Greets - I was thinking of turning the disappointing Academy Priest into a Kangaroo. I only have a few pictures of them but was more concerned about the types of bogies and added armor. Were they mixed types with the early suspension, middle, and late? Could I mix the 3 pc trans cover with straight arm suspension bogies?

I found some information on what was actually done by the SA maint depots http://web.inter.nl.net/users/spoelstra/g104/apckang2.htm#Appendix%20F

surely there was some degree of variation when building these?

Thanks
Chris

Hey Chris,
IIRC, the Priests used by the Canadians in Italy and North West Europe were early types with the M3 & M4 type VVSS suspension and 3 piece transmission covers.
The Priests used in NWE were turned into the depots after the Normandy invasion and were replaced with 25pdr armed Sextons.
This is one of the reasons they were available for conversion to Kangaroos.
The only photo I've seen of a Kangaroo in Italy has the mid production VVSS.
These sites might be of help:

http://www.1cacr.org/
http://www.canadiankangaroos.ca/Site/1CACR.html
http://web.inter.nl.net/users/spoelstra/g104/1cacr/m7.html
http://www.mapleleafup.org/vehicles/cac/
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?t=98250
http://www.diggerhistory.info/pages-armour/allied/kangaroos.htm
http://www.flamesofwar.com/hobby.aspx?art_id=540

Cheers

jjumbo

Hey Gary,
I realize that Chris was referring to a "Defrocked Priest" Kangaroo and not a Ram Kangaroo.
Was just trying to show him the sites regarding the 1st Canadian Armoured Carrier Regiment, the unit that was eventually created to make use of these APC's.
And while Wikipedia is not always the most accurate or up to date, the info here is consistent with what other sites have to say on the matter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kangaroo_(armoured_personnel_carrier)

jjumbo

Thanks for the info guys......

Not as much as you might think. They were all done in a few days by one depot workshop and started with vehicles previously allocated to two regiments in one batch. There would be some variation inthe initial configuration, but not much. I'd go with the 3-piece tranny cover and the horizontal return roller brackets.

One known variation apparently was in the configuration of the plate used to cover the opening for the 105mm gun rotor. Armour plate was in short supply so some got the armour and some got two mild steel plates taken from destroyed D-Day landing craft spaced several inches apart with the opening filled with sand (I believe). For the initial operation they may not have even had the additional plate repainted from the navy grey.

These vehicles were used for several months until eventually replaced by Ram Kangaroos in late 1944. By the time they were turned in for the Rams, they were, apparently, in quite tatty condition. The unit wasn't terribly official at that point and had no regular REME/LAD support and had to survive on whatever they could scrounge from passing armoured regiments ("Please, sir, could you spare a bogey assembly for a poor broken-down Kangaroo?").

Having had a number of vehicles hit mines or have engines, and the like, replaced in the field over a 4 months period in action, a Priest Kangaroo by September 1944 could look pretty bad and this is where a little artistic license could be effective. I'm sure it was possible to find Kangaroos with mismatched bogey assemblies, differently hued paint slapped over the added armour, replaced fenders, patches in the stowage boxes and the like.

Apprently these vehicles were used very hard as soon as it became obvious how advantageous it was for the infantry to be transported over the battlefield behind armour. Regiments transported in Kangaroos always suffered significantly fewer losses to enemy fire, arrived in much better shape to hold objectives and, not surprising in hindsight, suffered lower rates of combat fatigue overall due to the infantry being under less stress during the entire attack. Once the word got out, the Kangaroos were in constand demand and their vehicles were pretty much clapped out when they were turned in.

Oh, and John J. just a small correction. The units that turned in the Preists after D-Day were infantry division arty reg'ts, so the Priests were replaced by towed 25 pdrs. The Sextons went only to the Field Regiments assigned to Arm'd Divisions.

A couple final points:
- when making up a Priest Kangaroo, each crew was only the single driver and no radios were fitted. It was only after the Rams came in that the vehicle crew was increased to two men and a radio added to each vehicle.
- you can see from the photo on Hanno's page that the Kangaroo still has both the wading trunk & the raised side armour. There are several Priest Kangaroo photos and this is the only one I've seen that still has the trunk, but several others had the raised side armour.
- The pulpit MG was almost always a .30 cal.
- There shouldn't be much in the way of markings although local or unit-level tactical markings may have evolved over time before the Priests were replaced by Rams. Remember, until the Rams arrived, the unit wasn't formally recognised as a distinct unit, so a proper tac sign wouldn't have been authorised.

HTH

Paul

Paul,
GReat additional information !!! I really appreciate it. I was aware of the mild stell/spaced armour thing. I thought that there was some sort of satandardization in interior fittings such as radios, small arms, fire extinguishers, etc...

Chris

Hi Chris,

Got some pics of the Ram Kangaroo but not the De-frocked Priest.

Sorry I can't help.

Al

No problem.



You have to remember that the Priest Kangaroos were created over the course of only 4 days. Working almost nonstop night & day the REME crews had time to only strip out the guns & ammo bins and weld in the blanking plates in addition to the required mechanical overhauls to the engines & transmissions. Everything else would have gone by the wayside in the effort to turn out 66 (I think was the number) vehicles to a brand new concept in essentially no time at all.

If you make your conversion based on how the real ones were done, you won't go far wrong. The basic Priests had been brought up to UK requirements for use as normal SP gums, so there would have been whatever the normal fittings used by the Brits in their Priests (stowage diagrams would show what the standard was). Add to that the items needed for deep wading on D-Day (wading stacks, raised side plate fittings, Bostick waterproofing around the moving bits, etc. Then strip out the gun, rotor and ammo bins as well as any of the normal fittings of the artillery vehicle. Add the blanking plates over the rotor opening and what you'll have left will probably look very much as Kangaroos did on the morning of August 6 when they were first used.

Now, if you want to show one of these vehicles later in the fall, before the Rams were brought on board, you have to allow for the poor logistical trail of this ad hoc unit and the lack of proper spares & support. As I said before, these vehicles will be pretty beat up and will show it. The LAD troops & vehicle crews worked night & day to keep the vehicles working. Anything not related to pure operational issues was put off.

Paul

So it looks like itll be a later Defrocked Priest -
Thanks again Paul!

There's one link missing for the Ram & Sexton:

http://www.ramtank.ca/