_GOTOBOTTOM
Яusso-Soviэt Forum: WWII Soviet Armor
For discussions related to WW2 era Soviet armor.
Need KV-1 Ehkranami help!
crucial_H
Visit this Community
Södermanland, Sweden
Joined: January 15, 2008
KitMaker: 150 posts
Armorama: 147 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 21, 2008 - 07:27 AM UTC
I'm just about to start painting my KV-1 Ehkranami, but I need som inspiration. From most pictures I've seen they just apear to be plain green without any markings. The ones with markings I have seen have those slogans written on the turret, and I don't like the look of it. Are there any alternatives? Captuted by germans (gray?) or should I just go for a plain green tank without any markings?
If you have any pictures, please send me them/post them!

Also. I'm thinking about adding some figures to the tank. Would Tristars offering be accurate for such an early war tank? Are there any early war soviet tank riders around?

Thanx for the help!
// Henrik
bellers
Visit this Community
England - East Midlands, United Kingdom
Joined: September 30, 2008
KitMaker: 253 posts
Armorama: 218 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 21, 2008 - 08:16 AM UTC
hi henrik just got one photo of a german kv not the best of pics sorry just go to my photos .also did see some with white wash camo with the camo going round a hand painted balkenkreuz hope this helps
Finch
Visit this Community
New York, United States
Joined: August 03, 2005
KitMaker: 411 posts
Armorama: 273 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 21, 2008 - 12:05 PM UTC
If you want to do a camouflaged one, the Finns captured one KV s ekranami and, after some minor modifications, used it. The Finnish KV had a four-color hardedges scheme, with Finnish hakaristis on the turret sides, hull rear, and turret roof. Sometimes it also carried a three-digit tactical number in yellow on the turret sides.

The mods required are simple to do. Google the Parola KV and you'll see them.
crucial_H
Visit this Community
Södermanland, Sweden
Joined: January 15, 2008
KitMaker: 150 posts
Armorama: 147 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 21, 2008 - 12:19 PM UTC
My first intentions was to build a finnish one, but I didn't know how to construct the air intake covers.
dsfraser
Visit this Community
Alberta, Canada
Joined: October 01, 2007
KitMaker: 172 posts
Armorama: 168 posts
Posted: Sunday, December 21, 2008 - 02:49 PM UTC
Aber has quite the deluxe set for a Finnish KV-1.

http://aber.net.pl/detal/desc/soviet_heavy_tank_kv_1_used_and_modified_by_finnish_army_075151013/

I suspect your air intakes are included.

Apart from a Finnish tank, your options for camouflage are limited. The KV-1 s ehkranami came well after the 1940 order to camouflage tanks was set aside, so your options for a Soviet tank are basically green or green with white.

The slogans you refer to are common in propaganda photos, much less common on the battlefield. If you look closely, you can see many are written in chalk.

Cheers
Scott Fraser
crucial_H
Visit this Community
Södermanland, Sweden
Joined: January 15, 2008
KitMaker: 150 posts
Armorama: 147 posts
Posted: Monday, December 22, 2008 - 01:29 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Aber has quite the deluxe set for a Finnish KV-1.

http://aber.net.pl/detal/desc/soviet_heavy_tank_kv_1_used_and_modified_by_finnish_army_075151013/

I suspect your air intakes are included.

Apart from a Finnish tank, your options for camouflage are limited. The KV-1 s ehkranami came well after the 1940 order to camouflage tanks was set aside, so your options for a Soviet tank are basically green or green with white.

The slogans you refer to are common in propaganda photos, much less common on the battlefield. If you look closely, you can see many are written in chalk.

Cheers
Scott Fraser




Wow! I totaly missed that one. Think I have to buld another Trumpeter Kv-1 (I'm on my third now!)!

Thanx for all the help. I'm going for a plaine green one.
Minsk94
Visit this Community
Wisconsin, United States
Joined: June 16, 2008
KitMaker: 418 posts
Armorama: 408 posts
Posted: Monday, December 22, 2008 - 01:10 PM UTC

Quoted Text

The slogans you refer to are common in propaganda photos, much less common on the battlefield.


