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Wehrmacht rank badges?
Krieg-Hammer
Joined: May 17, 2011
KitMaker: 106 posts
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Posted: Saturday, June 11, 2011 - 09:05 PM UTC
Would it be possible or has it been considered to have Wehrmacht badges of rank on the forum?
retiredyank
Joined: June 29, 2009
KitMaker: 11,610 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 - 09:01 AM UTC
I think it would be considered offensive to have badges of the Nazi army. It's like the swastika. Just has bad conotations.
Tojo72
Joined: June 06, 2006
KitMaker: 4,691 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 - 10:10 AM UTC
Well,put me down as not being offended.
lukiftian
Joined: March 12, 2010
KitMaker: 791 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 - 04:34 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I think it would be considered offensive to have badges of the Nazi army. It's like the swastika. Just has bad conotations.
I like the Russian badges personally, but I have nothing against Wehrmacht, Waffen SS, Imperial Japan, IDF, PRC, Iran.... oh yeah, and Canadian!
The Swastika has no bad connotations in 3/4 of the world, in fact it's a symbol of good luck. And Wehrmacht rank badges wouldn't have them anyway.
And in any event, you see swastikas on Kitmaker all the time. So what?
Btw, just because the Wehrmacht swore an oath to the Fatherland, didn't make them Nazi's per se or mean they loved Hitler (OK some of them did), and as I recall, some of them tried to assassinate him. Much of the officer corps really disliked him and his retinue of clowns.
CMOT
Editor-in-Chief
Joined: May 14, 2006
KitMaker: 10,954 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 - 05:32 PM UTC
Peeps I really don't see this coming to pass.
Krieg-Hammer
Joined: May 17, 2011
KitMaker: 106 posts
Armorama: 92 posts
Posted: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 - 06:17 AM UTC
Ok..... Swastikas you say.... The Wehrmacht (Heer) were separate to the Waffen SS. I didn't ask about them. I suggested the Wehrmacht.
Tell me.... How many 'offending' swastikas/nazi symbols do you see in the Wehrmacht badges of rank? Apart from the breast eagle which would obviously not be included.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Military_rank_insignia_of_the_Wehrmacht
Just a small note, the widely popular game Company of Heroes uses them so can't be that offensive.
Tell me.... How many 'offending' swastikas/nazi symbols do you see in the Wehrmacht badges of rank? Apart from the breast eagle which would obviously not be included.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Military_rank_insignia_of_the_Wehrmacht
Just a small note, the widely popular game Company of Heroes uses them so can't be that offensive.
retiredyank
Joined: June 29, 2009
KitMaker: 11,610 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 - 10:48 PM UTC
last time I checked the swastika was stilled banned in Europe. However, I never said that wehrmacht badges were the same as swastikas. I used them as a comparison. Neither did I say that the wehrmacht were Nazis, but part of the regime. Again, I used it as a comparison. The fact that you can only attack my argument shows your lack of supporting evidence.
Krieg-Hammer
Joined: May 17, 2011
KitMaker: 106 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 16, 2011 - 12:47 AM UTC
Quoted Text
last time I checked the swastika was stilled banned in Europe. However, I never said that wehrmacht badges were the same as swastikas. I used them as a comparison. Neither did I say that the wehrmacht were Nazis, but part of the regime. Again, I used it as a comparison. The fact that you can only attack my argument shows your lack of supporting evidence.
Yes the swastika is banned if displaying it in public. If for historical purposes, ie film and media it is fine. Anyway, I can't see what the problem is for having Wehrmacht badges of rank on this forum. These arent offensive symbols.
CMOT
Editor-in-ChiefJoined: May 14, 2006
KitMaker: 10,954 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 16, 2011 - 01:39 AM UTC
I believe the problem is that that while these symbols are not offensive to you they may be offensive to others. I suspect especially to anyone who is of the Jewish faith or is Russian. I suggest that if my reasons don't cut it with you contact Jim Starkweather who is the site owner via E-mail or PM.
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, June 16, 2011 - 01:46 AM UTC
Quoted Text
last time I checked the swastika was stilled banned in Europe
...as part of any political demonstration. As Rob pointed out, it isn't banned for any legitimate (historical) use or withing movies etc.
One contradiction to all this are aviation modelrs in Germany who cannot display model aircraft publicly with the correct swastika symbol on the tail.
Saying that, the German Technical Museum, in Berlin has several aircraft with Swastikas on their tails... Go figure...
