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Armor/AFV: Allied - WWII
Armor and ground forces of the Allied forces during World War II.
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Saipan Sherman USMC
gabo
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Veracruz, Mexico
Joined: January 09, 2006
KitMaker: 20 posts
Armorama: 19 posts
Posted: Friday, October 16, 2009 - 01:49 PM UTC
Hi sirs:

After watching a documentary about the ¨battle for saipan, I saw an single shot of a sherman Tank that capture my attention for their name.. so I beggin a plan to build it, but I ´m still in the process to identify which version could it be., besides if you look carefully you will see that the turret does not have the rear hatch on the left side and the road wheels seems to be the open type.. According to many references this particular tank was an M4A2 but I would like to hear from you, could it be early or a late version?
In the references it said that Juarez belonged to the 4th Tank Div. C co. who fought in the Roi Namur landing and Saipan.
If you have any comment will be very apreciated, thank for your help.. I put some photos That I´ve been taking from the screen..












thanks again for your assistance.

Gabriel
hogarth
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Maryland, United States
Joined: June 02, 2006
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Posted: Friday, October 16, 2009 - 03:06 PM UTC
Late 47 degree hull m4a2. Probably has the oval loader hatch, just not visible from any of the angles. I suppose it's possible that it's not there.

Best option here is either the relatively recent Dragon kit with the wood on it, or the Academy marines kit.
russamotto
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Utah, United States
Joined: December 14, 2007
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Posted: Friday, October 16, 2009 - 06:01 PM UTC
It's a low bustle turret. Both the Academy and newer Dragon M4A2 late PTO have the high bustle turret. Both kits include the open spoke wheels and straight return arm options and wood planking for the sides. The Academy kit includes the wading trunks. Academy kit comes with rubber chevron tracks, DML with steel chevron and a second set with the duckbill extensions. You could buy and aftermarket turret or get a kit with two, like the M4 composite.
GeraldOwens
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Florida, United States
Joined: March 30, 2006
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Posted: Saturday, October 17, 2009 - 01:23 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Late 47 degree hull m4a2. Probably has the oval loader hatch, just not visible from any of the angles. I suppose it's possible that it's not there.

Best option here is either the relatively recent Dragon kit with the wood on it, or the Academy marines kit.



It's a late low bustle turret without a pistol port, which means it probably has the thickened cheek armor on the right front. The last low bustle turrets received the loader's hatch, but these also got the pistol port restored (as on the Dragon Beutepanzer M4A2 Russian/German Sherman kit, and also offered with the M4 composite hull kit), so this tank probably has no loader's hatch. At the moment, no styrene version is available without modification, but there are resin turrets available.
I'm not sure about the hull identification, either. The front angle looks like a 56 degree hull to me. Since the photographer is behind the front edge of the vehicle, the drivers' hoods would be hidden. The suspension has the horizontal return roller brackets with the packing piece to raise the roller axle rather than upswept return roller brackets, which would be unusual on a 1944 hull. I would suggest using the mid production M4A2 kit sold by Dragon as a Sherman III in Sicily (it corrects some detail issues found on Dragon's earlier Tarawa M4A2 kit). Both mid-production and late M4A2's were seen on Saipan.
ALBOWIE
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New South Wales, Australia
Joined: February 28, 2006
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Posted: Saturday, October 17, 2009 - 08:13 PM UTC

Quoted Text








Judging by how far inboard the opened drivers hatch is my guess would be a 56 deg hull but no idea whether it has cast or fabricated hoods. The turret is a mid production Low Bustle with no pistol port but they have cast in cheek armour and no loaders hatch.
DML's Tarawa (Fabricated Hoods) or Sherman III kit (Cast Hoods) would be a good start. If you used the Tarawa one you will need to fix the hood fronts and either kit will need a cheek added from putty. The tarawa and Sher III have t54 Tracks , it is hard to decide whether the pictured one has T48 or T54.
Cheers
Al
gabo
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Veracruz, Mexico
Joined: January 09, 2006
KitMaker: 20 posts
Armorama: 19 posts
Posted: Sunday, October 18, 2009 - 11:20 AM UTC
Hi to all:

Thanks for your answers, although the photos are not so clear and acording to your answers, I will give a try for the Dragon Sherman Tarawa. I know now that I have to reshape the turret, delete the pistol port and correcting some issues in the front hoods, so I hope to show you my advances soon.. I got plans to make from scratch the wading trunk and the cilindrical water tank that some tankers put on the rear hull.

thanks again.. for your wellcome.

Gabo.
GeraldOwens
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Florida, United States
Joined: March 30, 2006
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Posted: Monday, October 19, 2009 - 01:08 AM UTC
If you get the first edition of the Dragon Tarawa Sherman, it has some errors that have since been fixed. The engine grill doors on the rear deck originally had only half as many bars in the grill as the later, corrected kits. Later M4A2 kits correct this, including the Sicily Sherman III kit I mentioned. Fortunately, all of the recent Dragon Shermans include these doors as extra parts, so if you have the Normandy M4, Premium M4A3, M4 Composite Hull or DV M4A1 kits, just grab the doors from that kit. The front edge of the drivers' hoods was too close to the periscope head on the original version, so add a slab of .040" styrene sheet to the front face of the hood to correct this.
If Dragon reissues the Tarawa Sherman kit, the new parts will, of course, be present.
gabo
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Veracruz, Mexico
Joined: January 09, 2006
KitMaker: 20 posts
Armorama: 19 posts
Posted: Monday, October 19, 2009 - 08:01 PM UTC
Hi Gerald:

Ok!!!.. thanks for your advice, I´ll take care of that!.

I ordered the Tarawa Sherman and I´ll take a close look of those issues and make the corrections with the alternate pieces from the others models.

Saludos.

Gabo.
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