_GOTOBOTTOM
Armor/AFV: Modern - USA
Modern Armor, AFVs, and Support vehicles.
Hosted by Darren Baker
M1163 Internally Transportable Vehicle
windysean
Visit this Community
Wisconsin, United States
Joined: September 11, 2009
KitMaker: 1,917 posts
Armorama: 735 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 12:31 AM UTC
I read that the M1163 was deployed to Afghanistan, along with the MV-22 Osprey, but the only stories I find are questions of the Osprey's safety. There was a mention that it's been doing missions for 5 years now. Does anyone have first-hand knowledge?
What I'm really looking for are photos of the M1163 in regular use-- is it being used? The interwebs seem only to have prototype test vehicles.
thanks in advance,
Sean H.
Frenchy
Visit this Community
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,719 posts
Armorama: 12,507 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 01:02 AM UTC
I guess that in Afghanistan the EFSS M327 120mm mortar is usually towed by a MRAP instead of the dedicated M1163 because of the IED threat...



First EFSS operational use in Afghanistan :

http://www.blackanthem.com/News/U_S_Military_19/EFSS-goes-to-war-fires-first-combat-rounds23284.shtml

Frenchy
windysean
Visit this Community
Wisconsin, United States
Joined: September 11, 2009
KitMaker: 1,917 posts
Armorama: 735 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 01:57 AM UTC
Rats, I meant the longer M1161, not the mortar-towing M1163. That's interesting though. That was the biggest complaint-- whether the U.S. needs a softskin vehicle anymore. The argument being that it would be used in quick offensive actions, when speed, not defense, is the intention.
Thanks though, Frenchy! I was counting on you to have the information!
-Sean
WarWheels
Visit this Community
Illinois, United States
Joined: March 24, 2006
KitMaker: 1,816 posts
Armorama: 1,402 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 02:13 AM UTC
Sean. I don't think I can answer your questions, but FWIW, here is a link to our Growler vehicle index at WarWheel.net: http://www.warwheels.net/M1161GrowlerITVindex.html
windysean
Visit this Community
Wisconsin, United States
Joined: September 11, 2009
KitMaker: 1,917 posts
Armorama: 735 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 02:54 AM UTC
Yes, Patrick, there are a nice selection of pics on the WarWheels site, but not sure if those are mostly prototypes. There is a notable variation in the headlights among the different photos. It's all good though!
thanks,
Sean.
Frenchy
Visit this Community
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,719 posts
Armorama: 12,507 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 03:46 AM UTC
In fact you can find pics showing operational M1161 ITVs during training with USMC units like this one :

"ATLANTIC OCEAN (Dec. 2, 2011) Marines assigned to Marine Expeditionary Unit 24 (24 MEU) conduct weapon familiarization drills on the flight deck of the multi-purpose amphibious assault ship USS Iwo Jima (LHD 7). Iwo Jima Amphibious Ready Group is currently underway conduction a composite training unit exercise in preparation for an upcoming deployment. (U.S. Navy photo by Mass Communication Specialist Seaman Apprentice Jonathan L. Correa/Released)" :



Full size

but I've yet to see one deployed in Afghanistan

Frenchy
Trisaw
Visit this Community
California, United States
Joined: December 24, 2002
KitMaker: 4,105 posts
Armorama: 2,492 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 05:32 AM UTC
This vehicle has an "M" designation, so I take that it was built? I read that the Growler had some performance issues as a prototype so I'm surprised it was even purchased and produced. Would be nice to see as a kit...I think it'll be simple enough to make...if beyond prototypes.
Thatguy
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: November 09, 2008
KitMaker: 487 posts
Armorama: 451 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 06:30 AM UTC

Quoted Text

This vehicle has an "M" designation, so I take that it was built? I read that the Growler had some performance issues as a prototype so I'm surprised it was even purchased and produced. Would be nice to see as a kit...I think it'll be simple enough to make...if beyond prototypes.

There were 3 variants initially, but this has been reduced to 2 (M1161 and M1163; the M1162 was dropped). Whatever issues there were have been either worked out or forgotten about since there was a major desire on the part of the USMC to replace the G-Wagon "Interim" FAVs (IFAVs) that had previously been in service with the MEUs.
Frenchy
Visit this Community
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,719 posts
Armorama: 12,507 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2012 - 06:40 AM UTC

Quoted Text

This vehicle has an "M" designation, so I take that it was built?


By August 2011, the USMC had received 209 M1161s and 102 M1163s, and 42 M1163s were on order, but it seems that all the problems haven't been totally ironed out...

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/2012/05/marine-growler-fleet-suspended-crash-throttle-051212w/


Frenchy
windysean
Visit this Community
Wisconsin, United States
Joined: September 11, 2009
KitMaker: 1,917 posts
Armorama: 735 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2012 - 04:04 AM UTC
So there are 300 of these hidden away in the Marines ships, but nobody's using them for there intended purpose? I would like to believe that fast insertion teams are using them but not taking pictures.
Anyway, thanks everyone.
-Sean.
Trisaw
Visit this Community
California, United States
Joined: December 24, 2002
KitMaker: 4,105 posts
Armorama: 2,492 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2012 - 05:40 AM UTC

Quoted Text

So there are 300 of these hidden away in the Marines ships, but nobody's using them for there intended purpose? I would like to believe that fast insertion teams are using them but not taking pictures.
Anyway, thanks everyone.
-Sean.


Agreed. As far as I know, USMC were still using the Mercedes G IFAV, but the article stated that since 2009, USMC has been using the ITV.

Odd too because the ITV looks just like a smaller jeep with no passenger MG or lengthened cargo bed. Is this really what the USMC wanted?
Thatguy
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: November 09, 2008
KitMaker: 487 posts
Armorama: 451 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2012 - 08:20 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Agreed. As far as I know, USMC were still using the Mercedes G IFAV, but the article stated that since 2009, USMC has been using the ITV.

The IFAVs should be completely phased out by now. These vehicles are primarily to be used by the MEUs, so its perhaps not surprising that they haven't seen much use. There was some limited IFAV use in Iraq and Afghanistan IIRC, during the initial period of operations in both locations. MRAPs have since become the patrol vehicle of choice.


Quoted Text

Odd too because the ITV looks just like a smaller jeep with no passenger MG or lengthened cargo bed. Is this really what the USMC wanted?

The M1161 has a long wheel base and a ring mount for a machine gun or automatic grenade launcher. The M1163 has a short wheel base and is intended to be used as a light tractor to tow the EFSS mortar and the ITV cargo trailer (M1164). There were some serious questions about the award of the ITV contract to General Dynamics for the Growler.
Frenchy
Visit this Community
Rhone, France
Joined: December 02, 2002
KitMaker: 12,719 posts
Armorama: 12,507 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2012 - 08:31 AM UTC

Quoted Text

There were some serious questions about the award of the ITV contract to General Dynamics for the Growler.


Ditto !

http://snafu-solomon.blogspot.fr/2012/06/growler-itv-debacle-warning-to-socom.html

Frenchy
 _GOTOTOP