Hello guys,
I am currently painting some german figures, I am working on the karl gerat
artillery crew and one of my figure has his forearms visible because he is wearing short sleeves so I was thinking that it may be a cool detail to apply a tattoo on his forearms.
I am just wondering if that would be historicaly accurate and what kind of tattoos the german soldiers used to have if that was allowed back then ?
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German soldiers and tattoos ?
axismodeler
Joined: September 26, 2008
KitMaker: 22 posts
Armorama: 21 posts
Posted: Sunday, January 04, 2009 - 04:16 AM UTC
SK2
Joined: October 30, 2005
KitMaker: 94 posts
Armorama: 58 posts
Posted: Monday, January 05, 2009 - 11:20 AM UTC
try acher transfers website
figures page 2
item # FG99012
HTH sorry cant post link im at work as usual
figures page 2
item # FG99012
HTH sorry cant post link im at work as usual
Galwitz
Joined: June 12, 2007
KitMaker: 498 posts
Armorama: 406 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 - 02:40 AM UTC
Although I can’t back it with any evidence, I think that German military would not be too excited about tattoos other that the blood type (mostly SS members) which doesn’t apply to you figure situation anyway (it was usually located too high to be visible with rolled up sleeve). So I guess it is not impossible (maybe as a pre-war/pre-military-service thing, maybe for someone with sailor-like background), but still rather an exception. I would also say, if it existed, it was likely rather crude in terms of quality…
axismodeler
Joined: September 26, 2008
KitMaker: 22 posts
Armorama: 21 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 - 04:45 AM UTC
I agree with you Ales, I think that german military was very strict with discipline and that a tatoo would be considered as a scum or hoodlum thing but ( some of you will disagree) I am not a freak of historic realism.
I think I am going to draw a germanic or celtic rune on the forearm and it will always be possible to erase it later. Small details are always fun to look at I think even if that's not 100 percent accurate
I think I am going to draw a germanic or celtic rune on the forearm and it will always be possible to erase it later. Small details are always fun to look at I think even if that's not 100 percent accurate
Galwitz
Joined: June 12, 2007
KitMaker: 498 posts
Armorama: 406 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 - 08:45 AM UTC
With all the respect to your decision I think you would be much better off with an anchor or a mermaid. Not sure what you mean by “Celtic” rune, but I dare to guess that you wouldn’t find any Nordic rune tattoos at that period time. I think those are rather modern phenomenon.
-A-
-A-
bizzychicken
Joined: September 06, 2008
KitMaker: 967 posts
Armorama: 842 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 - 09:03 AM UTC
A bit of artist licence yes, historic dont think I've seen many photos of German soldiers with tatoo's. Not even all the photos in North Africa. Would love to be proven wrong. I think it would be a nice touch. 
Tarok
Joined: July 28, 2004
KitMaker: 10,889 posts
Armorama: 3,245 posts
Posted: Tuesday, January 06, 2009 - 11:38 PM UTC
If you study the history of both Nazi Germany and tattoos (sp?) you'll probably find that unless the person was a sailor it's unlikely they'd wear a tattoo. In Germany tattoos were used to mark and demean the "lesser" persons - so IMO you'd be safer not to tattoo your lad.
newfish
Joined: June 23, 2008
KitMaker: 2,329 posts
Armorama: 2,110 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 03:09 AM UTC
tattoos were present but the Ss mainly had them for blood groups
it was new at them time and some armies didnt like them at all !
it was new at them time and some armies didnt like them at all !
Tarok
Joined: July 28, 2004
KitMaker: 10,889 posts
Armorama: 3,245 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 08:31 AM UTC
Quoted Text
tattoos were present but the Ss mainly had them for blood groups
it was new at them time and some armies didnt like them at all !
Would you please cite your source, I'd like to read up more about it.
Rudi
(p.s. the Shift key and upper case letters are wonderful things...)
Jmarles
Joined: November 02, 2008
KitMaker: 1,138 posts
Armorama: 953 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 09:32 AM UTC
Hi Guillame, I can't say for certain but generally most armed forces have some regulations against most tattoos, usually covered by other regulations such as dress code and appearance. During WW2, tattoos would still have a stigma attached to them - ie: either a sailor or criminal. Certain SS members would have their blood type and/or SS runes tatooed under their left arm near the armpit and thus would not be visible. Be careful how you colour the tattoo - more than likely it would be a faded bluish colour. Even modern tattoos at 1:1 scale are rather greyish-black, not pure black. And that I can attest to as I have over a hundred hours of tattoo work!
