Hi Guys !

I've been doing a bit of research into the actual sourcing of the new Fleet of MTB's as part of the Land 907 project.

Here are some details and info to consider in specifying a MBT for the ADF as documented in the actual Auditor General's report 2007 -2008 on the current acquisition:

1. The prefered tank must be a production model with known operating and maintenance costs.

2. Interoperability is an important requirement for these tanks ie:

Ability to operate with an international coalition for tasks that support the wider interests, including the ability to operate with current and future US forces.

Ability to remain capable of operating within and potentially leading coalitions involving neighbours and regional partners

The core business of the Australian Army is to conduct close combat against an enemy using combined arms teams. A combined arms team is made up of infantry, armour, artillery, engineers and army aviation. Within this formation the tank plays a central role providing protection, communication and firepower.

In the actual project 3 platforms types were considered:

Leopard 2 and Leopard 2 variants
Abrams variants
Challenger 2

The Abrams acquisition was recommended over the other options basically on the basis of it's proven survivability and cost. Government approval for the project to purchase the Abrams M1A1 AIM was given in March 2004.

In the end two contenders emerged as preferred options to replace the AS1 Leopards, The Abrams above, and the Swiss RUAG PANZER 87/WE.

Challenger 2 was discounted because it was far more expensive than any of the other options ( twice that of the Abrams).

Leopard 2A4, 2A5, and 2A6 were not considered as competitive in terms of operational capability as " these would have been supplied as aging and second hand tanks of lesser capability" (NB: the Auditor Generals report assesses that this decision was made in the absence of an approved functional performance specification, and was by its nature subjective.)

This 'What if ?' scenario assumes that the Leopard 2A6 was chosen as it was the best in terms of operational capability, and that it was cost competitive. However that should be kept in mind in "specing" the beast. Adding too much cost to the tank will make it unfeasible and unaffordable.

Common specifications must be used where possible and the tank must be able to fulfill the Australian Arrmy's core business of combined arms. This tank does not need to be a 'technological wonder' (eg: PSO) so some of the 'you beaut' stuff does not need to be included in the final specification of this tank. It needs to be a good honest machine that fullfils the needs of the RAAC.

Some of the modifications made to the Abrams were:

A mobile camouflage system

A cooling system similar to the Leopard Crew Climate Control System

Steyr mounts for Aussie small arms.

Heat reflecting insulations, umbrella & internal cool air vests

I'll also need to think about these.

Thoughts ?

BTW here is the link to the report above (good reading if you're interested in how these decisions are made):


http://www.anao.gov.au/uploads/documents/2007-08_Audit_Report_1.pdf

In the end the correct decision was probably made (based on requirements). But This is all about building an Aussie Leo 2A6

Cheers

Paul

Good summary and synopsis for your "what if" build.

I look forward to seeing it come to life.

Thanks Jason.

It's fun to plan these kind of projects and have a "reason" for making a model look the way it does !

I've started on my Kosovo 2A5 (still waiting on a Barrel though). So that'll take a few weeks with work commitments. Then hopefully MH will have some of the bits I need to complete my PH III ASLAV 25. This Aussie Leo will follow over Christmas or a little later.

In the mean time for this project I have (unless I get more ideas from the team here) :

The Tamiya Leo 2A6,

AFV Club tracks,

Legends 2A6 (NL) conversion (for some of the parts I require, including the 2A4 side skirts),

Lion Roar PE for the 2A6

A Mouse House GPS Antenna, and other mounts for Com's.

A Mouse House MAG 58 (with Platt Mount) in my spares Box (if I decide to use it)

The Mouse House MAD606 1st Armoured Decals are coming.

The Challenger Dozer Blade is on the way too (Trumpeter kit)

No luck with a Barrel yet (waiting on a timing from Model Point - looking for the updated one reviewed by Pawel Krupowicz @ 90 % ):

I'm waiting on info / timing from Andy on his 2A6M conversion (this will be great for the added Armor and the other extras eg: A/C unit, antenna's etc).

Some parts will also need to be scratched (Phone Box & Shade / Umbrella holder) or 'stolen' from the spares box.

I also need to figure out how to do Barracuda net

There are probably some more bits I'd like to do that I've missed. Any other ideas ? ATM I'm leaning towards NOT putting a RWS on the turret, but I'm open to having my arm twisted on that one

This will be fun !!

Cheers

Paul

Still no luck with AM Barrels. Any thoughts on the Tamiya 2A6 Kit Barrel ?

Cheers

Paul

Barrel Depot brings out a 2A5 and 2A6 barrel for Tamiya kits.

Lars

Thanks Lars

I have seen from various posts here that Barrel Depot Barrels are not highly regarded. I can't find the most recent thread but it was of a modern soviet tank.

Any feedback on the quality of Barrel Depot Leopard Barrels anyone ? I know LeoCmdr prefers Model Point (but there are none available).

I have 'played around' with the Kit Barrel in my 2A5 project (Kosovo Leopard) and it has come up ok after some sanding, and bit of primer and a thin cost of Tamiya Nato Black (to test the result for seams stc),

I'd prefer an excellent quality AM barrel, but if I can't get my hands on one that is better than the kit barrel, I guess I may as well use the plastic one.


Thoughts ?

Cheers

Paul

If you are planning to put camouflage netting on your KFOR Leopard 2A5 then don't worry about an aftermarket barrel.......lots of the KFOR German Leopard 2A5s had the barrel and front of the turret covered with cam net.........you won't even see the barrel.

Good points Jason.

