hey all the modeling bug is biteing again. when i use to build armor
i would wheather the tank with a wash and dry brushing.
and some guys in the club busted my chops saying its not dirty enough lol.
but there tanks looked like crap they over did it. so can i just build
aroma and enjot it with out doing all the wheathering anddry burshing

You can do whatever you want. It's a hobby.

So they are saying that the tank was never new? Never ever cleaned? They have no idea then.. As jesse said, it is your model and you build it the way you want. Remember, many people who heavily weather ther models are only hiding build problems..

I'm with Jesse. It's a HOBBY. And do what you want - and please have FUN when and while you do it! (Nah, no fair trying to have fun when you're not doing it )

On a slightly more-serious vein; I'm with you completely on the general sentiment of folks making their armor builds really dirty and banged-up. That's real and good sometimes, but real AFVs are also at some time in their "lives" clean and even new. Folks have sometimes taken this grunginess to excess and for some it's become some sort of "religion": nastier is nicer. Me? GOOD builds are those which do a GOOD job of depicting whatever vehicle it is in whatever state the builder is trying to portray!

Build it the way you want it to look!

Bob

To me really dirty vehicles look great in an appropriate diorama or base. If your just displaying the builds on a shelf the it's my opinion that some restraint should be used.

Excessive weathering/mud is a great way of hiding poor building skills as well



cheers

Hey Chris, the only guy who has to be happy with the final result is you.

However, I find that there's no shortage of inspirational works built by other modelers, and I'm always striving to achieve some result or other that I've seen on someone else's models.

I'd suggest that if you're not sure where you want to go with a particular model, look around at some other works and find some examples that you admire (or even just certain aspects of some other models that you find appealing). You can then build toward a particular goal that suits you by emulating those models (or those aspects of other models) that you like.

Asking such an open ended question here is likely to get you a bunch of other guys telling you to build your models like they build their own. In other words, just more of the same situtation you find yourself in right now with the other builders in your club.

If you're trying to build to satisfy judges or others with the latest fads and trends in building or painting, you'll never be happy and content with the hobby. Don't ask others if you should or shouldn't do such and such or use some or another technique or method. You'll only ever get answers from guys that either like or don't like whatever it is you're asking about.

Whether or not you weather should depend on what you think looks good and is appropriate for your own models.

However, if you see something YOU LIKE and WANT to do yourself, then by all means ask how it was done so that you can try to do the same. Of course, this is a whole 'nother cat.

In the end, though, build and finish to suit yourself first, foremost, and always.

"Whether to weather, or whether or not to weather, that is the question! 'Tis it better to suffer the slings and arrows of outragious critisisms of too clean or overly dirty tanks or is it better to follow the guidance of our own consciousness and then to weather to suit ourselves and spite our critics and detractors..."

I like doing minor weathering on my models, like panel fades and dry brushing, a couple washes too. But any heavy stuff I would wait for a diorama and do the major wear based on the scene that I would be using the vehicle in. That way the mud, dust, scrapes and damage would be appropriate and fitting to the scene. So since I have not done any my tanks look fairly new overall.

But like mentioned above, do what you feel to, is your models, is your discretion on what you want to do with em. Long as you enjoy your builds and like the results. Once satisfied leave it at that. Can always add to them later more often than not.

Weathering is personal - you have to do what you feel is best for the model. After all, it's you that is doing the hobby, for your own satisfaction.

Others have noted that all tanks start out new at some point, and many get periodic cleanings and repaints. Some even last long enough to get repairs! It all depends on the subject. Any tank driven more than a few miles will get covered in light road dust, and if used "cross-country" it will probably get muddy too. But if that was a training situation the crew would probably hose it down when they returned to camp, so tanks not in combat can spend years getting very little if any visible weathering. Tanks in prolonged combat (such as WW2 German stuff) will possibly accumulate lots of crud and damage, but few lasted long enough to rust or fade much. Tanks in the Middle East might last a long time in non-combat situations, while the harsh nature of the desert environment would make some minor rusting and sun-bleaching more common. So it all depends on the "snapshot" you are aiming to capture with your model. And only you can judge how well you matched it.

The only time this logic breaks down is when you put a model into a competition, where others are invited to judge it. Then it's not about pleasing you, but rather it becomes a game of pleasing the judges. And they often like to see weathering etc. (I've overheard judges marking down perfectly good entries just because they couldn't see much dry-brushing, or some other specific technique.) That's one of the reasons why I don't enter competitions - I don't feel the need to demonstrate familiarity with the latest trend, and I build to suit me alone.

What I would say, though, is that it can't hurt to try out some of the more agressive weathering techniques on a cheapo model or two just to get these techniques into your own "toolbox" of modelling skills. (I personally keep a number of old clunkers in the stash just to act as guinea-pigs while I learn new things - rather than ruining an expensive kit with a failed experiment.) That way if you do build a model that you really feel should be heavily weathered, you'll know how to do it.

