Morning Everyone. Can someone tell me about the differences between these two kit? Does one have a 75 M-3 and the other a 76 M-1 (Mk-IIIa) or is one just an up-graded/ retooled version of the other?

Kit #6313 appears to be an early to mid production M4A2 Sherman III with cast driver/co-driver hoods.
#6231 is an mid production M4A2 Sherman III with welded driver/co-driver hoods.
Both tanks are armed with the M3 75mm cannon.
They just represent two variants of the diesel powered M4A2.
CyberHobby produced a very early version #6527 with the DV hull.
Cheers

jjumbo

As mentioned , the kits you asked about are all 75mm variants. The hulls with the welded drivers' hoods were manufactured by Fisher. Other manufacturers (Pullman, Alco, Baldwin, Federal) used the cast hoods. These were all pretty much in production simultaneously during 1942-43.
Dragon did offer the 1944 76mm variant as a Red Army M4A2, as well as a late, 47-degree-hull, dry-stowage 75mm version from Cyber Hobby, depicted as an ex-Russian, captured German "Beutepanzer" version.

These should help too - PMMS reviews:
6231
6313

Jim

Thanx Guy's. I was hoping either of them to be a 47 degree hull (late) but looks like the more severe 56 is used. By the use of the term "Hoods- driver/ co driver" y'all are referring to the hatches even though they're some what conical in shape. Was this a "fix" to get away from the Direct- vision problems, poor ballistics? Also, I have both the DML and Academy M4A2 76(w)'s. One has the exhaust deflector the other doesn't? Yeah, I know, I need "Hunnicut's" Let me know.

Both kits of the M4A2 in British service represent the earlier hull front, where the hatches sit in "hoods" that stick out from the plane of the main glacis plate. This was known as the 56-degree front due to the angle of the main glacis from vertical. The earliest versions of the Sherman had hoods with direct vision blocks protected by armoured flaps cut into the front of them, but as you can guess these were a weak point in the hull when being fired at. The two kits you mentioned represent a change to a fixed forward-facing periscope just in front of the hatch so the DV visor could be eliminated and thre resulting front was thus better protected. The new periscope made the "hoods" stick out even further to make room in front of the hatch. The big problem with all of these "hood" variants was that they were made up of multiple pieces, so were both complex to make and inherently weaker than a single slab of armour plate.

Later Shermans had an improved front that was made of a single plate (with no hoods) set at 47 degrees from vertical. These are also called "big hatch" hulls, since the hatches on top could be made bigger than the old ones in the narrow hoods. Most of these hulls were seen on M4A3s but a few were built as straight M4s. I think diesel M4A2s with the new hull went almost exclusively to the USSR.

The British did not receive M4A3s in any significant quantities, so there was no "Sherman IV" as it would have been classified.

Hope this is useful,

Tom

The Sherman was a work in progress over the war years.
Starting with the M2/M3 hull and suspension, there must have been thousands of modifications and updates over the production run.
The large driver's hatches, the one piece transmision covers, the single piece 47 degree glacis plate, the T23 turret with 76mm cannon, HVSS suspension, 500 HP engine and other features were all part of the "Ultimate" Sherman tank.

Both DML kits that you mentioned are earlier versions of the 56 degree hulled M4A2.
DML makes the better of the two M4A2's with the 47 degree hull.
Academy's Soviet M4A2 had an issue with the rear hull plate being too vertical.
They corrected it in their USMC M4A2 but be wary as they didn't learn their lesson and correct the suspension in their M3 Lees and Grant.
Cheers

jjumbo

Driver's hood refers to the housing that projects out from the glacis plate onto which the driver's hatch and supplementary periscope are mounted. Early tanks had small doors instead of periscopes that allowed the driver to view the outside directly through an armor glass window. These direct vision (DV) ports were difficult to machine perfectly, and sometimes didn't close tightly enough, allowing bullet splash to enter, so they were eliminated in favor of a larger housing with a periscope installed.
If you just want a nice, 1944-period M4A2 for a Soviet or USMC subject (the 47 degree hull M4A2 was apparently not supplied to the British), then Dragon's M4A2 PTO kit is what you need. It has the late hull and a late, high-bustle 75mm turret with reinforced armor casting on the right front and the restored pistol port (mid to late 1943 turrets had no pistol port).
If you want a more oddball variant with the late hull and intermediate turret (low bustle, but with loader's hatch and pistol port), get the Cyber Hobby Beutepanzer (captured) Sherman kit.

Here's a page that explains the hoods/hatches, from a fellow on the AFV News discussion board:
Sherman hoods
Well worth checking the other pages too, I think it's a work in progress, but very helpful.

Jim

Eh Gad, Our troops had to fight with that? Man, the guys in WWII were Titans! Thanx Jim.

Thanx Everybody, The whole hatch/ hood thing came up because I just got Cyberhobbys M4A4 (#9102 ?) and the "hoods" came w/ it. I just couldn't figure out their purpose. Again many thanx, you guys are awesome , Michael. P.S. I'll lie and deny about being a "Shermanoholic" John!