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NEWS
Trumpeter - MORE Sd.Kfz 7 Variants
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 10:54 PM UTC
Trumpeter have sent us details of their NEXT Sd.Kfz 7 Variants. With these, the company is doing two more versions of the ARMORED Sd.Kfz. 7/2 and Selbstfahrlafette. Full details along with a complete set of images can be seen:
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If you have comments or questions please post them here.
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Link to Item
If you have comments or questions please post them here.
Thanks!
Hisham
Joined: July 23, 2004
KitMaker: 6,856 posts
Armorama: 6,363 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 28, 2009 - 11:51 PM UTC
This variant looks a lot more interesting than the last one released.
Is the trailer the correct one this time?
Two thumbs up to Trumpeter for the wide variety of vehicles they give us.
Hisham
Is the trailer the correct one this time?
Two thumbs up to Trumpeter for the wide variety of vehicles they give us.
Hisham
bill_c
Campaigns Administrator
Joined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 04:16 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Is the trailer the correct one this time?
That's hard to say, though it's clearly different from the incorrect Sd.Ah. 51 they included in their 7/1 Vierling.
Check this out:
Vehicles of the Wehrmacht says it should be the Sonder Anhaenger 57, but I cannot yet find a photo of that trailer.
H_Ackermans
Joined: July 11, 2006
KitMaker: 2,229 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 04:27 AM UTC
Here are 4 other pics I have of 7/2's and trailer:
I don't know which Anhänger these are. But they all DO indicate the Anhänger in the kit is the correct one this time round.
I don't know which Anhänger these are. But they all DO indicate the Anhänger in the kit is the correct one this time round.
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
Armorama: 8,109 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 05:55 AM UTC
Quoted Text
But they all DO indicate the Anhänger in the kit is the correct one this time round.
Yes and no.
It's better, with a curved roof, but if you look carefully at your photos, Herbert, the rear door on the trailer is smaller, while they look to be the same length in the model. Not a fatal problem for most modelers, but until someone with more detailed information comes on the scene, I'm reserving judgement on whether this trailer is the correct one.
Seems to me there's a book waiting to be published:
TRAILERS OF THE WEHRMACHT.
Probably sell three or four copies....
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 06:17 AM UTC
I guess it helps to READ the new release and look at the pictures.... 
After looking at all the images and attempting to sort out the quoted text, I can't tell the difference in the two offerings. Since the two kits seem virtually identical, I'm confused by what Trumpeter is announcing. The only substantial difference seems to be one has a PE shield, while the other's is styrene. But both appear to be "late" versions with squared-off mud guards. Pity Trumpeter isn't releasing one early (e.g., rounded mud guards and perhaps no cab up-armoring) and one late.
Second, the trailer may or may not be correct, there is no consistency in the sources I've encountered. One says is should be the Sd.Ah. 56 (PMMS), another the Sd.Ah 57 (Vehicles of the Wehrmacht), while still a third (Sd.Kfz.7 In Detail) says this trailer (the 52) should be used for both variants.
In any case, the Sd.An.51 included in the 7/1 Trumpeter appears to be wrong, so perhaps they will release this trailer as a separate kit?
After looking at all the images and attempting to sort out the quoted text, I can't tell the difference in the two offerings. Since the two kits seem virtually identical, I'm confused by what Trumpeter is announcing. The only substantial difference seems to be one has a PE shield, while the other's is styrene. But both appear to be "late" versions with squared-off mud guards. Pity Trumpeter isn't releasing one early (e.g., rounded mud guards and perhaps no cab up-armoring) and one late.
Second, the trailer may or may not be correct, there is no consistency in the sources I've encountered. One says is should be the Sd.Ah. 56 (PMMS), another the Sd.Ah 57 (Vehicles of the Wehrmacht), while still a third (Sd.Kfz.7 In Detail) says this trailer (the 52) should be used for both variants.
In any case, the Sd.An.51 included in the 7/1 Trumpeter appears to be wrong, so perhaps they will release this trailer as a separate kit?
Tebsie
Joined: December 14, 2006
KitMaker: 25 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
KitMaker: 25 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 07:33 AM UTC
If you go on the Panzer DB site there are some really good photos of a Maschinensatz SdAh 24 generator trailer. I might be wrong with this but I believe the SdAh 57ammunition trailer used the same chassis as the generator trailer but had a slightly larger box superstructure for the ammo lockers. On some shots of the SdAh 57 the ammo locker can be seen to reach the full width between the trailer wheel arches. Rear stabilizer jack, and rear skids etc appear the same. The trouble is that most photos are really fuzzy and of course all these details are underneath and in shade, The munition box also seems to differ in design - some had flat roofs, some slightly arched. Compare Herberts photos for the roof and see if you can find another good shot of this trailer on www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/homepage although the image does suffer a bit from focal compression.
