_GOTOBOTTOM
Armor/AFV: Modern - USA
Modern Armor, AFVs, and Support vehicles.
Hosted by Darren Baker
Abrams questions
kpz4ever
Joined: August 27, 2007
KitMaker: 7 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 08:02 AM UTC
Hi all!

As I'm totally new to this forum, maybe some words as introduction. My name is Stefan Liess and I'm running a smaller website called http://www.kampfpanzer.de, it's just about tanks. Currently I'm redoing my chapter about the M1, as it does not contain the level of information I would like to have. I have some books and also some of my own experience gathered with the Louisiana NG in Fort Polk. My other practical experience is more Leo2a4 based.

So while writing my M1 article I came across this nice website and I found it extremely interesting to read here. Therefore I thought I could address some of my open questions. I will start slowly :-)

1. With the m1 there was a small metal plate added to the gun mantlet, wich was not there with the prototypes. I've read somewhere that it is a search light mount, but was never used. Any idea?
2. Was the loader's control panel already mounted with the original M1 or did it come with the M1A1? In the Hunnicut book there is a picture which is supposed to be the M1 and iz does not have the control panel mounted.
3. Again Hunnicut. It also says that the commander's control panel has been introduced with the M1A1. So who had the master power switch with the M1, was it the driver?
4. I have seen some reason pictures of .50 cal machine guns mounted on top of the main gun in Iraq. This is not TUSK yet, but what is it?

Thanks for your hep!
Stefan
Erik67
Visit this Community
Buskerud, Norway
Joined: July 31, 2005
KitMaker: 1,871 posts
Armorama: 1,423 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 08:24 AM UTC
Hello Stefan and welcome to the site.
Unfortunatly I can only answere your forth question:

Quoted Text

4. I have seen some reason pictures of .50 cal machine guns mounted on top of the main gun in Iraq. This is not TUSK yet, but what is it?



It is the CSAMM system (COUNTER-SNIPER/ANTI-MATERIEL MOUNT). More info and pics here .

Erik
crockett
Visit this Community
Ohio, United States
Joined: February 04, 2005
KitMaker: 370 posts
Armorama: 302 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 10:37 AM UTC
I'll have a go at one thru three...

1. I think you are referring to the mount for the (training) .50 cal. which was attached to the gun shield. .50 cal tracer was used as a sub caliber main gun live fire simulator to save ammunition and maximize training time. At no time did any M1 variant have a searchlight...TIS from day one. You can just see it here on the gun shield:



2. The loaders control panel was moved ...different location between M1 and M1A1....but it has always been there, arming switch and indicator lights.

3. The TC control (box / panel) is located to his right near the commanders override cadillac control. Unlike the M60's, the TC has always had a master power switch on the M1's, along with the driver.


regards,

Steve
Tankrider
Visit this Community
Oklahoma, United States
Joined: October 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
Armorama: 1,208 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 11:00 AM UTC

Quoted Text

1. I think you are referring to the mount for the (training) .50 cal. which was attached to the gun shield. .50 cal tracer was used as a sub caliber main gun live fire simulator to save ammunition and maximize training time. At no time did any M1 variant have a searchlight...TIS from day one. You can just see it here on the gun shield



Steve is talking about the Telfare Device, developed by SGM Telfare at Ft Knox to use a M2 as a training device on the gunnery range. I have seen two types of mounts, one that used the mounting points on the mantlet and a later one that clamped to the 105 mm gun bore evacuator.

Got a story about that later model Telfare Device, a ARNG LTC, a M60A3 and a Report of Survey...

John
210cav
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: February 05, 2002
KitMaker: 6,149 posts
Armorama: 4,573 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 11:47 AM UTC

Quoted Text

[
Got a story about that later model Telfare Device, a ARNG LTC, a M60A3 and a Report of Survey...

John



John-----would you share this interesting story with us? Personally, I am dying to hear this one.
DJ
Tankrider
Visit this Community
Oklahoma, United States
Joined: October 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
Armorama: 1,208 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 12:32 PM UTC
Stefan,
Sorry to divert the thread but here it goes...

