G'day troops

I'm working on making a small diorama of a scene in Duren in 1945 of a Sturmtiger that has been captured by US Engineers, and past which a British Sherman ARV is driving. References for the Sturmtiger I have aplenty.

The ARV appears to be a Sherman II ARV III - the one on a Sherman chassis with a sheet steel superstructure, and I would love to know if anybody can suggest a source of reference information for which I don't have to hock the house. Waldemar Trojca's publication on the Tiger and Sturmtiger suggests that it's an M32B2, which is unlikely as there were only some 26 of them built, which I beieve all went to the USMC.

Thanks in anticipation.

Rob

Are you sure about that, Rob? British Serman-based ARVs were limited to the Sherman III ARV Mk. 1 (on diesel M4A2s ) and Sherman V ARV Mk. 1 and Mk. 2 (on the M4A4 chassis). No cast hull Sherman II were converted. I'm not sure which photo you are referencing, but the only sheet metal superstructure ever used was on ARVs Mk. 1 equipped for deep wading. I doubt that this structure would have survived on the vehicle from Normandy all the way into Germany. The few ARV Mk. 2s had a fixed armored superstructure, similar to that of the M32 but of boxier shape.
Greg

Greg

Many thanks. Finally everything starts to make sense. What appeared to be a box superstructure is probably one of the hatch flaps. Now all I have to do is work out whether my ARV was on a M4A4 hull or a M4A2. Given that I only have a 3/4 front view that may be a tad difficult.

Rob

Might be easier than you think -there are subtle differences in the glacis plate of the M4A4 and the M4A2. If you can show us the pic we'll try to work it out.

Pat

Yeah, I thought of that too just after I sent the last message (as always!) If I'm right, the M4A2 didn't have any bumps in front of the driver's and co-driver's positions, whereas the M4A4 did. Most of the photos of M4A2s which I have seen also show one piece tranasmission covers.

The ARV in question has a 3 piece tranny cover and bumps in front of both driver and co-driver, so I'm about 99%certain that it's an M4A4.

Thanks for all the assistance - much appreciated. I'd upload the photo, but that requires me to remember my password, which I've long since forgotten!

Regards

Rob

If the glacis is too cluttered to be clear, look at the bogie spacing. Even from a 3/4 angle the greater spacing between bogiesles on an M4A4 should be easy to see. I'll have to look to find the issue number, but an issue of MMiR a couple of years ago had an article on building a Sherman III ARV Mk 1, and Ampersand's book on modeling engineering and recovery vehicles had great info as well. Also an older issue of Axis and Allied. I'll get issue numbers from home later today.
Greg

Soory I'm a day late, Rob. Here is the list of relatively recent refernces that should still be available:

Military Miniatures in Review #33 builds a Sherman III ARV Mk.1.

Allied-Axis issue #4 has photo coverage of ARV Mk. 1 and 2, as well as M32B1.

Modeler's Guide to Engineering and Recovery Vehicles has built articles on the Sherman ARV Mk. 2, M32B1 and Cromwell ARV Mk.1. The Cromwell has many fittings that were common to the Sherman ARV Mk.1.

All of these were published by Ampersand Publishing, Pat Stansell's outfit. All recommended.

Greg

Yeah, these time zones are a problem, aren't they ? By my calculations, it's about 6:10pm on Saturday evening over there as I write this - it's 10:10am on Sunday morning here and I'm sitting with a fan blowing two feet away 'cos of the 76% humidity (yecch).

Thanks for the references - I spent some time yesterday afternoon when I wasn't melting surfing various combinations of references on the Web, and came to the conclusion that apart from the references that you mention, there's not a lot been written on Sherman ARVs.

Mind you, I seem to recall finding much the same thing when I went looking for decent references for a Bergepanther - it was like pulling teeth. Yesterday afternoon's surfing did, however, turn up one very useful French site which had numerous photos of the interior of a model of a Sherman 1 ARV. I'm now considering cannibalising a partly built M10 for the necessary bits.

I'll ask around our club members and see if anybody has any of the references that you listed - they have to be somewhere.

Thanks again

Rob