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AFV Painting & Weathering
Answers to questions about the right paint scheme or tips for the right effect.
tamiya help please
imatanker
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 04:20 AM UTC
I have now completed 2 tank models,a panzer and a sherman.They are both VERY basic compaired to most of the stuff I see on this site.I painted them with testors products,which was what i knew from 35 years ago (omg has it been that long since i built something?) I am ready to become more correct in my builds and need to take a big step.I have tamiya spray paint (as i have not purchased an airbrush yet)and their brushables available in my area.I have some questions,What do you clean your brushs with?Can you thin the bottled paint,and if so ,with what? do the products work well ,and are the colors correct?Thanks for your help.J.T.
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 04:40 AM UTC
Tamiya paint is cleaned off of brushes with water.

Tamiya acrylic paint is best thinned with Tamiya thinners at about 40 to 50% paint to 50 to 60% tamiya thinner for an airbrush.

There are other products that can be used to thin Tamiya paint but I suggest you start with the correct thinner before experimenting as it will make it easier for others to help if you have an issue.
imatanker
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 04:54 AM UTC
Sweet,will they work for washs also?What wouldbe the reductoin for that?Use water of thinner?J.T.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 05:05 AM UTC
Hi jtucker

To clear dilution doubts i suggest this link:

http://www.little-cars.co.uk/workbench49.pdf

For washes-filters, in my humble opinion, you should use enamels or oil colors. Acrylics paint dries too fast to obtain good results

I hope this will be helpful for you

Cheers
imatanker
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 08:30 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi jtucker

To clear dilution doubts i suggest this link:

http://www.little-cars.co.uk/workbench49.pdf

For washes-filters, in my humble opinion, you should use enamels or oil colors. Acrylics paint dries too fast to obtain good results

I hope this will be helpful for you

Cheers

I could not open the link for some reason.operator error I think.so the testors model paints would work for washes?
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 09:01 AM UTC
A wash would be 10% paint to 90% thinner as a rough guide.
imatanker
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 09:34 AM UTC

Quoted Text

A wash would be 10% paint to 90% thinner as a rough guide.

Can you suggest some basic colors to start with?Lets say, for rust on tracks,general dirt and grime,or to lighten the overall look of a very dark green sherman? Can washes be used for dust effects also?Thanks again,this site has realy helped me out.J.T.
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 10:32 AM UTC
J if you can give me a couple of days I will try and help you further. A wash is to unify paint colours, a filter is used to cause subtle changes in a base paint colour. To lighten a colour you really need to lighten the base paint colour and then make it darker via the application of filters, or attempt your own colour modulation method of paint application.
imatanker
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 10:54 AM UTC

Quoted Text

J if you can give me a couple of days I will try and help you further. A wash is to unify paint colours, a filter is used to cause subtle changes in a base paint colour. To lighten a colour you really need to lighten the base paint colour and then make it darker via the application of filters, or attempt your own colour modulation method of paint application.

Once again thank you.I will wait for your reply.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 11:41 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I could not open the link for some reason.operator error I think.so the testors model paints would work for washes?







About Testor model paint used for filters, i haven't used them but as far as i know ,Testor model paints are enamels. So i think you won't have problems using them for filters and washes.

In this well-known link, you can find some very clear explanations about filters, washes, pigments, chipping and so on

http://missing-lynx.com/rareworld.htm

I hope that can help you
imatanker
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 12:24 PM UTC
M,thank you,You guys are great!
imatanker
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 12:57 PM UTC
One more question,then off to the bench.When using acrylics ,should a primer be used,or can they be applied to the bare plastic?
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 01:24 PM UTC
It is not a must do but does help. The most important thing is to make sure the model is free of dust and grease from handling, wash the model in a mild detergent such as you use in a washing machine.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 08:36 PM UTC

Quoted Text

One more question,then off to the bench.When using acrylics ,should a primer be used,or can they be applied to the bare plastic?



You can apply acrylic paints on bare plastic, but as Darren said, the model must be very clean and degreased.
Anyway, you said you haven't had an airbrush yet. In my humble opinion painting acryilics with a hand brush on bare plastic could bring you to bad results even if plastic surfaces are shining. An acrylic coat applied with a brush is thicker than one gave with an air brush, so necessarily you need a primer layer to grip it. Otherwise paint excesses will flow away on plastic.
You cold try but if you won't use a primer coat, probably it could be better using Valleyo or Lifecolor paints which are less liquid than Tamiya one.
I remember when i didn't have an airbrush I painted my models just with Humbrol enamels.In my opinion that's the best choice if you don't have an airbrush. Enamels have a longer drying time, and that's avoid the risk to leave ugly brush strokes on the model

Regards
Phil_H
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 11:45 PM UTC

Quoted Text

You cold try but if you won't use a primer coat, probably it could be better using Valleyo or Lifecolor paints which are less liquid than Tamiya one.



Sorry to disagree, but I find that Vallejo ModelColor, when thinned suitably (for both airbrushing and for brush painting), doesn't like to stick to bare plastic. I usually use a primer coat, ironically, using flat Tamiya acrylic paint.

Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Saturday, March 05, 2011 - 11:55 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

You cold try but if you won't use a primer coat, probably it could be better using Valleyo or Lifecolor paints which are less liquid than Tamiya one.



Sorry to disagree, but I find that Vallejo ModelColor, when thinned suitably (for both airbrushing and for brush painting), doesn't like to stick to bare plastic. I usually use a primer coat, ironically, using flat Tamiya acrylic paint.




Well Phil I really don't know. I have a different experience. When i have to paint small details with acrylics, I use Valleyo or (better)Lifecolors paints on bare plastic without any problem. Otherwise I've found very hard using tamiya colors with brush on bare plastic
Maybe it's a matter of different dilution

Regards
Phil_H
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 12:09 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Well Phil I really don't know. I have a different experience. When i have to paint small details with acrylics, I use Valleyo or (better)Lifecolors paints on bare plastic without any problem. Otherwise I've found very hard using tamiya colors with brush on bare plastic
Maybe it's a matter of different dilution

Regards



I like to airbrush a light coat of Tamiya acrylic as a base coat when brush painting with Vallejo MC.

If brush painting with Tamiya acrylic, I find that if you thin it 1 part Tamiya X-20A thinner to three parts paint, it brushes much better (than out of the bottle). You get a longer drying time, allowing the paint to level better. As long as you follow the usual rules (like not overcoating a just dried/partially dry area of paint) you will find that it yields much better results.
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 12:12 AM UTC

Quoted Text


If brush painting with Tamiya acrylic, I find that if you thin it 1 part Tamiya X-20A thinner to three parts paint, it brushes much better (than out of the bottle). You get a longer drying time, allowing the paint to level better. As long as you follow the usual rules (like not overcoating a just dried/partially dry area of paint) you will find that it yields much better results.



Well I'll try for sure. Thanks a lot for the advice
imatanker
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 12:51 AM UTC
So,if I do prime,after the primer dries should the parts be lightly sanded?What grit?Next question,would it be better,until I get an airbrush,to do my base colour with tamiya spray paint.wich I beleive is lacquer based as it will bite into the plastic,and continue on from there with acrylics,for my wahes and stuff?
Spiderfrommars
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 06:08 AM UTC

Quoted Text

So,if I do prime,after the primer dries should the parts be lightly sanded?What grit?


Are you going to use Tamiya primer in spray cans aren't you? Well,in my opinion, you shouldn't sand anithing. Firstable wash carefully the model with a mixture of water and dish soap, rinse it gently and let it dry. After them you should spray two light coat of primer from a distance of at least 30 cm. Two light coats work usually better than a single heavy coat. You should wait at least 20 minutes beetween the first and the last primer coat. After giving the primer, you should wait untill the coat is well cured. I usually wait at least overnight. During the prime drying time you should be careful to repair the model from dust (using a box or a plastic bag) After them you' ll be ready to paint.


Quoted Text

Next question,would it be better,until I get an airbrush,to do my base colour with tamiya spray paint.wich I beleive is lacquer based as it will bite into the plastic,and continue on from there with acrylics,for my wahes and stuff?



To be honest I've never used Tamiya spray paints, cause I don't like spray can. Anyway, as far as I know they are lacquer thinner. If you leave them dry very well , you could in my opinion, on from there do your next steps without any problem. I don't know, probably it could be safer give also a clear spray coat if you are going to do wash and filters with enamels. However that's just my supposition, as I said I never use spray cans

cheers
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 07:57 AM UTC
J due to the questions you are asking I suggets you invest in some of the how to DVD's on the market such as from AK interactive, the reason for this suggestion is every modellor has their own slight variation of just about everything they do. If you get a book or even a DVD it will give you an understanding and grounding in an aspect of the hobby that you can then add variations to make it your own.
imatanker
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 11:09 AM UTC

Quoted Text

J due to the questions you are asking I suggets you invest in some of the how to DVD's on the market such as from AK interactive, the reason for this suggestion is every modellor has their own slight variation of just about everything they do. If you get a book or even a DVD it will give you an understanding and grounding in an aspect of the hobby that you can then add variations to make it your own.

Yes, I know srpay can is a dirty word(two words?) Plan on getting an airbrush ASAP.Through another thread on this website I found out about AK,checked their site and will be ordering the DVDS .But what you guys have told me is a big help and gives me a good starting point.I know some of my questions may sound simple,but remember the last time i built something was 40 years ago.It was an AMT 3in1 kit I think,anyway thank you for what you've done for me,it's been a big help.J.T.
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 01:24 PM UTC
J i don't think any of us mind answering questions but the problem is the written word can only help so much, pictures and movies can tell you a whole lot more in less time and impart better understanding.
imatanker
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 02:51 PM UTC

Quoted Text

J i don't think any of us mind answering questions but the problem is the written word can only help so much, pictures and movies can tell you a whole lot more in less time and impart better understanding.

That is very correct.You gentlemen gave me some good stuff.Hopefully I'm on my way.thanks for all the help.J.T.
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ARMORAMA
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Posted: Sunday, March 06, 2011 - 05:34 PM UTC
J if you blog your build on the site members can help you along as you build.
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