As for the post regarding runic tattoos, that's probably true. Although around 1900 - 1930's there was a big resurgence in interest in Norse mythology, new age mysticism, etc. it would be unlikely to be a widespread tattoo choice.
As for the post regarding runic tattoos, that's probably true. Although around 1900 - 1930's there was a big resurgence in interest in Norse mythology, new age mysticism, etc. it would be unlikely to be a widespread tattoo choice.
Jmarles
Joined: November 02, 2008
KitMaker: 1,138 posts
Armorama: 953 posts
Posted: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 - 09:40 AM UTC
Or....save your tattoo idea for another day. What about having a couple of tattooed guys in a penal brigade or part of SS Dirlewanger? That would have perhaps been possible. Just a suggestion. ;>
axismodeler
Joined: September 26, 2008
KitMaker: 22 posts
Armorama: 21 posts
Posted: Friday, January 16, 2009 - 02:45 AM UTC
Thanks for your feedback guys and sorry because I have been away from
this thread during a while
I have decided to follow your advice and I wont do any tattoo
on the forearm of the german artilery crewman because it would
be too unrealistic and unlikely to have happened.
But your suggestion was quite good Julian. I did not know the story of
the SS division named Dirlewanger, I have checked on the internet
and these guys were part of the most ruthless SS division
of the whole war. There were a bunch of former criminals
and some of them were litteraly insane.
But I am not sure that a figure manufacturer like dragon
would release a kit depicting this division as they were
more famous for their bestiality than their valor
in combat
this thread during a while
I have decided to follow your advice and I wont do any tattoo
on the forearm of the german artilery crewman because it would
be too unrealistic and unlikely to have happened.
But your suggestion was quite good Julian. I did not know the story of
the SS division named Dirlewanger, I have checked on the internet
and these guys were part of the most ruthless SS division
of the whole war. There were a bunch of former criminals
and some of them were litteraly insane.
But I am not sure that a figure manufacturer like dragon
would release a kit depicting this division as they were
more famous for their bestiality than their valor
in combat
Jmarles
Joined: November 02, 2008
KitMaker: 1,138 posts
Armorama: 953 posts
Posted: Friday, January 16, 2009 - 05:22 PM UTC
Quoted Text
....Well, Dragon has issued naughty figures like SS Handschar, SS Florian Geyer, and Russian Cossack Wehrmacht volunteers, all of which were brutal types, especially Florian Geyer...but anyway I would expect Dirlewanger would have typical second-line type uniforms, you can probably google them or check out your local library. There's a little bit of info on them in the ancient Ballantine Books publications "Illustrated Military History". I also have a large book titled "Forgotten Legions: Obscure Formations of the Waffen SS." I can maybe check it out if you like. I do know their divisional emblem is two crossed stylized stick grenades...like many so-called divisions they were little more than battalion strength. Many of their members were murderers, rapists, deserters, unwilling conscripts, etc. Good luck!Thanks for your feedback guys and sorry because I have been away from
this thread during a while
I have decided to follow your advice and I wont do any tattoo
on the forearm of the german artilery crewman because it would
be too unrealistic and unlikely to have happened.
But your suggestion was quite good Julian. I did not know the story of
the SS division named Dirlewanger, I have checked on the internet
and these guys were part of the most ruthless SS division
of the whole war. There were a bunch of former criminals
and some of them were litteraly insane.
But I am not sure that a figure manufacturer like dragon
would release a kit depicting this division as they were
more famous for their bestiality than their valor
in combat
newfish
Joined: June 23, 2008
KitMaker: 2,329 posts
Armorama: 2,110 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 12:31 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted Texttattoos were present but the Ss mainly had them for blood groups
it was new at them time and some armies didnt like them at all !
Would you please cite your source, I'd like to read up more about it.
Rudi
(p.s. the Shift key and upper case letters are wonderful things...)
il try and find it ive lost the source lol!
what did you mean about p.s. the Shift key and upper case letters are wonderful things?
alanmac
Joined: February 25, 2007
KitMaker: 3,033 posts
Armorama: 2,953 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 01:14 AM UTC
James
He means starting sentences and using Capital letters in the appropriate places.
That along with correct spelling (hint - incorrect words show a line under them) would make reading your posts a lot easier. Also bear in mind not all members have English as their native language so anything misspelt or poorly written for them makes it even harder to read.
Not trying to give you an English lesson
just pointing out the things he's referring to and other observations.
Happy modelling
Alan
He means starting sentences and using Capital letters in the appropriate places.