Both Leo's will have nets on the Barrel - the Aussies will be Barracuda if I can work out how to do that type of camo net

Cheers

Paul

So far I've got:

The Tamiya Leo 2A6,

AFV Club tracks,

Legends 2A6 (NL) conversion (for some of the parts I require, including the 2A4 side skirts),

Lion Roar PE for the 2A6

A Mouse House GPS Antenna, and other mounts for Com's.

A Mouse House MAG 58 (with Platt Mount)

The Mouse House MAD606 1st Armoured Decals.

The Challenger Dozer Blade (Trumpeter kit) it looks the right width too - I need to test fit this sub assembly to see what I need to modify.

I'm still waiting on a timing from Model Point on their Barrels - I have a Barrel Depot Barrel but may end up using the kit Barrel.

Also waiting on info / timing from Andy on his 2A6M conversion ( he's flat out ATM ). I can't start until I get this kit.

That's it ATM

Have I missed anything ?

Paul

Hay paul thats a pritty good list. giveing me some ideas for the brit leo.

I am working on the the baracuda cam got some ideas on how to make it just gotta try and make it???????

G'day Scotty !!

There are two option with the Barracuda I think.

1. Wait for Echelon's effort (I've heard from two sources that they are working on this camo as an AM kit).

2. Use this excellent technique by Ingvar Sylegård.

http://www.plasticwarfare.se/?p=183

This one would be a good one to have a play with and practice, and the possibilities for placement are endless. eg: Barrel, turret, etc.

Cheers,

Paul

Hay paul.
I was thinking along the same lines guess great minds think alike.

The barracuda that is on the newer afvs is slightly different it has a thermal sheet under the netting if you can find resent pics of the Canadian and danish Leos over in afghanistan you will get an idea of how it is fitted.

Let me know what you decide as far as the Barracuda goes Scotty.

I'm keen on finding the best solution

found this could be usefull for refernce for the barracuda.
linkname https://armorama.kitmaker.net/forums/113366&page=1

and this is good pic of a danish leo with the camo fitted


Hope that helps.

Thanks Scotty, I've seen that thread & pics.

I've got some good ones of Aussie Leopard 1's as well, from the defence department's web site, amongst others.

Cheers

Paul

PS: my "Storm Miniatures" 2A6M conversion kit is on the way too

........... and I've got no reply from Model Point on their barrels after 5 e-mails.

I'm not happy and I don't think I'll buy from them with that quality of service / response.

Ok not far away from starting now, the last of the bits arrived today (just need to finish the 2A5 I'm painting ATM).

Here's what I've got for this project:










Plow from the Challenger II kit (Trumpeter)



And this stuff which is a "may-be" (but probably not):



Any comments ?

Cheers

Paul

WOW lot of stuff there paul good luck.

Nearly cracked the baracuda cam made a tool to make it i will let you know how i get on?

Cool Scotty !!

That'll be great to see

I'm about to try the 'Verlinden' method of modern camo net also ("The Verlinden way Volume II"), using gauze, wood glue and "model railway artificial grass".

"LeoCmdr" was kind enough to point me in that direction for non Barracuda net. Thanks again Jason !!

This is the net I'll use on the Kosovo 2A5. Not sure about the Aussie "What if ?" Leo yet. I'll see how the camo net above goes first and also check out your Barracuda.





Paul

G'day Guys !!

I've started on this build - the lower Hull and Wheels are pretty much done (including the 2A6M Belly armor which is now fitted).

I've also done some measurements on the Trumpeter Chally II 'Dozer' bucket and the required attachment points. It seems that the width is perfect for fitment to the Tamiya 2A6 (either between the fenders on the upper hull (nose) , or below the nose on the lower hull).

I'll need to assemble the dozer blade over the next few days to figure out the pivot points (it has working hinges etc ) and dry fit it to a hull to decide where it ends up being attached.

Here are the Trumpeter Challenger 2 Dozer fitment instructions (the width of fenders are pretty much the same as the Tamiya 2A6) so the bucket will fit on the upper Hull as is:




I'd like to attach it at the nose as per the PSO below, but there may need to be some substantial modification to the bucket and pivot points (hopefully not):







I'll post picks later in the week

Any comments, or thoughts ?

Cheers

Paul

Hay paul good luck can't wait to see more.

Thanks Scotty !

I also spent a while last night assembling the AFV Club tracks - after about 8 links I'd had enough

Seeing the quality of the vinyl tracks on my Kosovo 2A5 I may use the Kit tracks instead. I lost two or the tiny AFV Club track 'outside links' that "flicked" off the table

I'll see how I go in a few days when I need to come back to them. I've primed the Tamiya Vinyl tracks just incase

Any news on that Barracuda net Scott ?

Cheers

Paul

still experamenting with meterals for the camo tissue paper is a bit fragile!!!! think i mite try traceing paper?? and i need to alter the tool slightly after consulting the engineer at work he give me a few tips on how to make it a bit stronger should have it cracked soon i hope?

Good luck then Scott.

Make sure you post progress picks, or e-mail me any shots you have

I'm doing a bit of practice making standard Camo net with Gauze and model railway grass - I'll also try gauze and oregano I think (I have an old Abrams that I use).

Cheers

Paul

Just as I suspected the Trumpeter Dozer fits the Leopard pretty well.

There will need to be some changes around the Leopards nose to suit - relocate Head lights, Tow hooks ?

OR

I may try to fit the attachments (bucket) under the nose (that'll require quite a bit of work).

I'll look to see how all parts around the nose fit around each other, and what makes sense functionally......

Here's how the Dozer blade fits the nose:



BTW: I'm going to leave the kit Fenders and mudflaps on this one

Cheers

Paul

It looks nice! Could you tell me why you're leaving the sideskirts off?

Lars