Hi guys, I've been watching some of the Iraq war footage and on the road to Baghdad, I thought I saw an old M577 Command post APC, are they still in use or did I see wrong #:-) ? I'm sure you's can tell me. Many thanx Kenny.

yep

Agreed, there were several heading through the berm behind Ted Koppel a couple weeks ago.

It's amazing to see how many M-113s are still out there, at least with that one group of reporters. I suppose we should keep in mind that with those reporters you're seeing the war though a "soda straw."

Nate
Wisc. USA

The M577: hard to replace a TOC vehicle as usefull as that one. And remember, medics, engineers, smoke generators, etc, still use the venerable 113. I think it was just recently that the old FSITV 113 was replaced with a Bradley based rig.

The last I knew (fairly recently) the M113 FOV is still in production, and still in wide-spread use not only with the US Army, but others as well.

It is STILL the most numerously produced AFV (ever?) in the western world.... STILL going very strong some 40 years on....some 80,000 to 100,000 units.

I just love it!

I too was amazed to see a 577 as the command track for a Bradley unit!

I would have thought they would have enough M1A4 command versions to equip front line units.

need money for all those brand new TOC's, and it looks like they may have an excuse to get them after ODS II. Maybe even modernize the whole army on Abrahms/Bradley chassis...although, they may be holding back orders because of the new interim "Light" brigades, with the LAV III's. Gotta pay for those too...

As ever, the US Army at Battalion level and below half what it needs...nice to see things don't change.

Up until a few months ago, the M113A3 was still competing against the Stryker for a place in the U.S. Army's "Transformation Force."

Who knows? The M113 APC may go on to be like "Ma Deuce" -- the Browning .50 calliber machine gun that has lasted about 70 years -- and I saw blasting at Republican Guard just this evening.

The M577 has been brought up to A3 standards as well as an updated variant called the M1068. They will be around for decades to come. Why waste money on a new platform when the old one does just fine. Besides with the MLRS chassied C2V coming into the picture the front line forces will have some top notch equipment.

So how hard a conversion is it from the kit M577 to the 1068?

Nate
Wisc. USA

Hey Sabot,

I was just reading in the new Concord Bradley book that the C2V is expected to replace ALL M577 varaints at the 2 C2V for 4 M577 level. Does this jive with any info you have from the inside?

Well heres the interesting part.When the war first started and the 3rd ID did the slingshot move,the reporter for Fox news that is embedded with the 2nd Brigade had amazing footage of the op.The guy was in a hummer right being the Brigade commander which in turn was in a M113A3.It wasnt a M577 but just an A3 with a bunch of communication antennas.That was what bugged me for a while.Even my dad thought it was an old M577 until we figured out what it was.

I was surprised to see M113's in Iraq....the ones I saw were medical: I guess it's for the Republican Guard! LOL! If there's any left.

While this statement is probably accurate (I haven't heard the fielding plan), the deployment of M577s is not always in neat little packages of two or four. For instance, the medical platoon in an armor or infantry battalion has 2 M577s. One is the battalion aid station and that is located in the combat trains, the other is normally along a main supply route (MSR) where the ambulance exchange point (AXP) is located. A soldier wounded on the front line is evacuated to the aid station by the medics M113, he is stabilized there and then continues to the AXP. The patient is then transferred to a M997 HMMWV ambulance and brought to the medical company (C Co.) of the forward support battalion (FSB) in the brigade support area (BSA). It would kind of be hard to split the capability of 2 M577s with one C2V.

I STILL FIND IT INTERESTING THAT PEOPLE THINK THE M113 IS OUT OF FRONTLINE SERVICE! It is the primary means of transportation for combat engineers, tank/BFV mechanics, and medics and "M113-looking" variants like the 120mm mortar carrier and smoke generator carrier are still in use. From a distance they look like M113A2s and A3s since they all have a common chassis. Our brigade commander had a fully decked out M113A3 so he could fight the battle while the TOC (tactical operation center) moved forward. Our ALO(air liaison officer) also rode forward in a specially equipped M113A3 that could talk to CAS (close air support) and direct their munitions.

If you want to snoop and scoot along the battlefield, nothing in our inventory is as good as an M113.

I agree except for the M981...god what a piece of crap. Sorry Sabot, we HATED those damned things. We came up witha replacement that we would field if in war...First, dismount all necessary equipment, next, thermite grenade to the engine...Mu HA HA HA!

THen we would mount the GLID (and Yes I know it is not spelled like that) to the back of a Hummer pickup...you know, the one with the stake bed. Then we could scoot and call fire WITHOUT having to go 15mph, or flip the damned thing over if we took a sharp turn at speed.

But they have the BFIST now, and I think all is good with the world. I guess we all just had way too mcuh light infantry in us to apprecaite the M981 #:-)

Just an interesting little side bar to the M113 FOV discussion. My dad was in charge of support for those vehicles at TACOM since 1991. That form in the back of the manual for repair questions, went right to him. He started out their revising/updating the repair manuals. The Kuwaities have been buying 113's and their variants like penny candy since 1993....your going to see that chassis around for a looooong time. You wouldn't belive how many 113 variants I had built for him! (Tamiya and Acadamy owe me a Christmas card!) I can build those kits blindfolded. Alot of them still sitting on desks in Warren! Things to make u go "hmmmmmmmmmm".

Having done some XO time ain an HHC of an armor battalion, we had the Fisters in our motor pool. Yes, those things and the M901s were royal pains. I would imagine the Vulcans too. Too much weight on that little 113. Our FIST team had troubles keeping up with our M1A1s.

In '90 we had one M577 as FDC track for each of the 2 4.2' mortar sections in our armor battalion. I know the M106 is gone but they might still have the FDC vehicle. Should be same in mech battalion.

Paul