That along with correct spelling (hint - incorrect words show a line under them) would make reading your posts a lot easier. Also bear in mind not all members have English as their native language so anything misspelt or poorly written for them makes it even harder to read.
Not trying to give you an English lesson
just pointing out the things he's referring to and other observations.Happy modelling
Alan
newfish
Joined: June 23, 2008
KitMaker: 2,329 posts
Armorama: 2,110 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 02:06 AM UTC
I never bother using grammer and capital letters I usually shorten' words I guess it because its my age! Im sorry I will change that for you all =]
thanks for telling me =]
thanks for telling me =]
sgtreef
Joined: March 01, 2002
KitMaker: 6,043 posts
Armorama: 4,347 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 02:58 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I agree with you Ales, I think that german military was very strict with discipline and that a tatoo would be considered as a scum or hoodlum thing but ( some of you will disagree) I am not a freak of historic realism.
You bet have 3 myself
edturner
Joined: October 29, 2008
KitMaker: 24 posts
Armorama: 22 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 03:13 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextThe SS men had there Blood source tattooed under there arm, some guys I know do it today in the Canadian Forces as a quick way of telling what blood they need in Battlefield conditions. If you read the The Downfall 1945 by Anthony Beevor, you will see it there somewhere. Oh, and the Russians looked for this tattoo to find out who were SS......Yep.tattoos were present but the Ss mainly had them for blood groups
it was new at them time and some armies didnt like them at all !
Ed
Would you please cite your source, I'd like to read up more about it.
Rudi
(p.s. the Shift key and upper case letters are wonderful things...)
sgtreef
Joined: March 01, 2002
KitMaker: 6,043 posts
Armorama: 4,347 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 03:27 AM UTC
Now this brings up my Friend who is British and always telling me of all my misspelled words.
Tire=tyres Trunk=Boot Decals=Transfers Etc
So as to him I slay the English Language with the American English Language.
We do have a go sometimes.
I do admit that using proper Spelling and Punctuation is a must so it becomes a habit.
A resume with misspelled words might get you a job a Mickey D's
Cheers
Jeff
Tire=tyres Trunk=Boot Decals=Transfers Etc
So as to him I slay the English Language with the American English Language.
We do have a go sometimes.
I do admit that using proper Spelling and Punctuation is a must so it becomes a habit.
A resume with misspelled words might get you a job a Mickey D's
Cheers
Jeff
newfish
Joined: June 23, 2008
KitMaker: 2,329 posts
Armorama: 2,110 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 04:04 AM UTC
get a job a macky's? 
im currently doing A levels thanks
so i dont need a job just yet
im currently doing A levels thanks
so i dont need a job just yet
Jmarles
Joined: November 02, 2008
KitMaker: 1,138 posts
Armorama: 953 posts
Posted: Saturday, January 17, 2009 - 01:35 PM UTC
Not sure of any sources at hand, gentleman...but I am certain I read about Allies checking the upper arms of prisoners to see if there was a tattoo or scar, so they could be held for possible war crimes. 
firstcircle
Joined: November 19, 2008
KitMaker: 2,249 posts
Armorama: 2,007 posts
Posted: Thursday, January 22, 2009 - 09:00 AM UTC
That reminds me of the bit in The Odessa File where John Voight has his arm branded with a hot poker so as to make it look like he had had his SS blood group tattoo removed. I think that's the story behind that, burning it off so you can't be identified as SS. Can't remember now where on his arm that is...
By the way, even if you've seen the film, the book is fantastic!!
Sorry, that was a bit
By the way, even if you've seen the film, the book is fantastic!!
Sorry, that was a bit
Galwitz
Joined: June 12, 2007
KitMaker: 498 posts
Armorama: 406 posts
Posted: Friday, January 23, 2009 - 02:15 AM UTC
This is what Wikipedia says on the subject of SS blood group tattoos:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_blood_group_tattoo
HTH
-A-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_blood_group_tattoo
HTH
-A-
Bodeen
#026
Joined: June 08, 2002
KitMaker: 1,744 posts
Armorama: 1,359 posts
Posted: Monday, January 26, 2009 - 01:53 PM UTC
As an aside to the discussion of the Dirlewanger Brigade..... In the book "The Theory and Practice of Hell"-The SS and the Concentration Camp System( Der SS Staat) by Eugen Kogon, a concentration camp survivor, Mr Kogon states that these criminals were recruited from the German inmates in the concentration camps. Often times they were used to create terror in the rear areas such as Warsaw, etc. and then when no longer needed they were returned to the concentration camps and often killed in the process. They were truely the worst of the worst and acted that way.Jeff
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