Disclaimer: I have worked with and went to war with some outstanding ARNG Soldiers, NCOs and Officers. The guy below was a knucklehead before he was a member of the ARNG...

It was right before I came to work for you/D/10 Cav in 1988. We had a TR supporting a ARNG run gunnery. As usual, we provided M60A3s and technical assistance in the way of TCEs, if needed, but the ARNG guys declined our guys. Well, they started with subcal gunnery. Somehow, they decided to clamp the Telfares to the rear thermal shroud instead of the proper place on the bore evacuator. after noticing the wrong placement during a maintenance visit, my guys tried to correct them, but were told "we know what we are doing, get off of my range" Well, I went out to Cedar Creek Range and tried to speak with the OIC (I was the acting troop commander atthe time) and was basically told to "pound sand, we will do what we want" by LTC Knucklehead. Famous last words. I thought, "we will see when you try to give those tanks back" and wrote up statements. When turn-in time came, we did a quick report of survey on several thermal shrouds, mantlet covers and a couple other odds and ends,got a signature from the troop commander, who when told the story, was hot enough to, well, you know, then passed it to Henry E. Hodge the Third, who promtly signed the ROS and handed to LTC Knucklehead. who yelled, screamed and pouted but in the end, paid for the replacement parts. Fun times in the 12th Cav during the late 1980's. Things picked up in the fall, when I got to D/10 Cav but you already know that story...

John
kpz4ever
Joined: August 27, 2007
KitMaker: 7 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 09:47 PM UTC
Hi all!

Thanks for the replies. To be totally clear for my first question, here the thing I'm refering to:



Are there any nice pictures around for the M1 loader and commander positions showing the control panels?

Thanks!
210cav
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: February 05, 2002
KitMaker: 6,149 posts
Armorama: 4,573 posts
Posted: Monday, August 27, 2007 - 11:32 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Stefan,
Sorry to divert the thread but here it goes...

Disclaimer: I have worked with and went to war with some outstanding ARNG Soldiers, NCOs and Officers. The guy below was a knucklehead before he was a member of the ARNG...

It was right before I came to work for you/D/10 Cav in 1988. We had a TR supporting a ARNG run gunnery. As usual, we provided M60A3s and technical assistance in the way of TCEs, if needed, but the ARNG guys declined our guys. Well, they started with subcal gunnery. Somehow, they decided to clamp the Telfares to the rear thermal shroud instead of the proper place on the bore evacuator. after noticing the wrong placement during a maintenance visit, my guys tried to correct them, but were told "we know what we are doing, get off of my range" Well, I went out to Cedar Creek Range and tried to speak with the OIC (I was the acting troop commander atthe time) and was basically told to "pound sand, we will do what we want" by LTC Knucklehead. Famous last words. I thought, "we will see when you try to give those tanks back" and wrote up statements. When turn-in time came, we did a quick report of survey on several thermal shrouds, mantlet covers and a couple other odds and ends,got a signature from the troop commander, who when told the story, was hot enough to, well, you know, then passed it to Henry E. Hodge the Third, who promtly signed the ROS and handed to LTC Knucklehead. who yelled, screamed and pouted but in the end, paid for the replacement parts. Fun times in the 12th Cav during the late 1980's. Things picked up in the fall, when I got to D/10 Cav but you already know that story...

John



John-- good old Hank Hodge...man among men. I thought he was the clown you intially referred to.
DJ
kpz4ever
Joined: August 27, 2007
KitMaker: 7 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 07:22 AM UTC
Good evening!

I guess I simply continue with my questions:

5. I understand that the AIM program is completely rebuilding the M1A1 to brand new conditions. Does it also include any new tools/equipment or is that then only part of the later SA program?
6. The M1A1 delivered to Australia are supposed to the simple AIM tanks plus some aussi extras. When I look at the tank I can see a metal box added to the right side of the gunner's primary sight which is supposed to be a GPS antenna. Is taht correct? If so, why is it on board and why there on the sight?
7. an I say that the M1A2SEP is being made by upgrading existing M1A2 or is it based on older vehicles?
8. Now that the M1A1D is gone out of service, is the same thing planed for the M1A2 (not SEP) or will it stay?