Krieg-Hammer
Joined: May 17, 2011
KitMaker: 106 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 16, 2011 - 02:51 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted Textlast time I checked the swastika was stilled banned in Europe
...as part of any political demonstration. As Rob pointed out, it isn't banned for any legitimate (historical) use or withing movies etc.
One contradiction to all this are aviation modelrs in Germany who cannot display model aircraft publicly with the correct swastika symbol on the tail.
Saying that, the German Technical Museum, in Berlin has several aircraft with Swastikas on their tails... Go figure...
I visted there in 2007 and found it surreal since Swastikas were on display on aircraft, particularly the Luftwaffe uniform they had in the glass cabinet with Iron Cross medals etc. Brilliant museum, especially the warehouse outside with the old motor vehicles.
Anyway, its up to the powers that be if they want to include wehrmacht badges of rank. Perhaps include Soviet also to balance things out... (Yup they'll be offensive to some people also)...
lukiftian
Joined: March 12, 2010
KitMaker: 791 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 16, 2011 - 07:14 PM UTC
Quoted Text
last time I checked the swastika was stilled banned in Europe. However, I never said that wehrmacht badges were the same as swastikas. I used them as a comparison. Neither did I say that the wehrmacht were Nazis, but part of the regime. Again, I used it as a comparison. The fact that you can only attack my argument shows your lack of supporting evidence.
Last time I checked the USA wasn't subject to the laws of Europe. And it isn't banned in all of Europe anyway, I believe it's OK in the UK, Finland, Spain, several other countries.
There would be no swastikas on Wehrmacht badges anyway.
lukiftian
Joined: March 12, 2010
KitMaker: 791 posts
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Posted: Thursday, June 16, 2011 - 07:20 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I believe the problem is that that while these symbols are not offensive to you they may be offensive to others. I suspect especially to anyone who is of the Jewish faith or is Russian. I suggest that if my reasons don't cut it with you contact Jim Starkweather who is the site owner via E-mail or PM.
I had several Jewish girlfriends, none of whom were offended by swastikas except when they were spraypainted by thugs on a synagogue. One of them (the dancer, naturally) even had one tattooed on her ankle. It was made up of doves.
"Anyway, its up to the powers that be if they want to include wehrmacht badges of rank. Perhaps include Soviet also to balance things out... (Yup they'll be offensive to some people also)..."
Actually, the Russian Federation badges don't seem much different from the Soviet ones, but I'd be up for Cuban ones! And North Korea! And Libya. ;-)
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, June 16, 2011 - 07:52 PM UTC
Quoted Text
And it isn't banned in all of Europe anyway, I believe it's OK in the UK, Finland, Spain, several other countries.
I can't speak for Finalnd, but the Swastika is certainly banned in the other two - again when displayed in a political context. Here in Spain, not only is it banned but also the Falangist (Francoist) version of the Spanish national flag along with public display of symbols of the regime. Therefore, the best place to see a display of these symbols, is when Real Madrid play at home - a certain sector of their supporters display these symbols openly despite a complete prohibition. There has been a policy of getting rid of street names associated with the previous regime but it's going slowly in certain parts of the country. I still know of a 'Division Azul Street' and a Plaza which commemorates the Condor Legion.
No swastikas but certainly everything else
Oh and for those who have a nostalgia for Mussolini's symbolism, come to Lugo this weekend - it's a 'celebration of our Roman past' with the center looking as if they're about to welcome 'Il Duce'...
Splinty2001
Joined: October 01, 2004
KitMaker: 283 posts
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Posted: Friday, June 17, 2011 - 03:18 AM UTC
May I suggest Modern Bundeswehr rank insignia as a possible compromise?
Krieg-Hammer
Joined: May 17, 2011
KitMaker: 106 posts
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Posted: Friday, June 17, 2011 - 03:37 AM UTC
Quoted Text
May I suggest Modern Bundeswehr rank insignia as a possible compromise?
What about the NVA of the former East Germany? (Nationa Volks Armee)
Gorizont
Joined: November 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,462 posts
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Posted: Sunday, June 19, 2011 - 11:18 PM UTC
I also thought about the ranks of the Bundeswehr (I served in) and the NVA (Nationale Volksarmee) of the former eastern germany. ( called "DDR" - I was born at that time) 
Both of them could be a good solution or replacement.
The Wehrmacht-ranks are also very interesting... but could be very injuring for some of us.
(but, my "step-grand-dad" was a pilot in the Luftwaffe)
So, a vote can bring the solution for this -special theme-.
greetings...
