Hi everyone
I was just wondering, did the Polish troops at Monte Cassino wear the same uniform and equipment as their British counterparts? Any pictures would be very useful. Thanks, Nick

Come on guys, someone must know???? Nick

As far as I know, yes they did!

Martin

Hi Martin
Ok, thank you very much for your help. Nick

I guess they were wearing british uniforms in Italy.
From Normandy to the Netherlands i know for sure they did wear british uniforms.
There is one feature thats typical for Polish soldiers.
They did not only wear the british mark II helmet but also occasionaly the rimless steel helmet like the ones british tank crews wear.
Don't mistake this helmet with the british paratrooper one.
This helmet had a single chin strap like a normal helmet.

I hope that you can do something with this information.


Frank.

Hi Frank
Ok, thanks very much for your help. Definetly useful about the helmets. Nick

Hi Nick

As you've already been informed - the soldiers of the II Korpus Polski did wear 'British' kit.

Are you intending to model soldiers from a specific unit? You mention Monte Cassino, so I'd assume you may be consider the men of either the 5 Kresowa Inf Div, or the 3 Strzelcow Karpackich Div. In both cases BD would have been the norm - either serge or denim depending on the weather conditions. Many photos also show soldiers wearing wooley- pullies, and/ or the leather jerkin. It was also common for soldiers to acquire local clothing - my own grandfather wore an Italian Army issue black leather (tankers) jacket/ coat for the second part of the Italian Campaign. He also used other bits of captured Italian kit - a M1928 poncho cape; I guess/ assume that stocks of this type of foul weather kit were captured and issued.

I hope that helps.

Cheers

Karol

Hi Karol
I have the Bronco staghound and want to do it in the paint scheme and markings of the:

'12th Polldlian Uhlans Reconnaissance Regiment 3rd Carpathian Infantry Division Italy 1944'

Having
looked them up (at the end of the battle paragraph) it appears that they were present at Monte Cassino and so would like to do a dio involving these guys with some infantry aswell as the staghound.
Very intersenting about your grandfather and the 'non standard' kit!!
Thanks for your help, Nick

Two examples of Battledress as worn by Polish Troops, from the old Munbury site-pics are gone now so you can see they wore Polish rank markings and insignia. Maybe Karol
can tell us which units they are.
One other thing I've noticed is that Polish troops wore their berets very differently to British troops.

Polish troops wore their berets and general service caps pulled down to the back as opposed to pulled down to the right.
Hornet has a couple of sets that have a beret/GS cap pulled or worn back in a similar manner:

http://www.greenwichgateway.com/hornetandwolf/Hornet/headsets/pages/HBH04.htm

http://www.greenwichgateway.com/hornetandwolf/Hornet/headsets/pages/HQH04.htm

The Poles wore their cap badges more centered over the face rather than to the left like British and Commonwealth troops.

http://www.opusmedia.fr/kazimierzduda/1944_02_myst_gb.asp

http://www.opusmedia.fr/kazimierzduda/16051944_01_gb.asp

http://www.opusmedia.fr/kazimierzduda/kazimierzDUDA_calais_1947_gb.asp

http://www.opusmedia.fr/kazimierzduda/europe_1944_05_gb.asp

Cheers

jjumbo

Hey Nick
A great site for Polish uniforms is
here
Scroll through for many archive pics of Poles in Italy.
Cheers
Brad

Hi guys
thanks very much for the help, much appreciated and some very nice links and pictures. Cheers, Nick

After the Battle magazine issue # 13 covered the Battles for Cassino. You might be able to find a copy somewhere. Check after the battle's web site to see if they have a spare issue to sell
Joe

Nick

The 12 Pulk Ulanow are very well know to me - I was very fortunate to know their last CO; who served as an Officer with the Regt throughout WWII.

The 12 Pulk Ulanow were certainly present at Cassino - they were the Divisional recce regt. The Pulk are famous for supplying the recce platoon that were the first to secure the Monastery (they were unopposed). Upon securing the position their first task was to hoist the Regimental pennon/ pennant (red, white and blue horizontal bands) over the ruins of the monastery - it was later replaced by the Polish national flag. The Pulk's staghounds all flew these pennants (on their aerials) - I'm very very lucky to have one of these in my collections.

However, the regt didn't bring their AFVs to the battle! The II Korpus did deploy armour at Cassino - the Shermans of the famous Skorpian Pulk - but the terrain (it was a mountain after all) got the better of them. The 12 Pulk did use their Staghounds to great effect and impact on their drive up the eastern side of the Italian boot towards Bologne, which may be a better setting for your staghound.

In terms of uniforms - the 12 Pulk wore BD at Cassino. They wore lighter kit (denims, shirtsleaves) during the drive towards Bologne. The uniforms posted by Pat are (top to bottom) representative of Divisional arty (top) and for 2 Warsawa Armoured Div (this example for the famous Skorpian Pulk). It is worth noting that most of the insignia shown on these BDs would have been produced (by Italian jewellers and manufacturers) in the immediate post-war period (1945 - 46) when II Korpus were still in Italy. Much of the insignia worn during the fighting (particularly during Cassino) would have been either unit manufactured, or put together by individuals themselves. The British 8th Army Flash (the wearing of which was an honour awarded to II Korpus) only began to appear on uniforms after Cassino.

I hope that's helpful.

Cheers

Karol

Hi Guys
Joe, thank you for your help, that could be an interesting read.
Karol, wow, what a wealth of knowledge!! Very interesting indeed and also very helpful. Thank you very much for your help, it looks like my staghound is going to end up on the road to Bologne then!!! Thanks for your help, Nick

Hi folks,

I've just joined up as I was looking for similar info and the search engine popped this page up!

My father was in 3rd Carpathians, so I have a vested interest. Great info thus far, but one thing to be wary of is the 8th army badge (the cross on a shield, worn towards the top of the right arm (see the earlier photos by Pat McGrath)). I believe that Field Marshall Montgomery (British 8th Army) awarded the Polish 2nd Corps the right to wear the 8th Army Badge AFTER Monte-Cassino, in recognition of their tremendous efforts there, so if you are re-creating action before or during Monte-Cassino, my understanding is that the Poles would not have been wearing that badge. My father was wearing it when he was wounded in the action to cross the Senio.

(I have a couple of photos of 3rd Carpathian uniforms from a small museum at Monte-Cassino, which I visited a few years ago. If someone would be kind enough to tell me how to, I'll post them here!)

Keep typing!

Chris

Poles serving with the British 8th Army in Italy wore British uniforms with Polish badges.