Depends on what to call a slogan. Most writings on Soviet tanks in WW2 were not actual "slogans".

And just to show that not all KV-1 were plain green:


dsfraser
Visit this Community
Alberta, Canada
Joined: October 01, 2007
KitMaker: 172 posts
Armorama: 168 posts
Posted: Monday, December 22, 2008 - 11:28 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Depends on what to call a slogan. Most writings on Soviet tanks in WW2 were not actual "slogans".



I am referring to the patriotic slogans that appear on 85% of all Soviet tank models. За Родину, За Сталину, Бей фашистскую гайдиину, and so on. Slogans, not dedications, which were generally later in the war and applied permanently.

In early 1942, before the campaign season, many photos were taken of Soviet tanks for propaganda purposes. Some of these made their way to the West, and they have been reproduced ad nauseum in almost every book on Soviet tanks for the last sixty years. This has created the impression in the West that slogans were far more common than they actually were.

By way of example, this photo has appeared often:



This the 116 TkBde, photographed extensively in April 1942 designator 045 in the lower half of a diamond, battalion number in the upper half). This particular tank was a decal option in the old Tamiya kit. Other tanks photographed at the same time are LAZO (ЛАЗО) and PARKHOMENKO (ПАРХОМЕНКО), both decal options in DML kits, with varying degrees of accuracy. Aftermarket decal producers have covered other tanks photographed at this time. Now these are legit inscriptions, applied with paint rather than chalk, but this is just one of many hundreds of tank brigades formed between 1941 and 1945.

Then there is this photo:



Not the best copy. In clearer copies it is obvious that the writing is applied with chalk. My own opinion is that it would be downright stupid to drive a tank with such conspicuous markings into combat, but then the British actually painted bullseyes on their aircraft. In any case, I very much doubt that anything more than faint traces of these inscriptions survived more than a few days after these photos were taken. This tank, and others photographed at the same time, are decal options in the Trumpy kits.


Quoted Text

. . . not all KV-1 were plain green:



Quite so, there are exceptions to every rule. I've seen photos of T-34s with Formochka turrets, ISU-152s, clearly from later in the war, in multi-coloured camouflage. Still, I have no misgivings whatsoever in stating unequivocally that the typical Soviet tank between 1942 and 1945 was overall 4BO "Protective Green", in one of its many manifestations.

This is in direct contrast to equipment from 1940-41. There was a 1940 order that laid out a rather complex system of camouflage, with colour selection related to the geographic area tanks served in. Not all colours were distributed, but very early KVs and T-34s were definitely delivered in three-colour camouflage of sand, green and dark brown. After Barbarossa, for the most part that went out the window. Winter whitewash was common, but paint was no longer distributed to combat units, and camouflage became the exception, rather than the norm. I have three different Russian monographs that agree on that point.

Still, there are always exceptions. During early 1942 STZ was applying brown camouflage over 4BO green. There are photos of tanks from 130 TkBde and 3 GvTkBde with brown camouflage on agreen base, vehicles produced at STZ in February 1942. The tanks from 130 TkBde (tactical designator Л2-КС)had inscriptions, too, each tank named after one of the Old Bolsheviks --- Dzerzhinskii, Ordzhonokidze, Kikvidze, and Shchorts are known. They were photographed in April 1942. The brigade lost all their tanks in the fighting around Voronezh in May 1942, so these tanks only lasted a few weeks. The replacements were still camouflaged, kept the tactical designator, but no longer bore inscriptions.



Anyway, the long and the short of it is that Soviet tanks were generally green, seldom had camouflage, and that inscriptions are much less common than generally believed. Tactical markings, yes. Tank numbers, yes. Dedications yes, unit by unit. But the notion that every second tank had some gaudy slogan painted on it is totally false.

Cheers
Scott Fraser
 _GOTOTOP