In addition has anyone got the old articles on 7/1 and 7/2 from Military Modelling?
There was another type of trailer which carried 2 cm flak ammo . This used a two box design and was fixed to the trailer frame/carriage of a 2cm or 3.7ck flak. Des resin do a conversion for the Tamiya flakverling trailer. Do you think Trumpeter has assumed the SdAh 57 used a flak chassis and not a box section frame design?.
So, going back to the start of this thread, if you look at Herberts pics and and compare the photos of the generator on Panzer DB site and the der Wehrmacht.de photo, there is an over hang to the ammo locker where it's fitted over the generators trailer chassis.
This is as far as I've got with info on these trailers so if anyone has any ideas or opinions or has further info it would be great to know.
Thanks
Nick
In addition has anyone got the old articles on 7/1 and 7/2 from Military Modelling?
There was another type of trailer which carried 2 cm flak ammo . This used a two box design and was fixed to the trailer frame/carriage of a 2cm or 3.7ck flak. Des resin do a conversion for the Tamiya flakverling trailer. Do you think Trumpeter has assumed the SdAh 57 used a flak chassis and not a box section frame design?.
So, going back to the start of this thread, if you look at Herberts pics and and compare the photos of the generator on Panzer DB site and the der Wehrmacht.de photo, there is an over hang to the ammo locker where it's fitted over the generators trailer chassis.
This is as far as I've got with info on these trailers so if anyone has any ideas or opinions or has further info it would be great to know.
Thanks
Nick
wbill76
Joined: May 02, 2006
KitMaker: 5,425 posts
Armorama: 4,659 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 08:10 AM UTC
Bill,
The biggest difference between the two vehicles announced is the gun itself. One has the Flak 37 while the other has the Flak 43.
The biggest difference between the two vehicles announced is the gun itself. One has the Flak 37 while the other has the Flak 43.
GaryGore
Joined: November 05, 2006
KitMaker: 384 posts
Armorama: 338 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 08:14 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I guess it helps to READ the new release and look at the pictures....
After looking at all the images and attempting to sort out the quoted text, I can't tell the difference in the two offerings. Since the two kits seem virtually identical, I'm confused by what Trumpeter is announcing. The only substantial difference seems to be one has a PE shield, while the other's is styrene. But both appear to be "late" versions with squared-off mud guards. Pity Trumpeter isn't releasing one early (e.g., rounded mud guards and perhaps no cab up-armoring) and one late.
I'm not an expert, but I believe the 2 differnet Sd.Kfz 7/2 kits don't reside in the half-track part, but the 37mm Flak Gun part. One has a 37mm Flak 37 (old Tamyia kit type) and the 2nd one has a 37mm Flak 43 (like the new Lion Roar Kit).
Now I can't wait to see Dragon's shot across the bow with their offerings, man am I lucky I didn't buy that Tamyia kit I want a few months ago.
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
Armorama: 8,109 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 08:52 AM UTC
Quoted Text
The biggest difference between the two vehicles announced is the gun itself. One has the Flak 37 while the other has the Flak 43.
Yes, now I see it. Lefties are notoriously dyslexic.
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
Armorama: 8,109 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 09:00 AM UTC
Quoted Text
You can find another good shot of this trailer on http://www.kfzderwehrmacht.de/ homepage.
Wow, Trebsie, what a GREAT resource!
There it all is, folks: a complete listing of the Sd.Ah trailers and their uses. Trumpeter clearly has it wrong for the Sd.Kfz.7/1 since it should have this trailer (the 52), but this kit is also wrong, because it should have the 56 (for the FLAK 37) or 57 (FLAK 43).
Quoted Text
There was another type of trailer which carried 2 cm flak ammo . This used a two box design and was fixed to the trailer frame/carriage of a 2cm or 3.7ck flak. Des resin do a conversion for the Tamiya flakverling trailer. Do you think Trumpeter has assumed the SdAh 57 used a flak chassis and not a box section frame design?
I don't want to assume what Trumpeter might or might not have been thinking. Of course, it's easy to say they should have this or that trailer, but harder to come up with the proper plans and dimensions of said trailers.
Tebsie
Joined: December 14, 2006
KitMaker: 25 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
KitMaker: 25 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 10:35 AM UTC
Hi Bill
Thanks for the response. I think my reasoning behind the sd,ah,57 munnitions trailer having the same chassis as the generator trailer are those clear shots of the leaf springs in that photo. Scroll through the list on that webpage and there is a shot of another Sd ah 24 trailer, with what looks like a wider body as per "our" ammo box, Could be wrong about that but the chassis details are there.
