color as the restored truck the part will be applied to.

I can't call them MUTTS, as I never heard that term until Tamiya released their kit in 1980 or so. It's always been the M151 1/4 ton truck. By the way, most of them were out of service by the early 1980s, replaced by the HMMWV truck line, so choose your markings appropriately!
I agree that I never heard them called MUTTs. We called them Jeeps or quarter tons.

I disagree on the time frame of their use though. The M151A2 soldiered on throughout the 1980s and were not fully replaced in Germany until 1989 when the last division there (8th Infantry) finally received HMMWVs. There were many stateside active units that did not receive them until the USAREUR units were fully fielded. I recall seeing stateside active Army units that did not deploy to Desert Shield/Desert Storm finally receive HMMWVs after the Gulf War.
blaster76
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Texas, United States
Joined: September 15, 2002
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Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 08:20 AM UTC
Late 70's ours were painted OD all over. We did the cammo (MERDC) ourselves and ditto the MUTT thing...never heard of it until model building. Just like the M-8 not the Greyhound (Heard that from a guy that ran them during the war) and of course the 251 Hanomag. I thnk Tamiya just likes to make up interesting names to put on the boxes
jimb
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New York, United States
Joined: August 25, 2006
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Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 08:59 AM UTC
Thanks for all the help guys. I appreciate it.

Now, let me see if I have this straight: tires should be German Grey or NATO Black (appropriately weathered) & vehicle body (inside, outside & underneeth) should be Flat Dark Green. Since I don't own an airbrush the MERDC camo job os probably out. Don't quite know how to do that with a spray can! An allover green M151A2 would be late 1970s early 1980s, so the soldiers should be in the OD Green uniforms, not BDUs. Good. Don't think I can paint BDUs yet. Lots more practice!

If I ever finish this thing before my 2 year old graduates college, I'll post some pics. Don't hold your breath though.

Thanks again!

Jim
casailor
Joined: June 22, 2007
KitMaker: 165 posts
Armorama: 97 posts
Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 08:59 AM UTC
M151 A1's and A2's all came from the factory OD Green. When the MERDEC camo was authorized they were all painted by the using units using templates for each specific vehicle type. There were either 3 or 4 basic color combinations based on deployment plans, not where the unit was stationed. I was at Fort Carson, but we were designated for European deployment so our colors were the dark woodland scheme. The bottom of vehicles always were the basic color from the factory- no one would bother to paint something that couldn't be seen. Also touch-up colors often varied widely from lot number to lot number. The only thing we ever called them were Jeeps.
casailor
Joined: June 22, 2007
KitMaker: 165 posts
Armorama: 97 posts
Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 09:01 AM UTC
Just an addendum, MERDEC was a hard edged scheme so brush painting it in 1/35 would work well. I use Floquil Grimy Black for tires.
m75
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California, United States
Joined: July 20, 2002
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Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 04:16 PM UTC
I agree with casailor regarding the brush painting. Although the Training Circular for applying the camo pattern strongly recommended spraying the pattern, resulting in a generally soft edge, many units used what they had (lower enlisted personnel with brushes and a lot of free time!) and would free-hand the patterns with paint and brush. Since there was a formula for each application as to what color provided what percentage of coverage for each vehicle, most of those that were sprayed usually had the small amount of black applied as the last color, by brush. Trying to tighten up the spray equipment for such a relatively small area, by personnel not usually trained to do so, resulted in not a few re-paint jobs when the black paint would get out of hand. Unfortunately, I speak from experience. When done correctly, the MERDC patterns were very attractive. When done otherwise, yeah, a track would look like garbage even from a distance.....

Please provide some in-progress photos of your 1/4 ton.
Manchu34
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Missouri, United States
Joined: March 08, 2002
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Posted: Friday, June 22, 2007 - 05:11 PM UTC

Quoted Text

This is going to be a 1980s era MUTT from either the 3AD or 2ID. So my first question is: what color should the under carrage be? Green? My second question is: what is the best way to paint the tires?
Jim


First off, throughout my 21 years (75-96) in the army, the under carrige was always black. Now, as far as when they got replaced. I was with the 7 Infantry Division (Light) and our Jeeps didn't start to get replaced until early 1986. Furthermore, when the division was deactivated in 1993 we still had some jeeps still in units.
jimb
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New York, United States
Joined: August 25, 2006
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Posted: Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 04:22 AM UTC
The camo was applied at the unit level by guys with sprayers & brushes? That gives me an idea! Whe you guys were doing this, were you wearing BDUs or Pickle Suits (uniform wise, that is)?

Jim
desertfox42
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Texas, United States
Joined: September 05, 2005
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Posted: Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 05:19 AM UTC
it will be a single color. on the tires I use an acrylic base and then airbrush with Gunze Soot. it has a slight "pearl" appearance similar to the Carbon Black in rubber tires
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
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Posted: Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 05:24 AM UTC

Quoted Text

The camo was applied at the unit level by guys with sprayers & brushes? That gives me an idea! Whe you guys were doing this, were you wearing BDUs or Pickle Suits (uniform wise, that is)?

Jim
Both for a while. We painted ours with spray guns, but a hand brush painted Jeep was not uncommon. And the types of brushes used were similar to the cheap house paint brushes you can buy at Wal-Mart.
iowacentral
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Iowa, United States
Joined: April 15, 2007
KitMaker: 121 posts
Armorama: 115 posts
Posted: Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 07:35 AM UTC
I am in the final stages of a M151A2. I applied the MERDC camo using a brush. When I apply this camo again, I am going to get the paint a little thinner. Also, Life Color has released a set of acrylics in NATO MERDC colors.
Scott
jimb
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New York, United States
Joined: August 25, 2006
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Posted: Saturday, June 23, 2007 - 03:16 PM UTC
Life Color? Never heard of it. Where can you get it?

Jim
iowacentral
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Iowa, United States
Joined: April 15, 2007
KitMaker: 121 posts
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Posted: Sunday, June 24, 2007 - 03:39 AM UTC
I got mine ot the my local hobby shop. I have also got them from great models. They recently released two weathering kits that the guys around here really like.
Scott
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