Thanks!
Tankrider
Visit this Community
Oklahoma, United States
Joined: October 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
Armorama: 1,208 posts
Posted: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 08:02 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Good evening!

I guess I simply continue with my questions:

5. I understand that the AIM program is completely rebuilding the M1A1 to brand new conditions. Does it also include any new tools/equipment or is that then only part of the later SA program?
6. The M1A1 delivered to Australia are supposed to the simple AIM tanks plus some aussi extras. When I look at the tank I can see a metal box added to the right side of the gunner's primary sight which is supposed to be a GPS antenna. Is taht correct? If so, why is it on board and why there on the sight?
7. an I say that the M1A2SEP is being made by upgrading existing M1A2 or is it based on older vehicles?
8. Now that the M1A1D is gone out of service, is the same thing planed for the M1A2 (not SEP) or will it stay?

Thanks!



5. New Equipment??? What kind are you talking about?? The AIM tanks will have Blue Force Trackers added to the vehicles to provide the SA . I do not believe that they have FLIR sights and the other goodies, like the SEPs. There are improvements inside of the tank IRT the electronics as well as the Pulse Jet System is added to the engine if it was not present before rebuild.

6.The GPS Antenna should be on the back of the turret, in front of the cross wind sensor. The antenna next to the GPS should be the BFT antenna.

7. The original SEPs were upgraded M1s. I would imagine that the plain A2s would be upgraded into SEPs... Makes too much sense not to upgrade the A2s as the hard part is already done with the CITV and related electronics.

8. I seem to remember that seeing someplace that the tank fleet was going to become A2 SEPs and AIMs/HC/HA tanks.

DJ,
I did not always see eye to eye with Hank but I certainly would not dime him or you out here - maybe just razz you a bit... LTC Knucklehead's attititude also got him POed, so he went along with the RoS and its findings. The ARNG Advisior on MG Tait's staff was a bit outraged that we were tagging LTC K but after hearing the whole story, he fell into line also.

John
kpz4ever
Joined: August 27, 2007
KitMaker: 7 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 09:11 AM UTC
Thanks again!

But again, I'm a bit confused about the BFT now. My understanding is that this technology is part of the Situation Awareness upgrade. BFT is used to identify friendly units as part of the FBCB2. So if the aussi M1A1 received the BFT, do they also use the FBCB2 or can I use the BFT also stand alone? Is it just a simple IFF?

Regards
Tankrider
Visit this Community
Oklahoma, United States
Joined: October 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
Armorama: 1,208 posts
Posted: Tuesday, August 28, 2007 - 02:41 PM UTC
FBCB2 & BFT are basically the same system. The BFT uses a satellite constellation to relay its signals while FBCB2 uses EPLARS - that third thick antenna, located on the right rear of the turret on a HC, AIM or A2 or A2 SEP tanks. There are also some software differances between the two systems and an patch is required (well, at least in late 2005/early 2006 - my experiences in Iraq) to let the two systems communicate with each other.

John
kpz4ever
Joined: August 27, 2007
KitMaker: 7 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Wednesday, August 29, 2007 - 05:07 AM UTC
Thanks for that!

But is it really that all HC and AIM tanks gave that EPLARS antenna? Do they then also have the FBCB2 CID? Or do they only have the antenna with some sort of transmitter added that gives the position? I have also seen some information regarding the USMC using FBCB2 with the tanks. Have the M1A1 already been upgraded or will that be part of the FEP?

Regards
kpz4ever
Joined: August 27, 2007
KitMaker: 7 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Wednesday, September 05, 2007 - 10:13 PM UTC
Hi all!

Found more questions, this time about the Block-g modification. According to official documents it should contain a "Manual Blaster". What is that? How was the gunner'S station improved during the modifications and what is the contained battlefield override?

Thanks!
 _GOTOTOP