Trumpeter appear to base their trailer on the chassis of the flak carriage which had semi eliptical leaf springs, where the trailer we're interested in has full leaf or cart springs. All the other detrails are there as well, box section frame to the trailer chassis, rear skids and rear jack.
Wheel rim patterns varied a bit too, some as per the wheel in the Lion Roar 3,7cm flak carriage, some similar to those on Steyr and Opels.
Another thing worth looking into: Weiner Models of Germany have marketed a Sd.Ah. 57 and there are good photos of it on their website. No offence meant to anyone, I have seen the kit and It's not a bad interretaion by any means but as with the Trumpeter item I'm not totaly convinced.
Cheers
Nick
Thanks for the response. I think my reasoning behind the sd,ah,57 munnitions trailer having the same chassis as the generator trailer are those clear shots of the leaf springs in that photo. Scroll through the list on that webpage and there is a shot of another Sd ah 24 trailer, with what looks like a wider body as per "our" ammo box, Could be wrong about that but the chassis details are there.
Trumpeter appear to base their trailer on the chassis of the flak carriage which had semi eliptical leaf springs, where the trailer we're interested in has full leaf or cart springs. All the other detrails are there as well, box section frame to the trailer chassis, rear skids and rear jack.
Wheel rim patterns varied a bit too, some as per the wheel in the Lion Roar 3,7cm flak carriage, some similar to those on Steyr and Opels.
Another thing worth looking into: Weiner Models of Germany have marketed a Sd.Ah. 57 and there are good photos of it on their website. No offence meant to anyone, I have seen the kit and It's not a bad interretaion by any means but as with the Trumpeter item I'm not totaly convinced.
Cheers
Nick
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
Armorama: 8,109 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 10:57 AM UTC
Hi, Nick, here is the model you mention from Wiener Modelbau Manufactur (they are actually from Austria, which in German is Wien). It looks like an exact replica of the trailers in Herbert's photos down to the smaller rear door:
Folks, it seems pretty obvious here that Trumpeter has gotten it wrong. Is it a fatal error?
No. But in the interest of accuracy, it needs to be pointed out. Their Sd.Ah. 52 looks a lot like the Sd.Ah. 57, but it ain't it.
And for us "rivet counters," the ammo boxes are a wonderful addition.
Folks, it seems pretty obvious here that Trumpeter has gotten it wrong. Is it a fatal error?
No. But in the interest of accuracy, it needs to be pointed out. Their Sd.Ah. 52 looks a lot like the Sd.Ah. 57, but it ain't it.
And for us "rivet counters," the ammo boxes are a wonderful addition.
H_Ackermans
Joined: July 11, 2006
KitMaker: 2,229 posts
Armorama: 2,221 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 04:43 PM UTC
Well, looking at the pics on kfzderwehrmacht site, there is plenty of scope for additional SdKfz 7 kits. Especially the final model with the lengthened running gear looks special.
spitfire303
Joined: December 22, 2006
KitMaker: 1,437 posts
Armorama: 1,406 posts
Posted: Wednesday, April 29, 2009 - 10:07 PM UTC
I think that it will be my first soft-skin vehicle 
Tebsie
Joined: December 14, 2006
KitMaker: 25 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
KitMaker: 25 posts
Armorama: 6 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 01:27 AM UTC
Bill
Yep that's the kit I was refering too. If anyone else who has follwed this thread has a view it would be great to hear your opinion, not least 'cos I'd like to know if I've got my assumptions about what constitutes a Sd Ah 57 right or not.
The other thing is, does anyone live near the museum where that Sd ah 24 shown on the Panzer DB site is stored. It would be great to get some accurate measurements of that chassis. Scratching or converting the ammo locker shouldn't be a problem. I'd go myself but with the strength of sterling being what it is it will take forever to row the Atlantic.
Cheers
Nick
Yep that's the kit I was refering too. If anyone else who has follwed this thread has a view it would be great to hear your opinion, not least 'cos I'd like to know if I've got my assumptions about what constitutes a Sd Ah 57 right or not.
The other thing is, does anyone live near the museum where that Sd ah 24 shown on the Panzer DB site is stored. It would be great to get some accurate measurements of that chassis. Scratching or converting the ammo locker shouldn't be a problem. I'd go myself but with the strength of sterling being what it is it will take forever to row the Atlantic.
Cheers
Nick
Self-Propelled
Joined: April 01, 2009
KitMaker: 252 posts
Armorama: 229 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 01:29 AM UTC
Anyone checked PMMS today? It looks as if DML is releasing this exact same kit (correct me if I'm wrong) as a 2 in 1 box soon.