The main thing is to please yourself with the results and have fun...

Tom

Mine tend to be on the clean side and is one main reason I do not show any work. I had enough of the "Gate Guard" comments to last me a while.

So, build and finish yours the way you want. I know what you mean by over doing it or over-weathered look but, to each his own.




~ Jeff

I'm a big fan of cleaner builds over heavy weathering, I sometimes think we go a little overboard.

Rust for example I cannot imagine any tank crew allowing their tank to become rusty while on ops so other than a few spots here and there I wouldn't expect to see much rush IRL.

But, as everyone else has said at the end of the day the only judge who it is important to please is yourself.

Well that's your "toy", you can do anything you want

In my opinion is a matter of taste and consistency.

General speaking, if your aim is to emphasize the "technical aspects" of your subject, doing a clean model set on a simply wooden base, probably is the more consistent solution.
Otherwise if your goal is to emphasize the historical aspects of your tank, well maybe a diorama and a wheathered tank would be better. Personally I prtefere wheaterd models and i think that the cleaner ones always look lake toys , but as I told before, that's just a matter of taste

And well, of couse, regarding the consistence, the whatering has to be "correct". You can often see incredibly worn models which depict real subjects that actually have never been in those bad conditions or you can also see models buried by mud set for exemple in urban dioramas or too dirty indeed to look realistic.

My two cente anyway

Cheers

He, He! I've taken that to a new level, building some kits AS museum displays! (Complete with diorama base of painted concrete, "keep off the tank" barriers, etc...) I've even got an SU-100 with shiny paint, white-edged fenders, and no external stowage, mounted on a raised plinth. Variety is the spice of modelling life!

Oh, and I do get a kick out of showing them, just waiting for those "too clean" comments...

Tom

To me a pristine freshly painted tank looks too much like a toy,I think you need at least minimal weathering or dusting,to go full all out is a personal decision,but I think armor needs something.

However that being said,I have no problem leaving my planes,jets,and ships,un-weathered and pristine.It's just prefrence.

I just wanted to add the advice I received from a master modeler when I came back to the hobby a few years ago: Find the extreme and then you'll find it much easier to dial the weathering back. I've tried to follow his advice and as a result I've produced progressively dirtier vehicles. Ultimately, though, I agree with the sentiment above ... it's a matter of preference.

W H E T H E R you decide to W E A T H E R your model is up to you. If it is just going to sit on a plain shelf then I would suggest a mild weather but if you are going to place it in a vignette or small dio then something more realistic/heavier could be warranted. i would suggest you pick some photos and go from there.

Thank guys. i forget its a hobby and i need to stop what other people think.
and if i want to have a clean build its fine. but i hate over doing the wheathering thanks again

As others have said, it's really up to you. In recent years I have seen that cleaner or slightly weathered models are getting more popular - maybe because today's kits are more detailed, more PE, etc. Also, the tried and true methods of drybrushing/washing are being supplemented by other techniques. I do mostly slightly weathered looks, unless it's a factory or parade vehicle (cleaner) or if it's a diorama-specific need (hedgerows, desert, Eastern fron mud) more weathering will be required. My only advice is subtle drybrushing - avoid the 70's style "frosted" look. Most important have fun!

I think when it comes to weathering you have to look at it like this, what do you want to say with this model.

Do you want to say it just rolled off the assembly line and it's on it's way to the troops.

Or has it been in their hands for a while which is either at war or not at war and what part of the world it's in. Has it been there for a lot of years getting repainted a bunch of times and with many miles and hours on it.

Is it in a war zone, what part of the world and what war, what part of the war.

My point is to pick a time period in the life of that vehicle. Or even the end of the life of the vehicle as in it's destruction, or even during it's rebuilding.

So like I say pick a time in the life of that vehicle like a time in a person's life and make it look like it's in that time period. Most vehicles have a long life and go through a lot of changes.

I think that is the most satisfying to build. Knowing in your mind exactly what time period th vehicle is in. For instance take a M113, is it 1965-69 in the USA or in Germany or in Vietnam at war. Is it getting the ACAV kit installed? Was it just in a fire fight or going into one? Was it coming back from the field and getting cleaned up for inspection?

Once you ask the questions and get answers you have a complete history to follow and that to me is the best way to do it. It brings it to life and gives it a place in time and everything makes sense.

Too much weathering is bad if the rest of the vehicle does not have the age on it in the correct areas, everything has to match. For instance a highly weathered Vietnam war M48A3 that still has pristine fenders would look wrong. The first thing that happens is the fenders get mangled, that's what I mean by it all making sense.