Soeren
Both of them could be a good solution or replacement.
The Wehrmacht-ranks are also very interesting... but could be very injuring for some of us.
(but, my "step-grand-dad" was a pilot in the Luftwaffe)
So, a vote can bring the solution for this -special theme-.
greetings...
Soeren
Krieg-Hammer
Joined: May 17, 2011
KitMaker: 106 posts
Armorama: 92 posts
Posted: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 12:40 AM UTC
Vote sounds good to me! My step-Grand dad was also in the Wehrmacht.... drafted in as a boy soldier when times were getting desperate!
jimbrae
Joined: April 23, 2003
KitMaker: 12,927 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 12:58 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Vote sounds good to me!
Emmm, I don't want to rain on anyone's parade, but this is a decision for the Site-Owner...
vonHengest
Joined: June 29, 2010
KitMaker: 5,854 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 06:05 AM UTC
I'm still waiting for a USAF Officer option 
MajorPete
Joined: March 27, 2005
KitMaker: 56 posts
Armorama: 49 posts
Posted: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 07:56 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I think it would be considered offensive to have badges of the Nazi army. It's like the swastika. Just has bad conotations.
This is a modeling site here not some hate group."Nazi Army" that paints a pretty broad picture when the guy asked something on wehrmacht badges not a question on SA party uniforms.
exer
Joined: November 27, 2004
KitMaker: 6,048 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 09:47 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Vote sounds good to me!
What do think this is? Some kind of Anarcho syndicalist commune?
Gorizont
Joined: November 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,462 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 10:01 AM UTC
Hmm, okay... sorry for the bad idea with the vote.
But instead we could add Bundeswehr or "NVA" (the old eastern german army) ranks.
I could help with the Bundeswehr-ranks. (they are nearly similar to the shown US-army-ranks)
The NVA -ones can be compared with russian ranks.
What do you think about this?
greetings...
Soeren
But instead we could add Bundeswehr or "NVA" (the old eastern german army) ranks.
I could help with the Bundeswehr-ranks. (they are nearly similar to the shown US-army-ranks)
The NVA -ones can be compared with russian ranks.
What do you think about this?
greetings...
Soeren
Plasticbattle
#003
Joined: May 14, 2002
KitMaker: 9,763 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, June 21, 2011 - 10:49 AM UTC
This is not the first time this particular discussion has come up ... and probably wont be the last. But it usually has the same outcome.
Personally, I think theres more important issues in life!
Personally, I think theres more important issues in life!
richardw
Joined: May 28, 2011
KitMaker: 34 posts
Armorama: 25 posts
Posted: Friday, June 24, 2011 - 09:31 PM UTC
The original question related to Wehrmacht badges, not Nazi regalia.
The Swastika symbol was (as has already been said) an ancient symbol of good fortune. In fact most of the Nazi icons were taken from ancient cultures and mythology, including the "SS" runes or lightning bolts.
As an Englishman, it offends me that my national flag, St Georges Cross, has come to be associated with soccer hooligans, "skinheads" and knuckle dragging mouth breathers.
In America, the "Stars and Stripes" are flown everywhere, it's patriotic and I think that's good. I believe that it's a capitol offence under the American Constitution (please correct me if i'm wrong) to destroy the flag, which is why it's the one terrorist and anti Western groups love to burn.
All this is interesting as a discussion, but is going slightly
Myself, I wouldn't be offended by having Wehrmacht rank badges on site but I can't see it happening. I can't see the use of vile, abusive and obscene language on some sites/forums or in public , being banned either...And that DOES offend me!
Richard
The Swastika symbol was (as has already been said) an ancient symbol of good fortune. In fact most of the Nazi icons were taken from ancient cultures and mythology, including the "SS" runes or lightning bolts.
As an Englishman, it offends me that my national flag, St Georges Cross, has come to be associated with soccer hooligans, "skinheads" and knuckle dragging mouth breathers.
In America, the "Stars and Stripes" are flown everywhere, it's patriotic and I think that's good. I believe that it's a capitol offence under the American Constitution (please correct me if i'm wrong) to destroy the flag, which is why it's the one terrorist and anti Western groups love to burn.
All this is interesting as a discussion, but is going slightly
Myself, I wouldn't be offended by having Wehrmacht rank badges on site but I can't see it happening. I can't see the use of vile, abusive and obscene language on some sites/forums or in public , being banned either...And that DOES offend me!
Richard
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