Don't know about you guys but I'm kind of getting tired with DML always releasing the same kits as other companies simultaneously, as it seems they do it just to make quick bucks and thus release their kits too soon, before some issues have been sorted out.
Oh well, we'll have to see about this one.
Sebastian
Don't know about you guys but I'm kind of getting tired with DML always releasing the same kits as other companies simultaneously, as it seems they do it just to make quick bucks and thus release their kits too soon, before some issues have been sorted out.
Oh well, we'll have to see about this one.
Sebastian
H_Ackermans
Joined: July 11, 2006
KitMaker: 2,229 posts
Armorama: 2,221 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 01:42 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Anyone checked PMMS today? It looks as if DML is releasing this exact same kit (correct me if I'm wrong) as a 2 in 1 box soon.
Don't know about you guys but I'm kind of getting tired with DML always releasing the same kits as other companies simultaneously, as it seems they do it just to make quick bucks and thus release their kits too soon, before some issues have been sorted out.
Oh well, we'll have to see about this one.
Sebastian
Before some issues have been sorted out? Have you checked the comparison on PMMS between the Trumpeter and DML 7/1 kits?
If you had, you would have read that the Trumpeter kit is the one with the most serious issues, mainly being that the kit is TOO LONG. I think that is one big SERIOUS issue on Trumpeter's kit.
And it's not that DML can just pull a kit out of a big hat, they too have to research and develop a kit.
Self-Propelled
Joined: April 01, 2009
KitMaker: 252 posts
Armorama: 229 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 02:09 AM UTC
Yes, I read the comparison review and I know that the Sd.Kfz.7 isn't the best example because the Trumpeter one has a couple more issues.
As for being able to pull a kit together just like that, well, DML have been working on their Sd.Kfz.7 for how long now? I don't want to guess but it's been ages since it was announced and they were planning on releasing the Zugkraftwagen first and when Trumpeter's Flakvierling was presented, Dragon announced their's just a bit later, and now this. Same thing goes for Tamiya's Jagdtiger released in December.
As for being able to pull a kit together just like that, well, DML have been working on their Sd.Kfz.7 for how long now? I don't want to guess but it's been ages since it was announced and they were planning on releasing the Zugkraftwagen first and when Trumpeter's Flakvierling was presented, Dragon announced their's just a bit later, and now this. Same thing goes for Tamiya's Jagdtiger released in December.
bill_c
Campaigns AdministratorJoined: January 09, 2008
KitMaker: 10,553 posts
Armorama: 8,109 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 04:42 AM UTC
Quoted Text
If you had, you would have read that the Trumpeter kit is the one with the most serious issues, mainly being that the kit is TOO LONG. I think that is one big SERIOUS issue on Trumpeter's kit.
The comparison review is really excellent, because it shows the deficiences of BOTH kits' The T. one is more troubling on some levels of accuracy, though the DML kit, for example, has a less-detailed engine and NO trailer. Modellers can swap trailers from the three T. kits that will soon be in release, whereas NO DML kit can be shown with a correct trailer unless one orders the Wiener Modelbau resin kit referenced above. At 40 Euros, that's a hefty price for accuracy.
And the lack of a completely detailed engine is a definite bougher for DAK scenarios, since numerous photos show these vehicles being driven without the engine bonnet sides. It's not a fatal deficiency, but another thing that will have to be corrected.
If I had the funds, I would order all three kits and do a comparison review for Armorama. I presume PMMS will do one, so I plan on waiting until that before making my decision on which one to purchase.
Strange DML hasn't released its Prime Mover kit yet.
cach7
Joined: October 13, 2002
KitMaker: 444 posts
Armorama: 439 posts
Posted: Thursday, April 30, 2009 - 04:10 PM UTC
Does Trump still plan on releasing the cargo version of the 7???
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Friday, May 01, 2009 - 03:37 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Does Trump still plan on releasing the cargo version of the 7
Yes, no release date though...
cach7
Joined: October 13, 2002
KitMaker: 444 posts
Armorama: 439 posts
Posted: Friday, May 01, 2009 - 04:54 AM UTC
Thanks Jim,maybe Dragon will announce theirs and Trump will get moving on it!!! 
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
Armorama: 9,486 posts
Posted: Friday, May 01, 2009 - 05:02 AM UTC
As a taster...
cach7
Joined: October 13, 2002
KitMaker: 444 posts
Armorama: 439 posts
Posted: Friday, May 01, 2009 - 05:10 AM UTC
More like a teaser!!!!
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