The Smart Kit that is......
http://www.missing-lynx.com/reviews/german/dml6268reviewcs_1.html
As far as I'm aware late G's didn't have it so am I correct in thinking this shouldn't have zimmerit . Just thought I'd check as I might be starting mine in the next day or two.
Hosted by Darren Baker
Should Dragons Panther G have zimmerit?
Beastmaster
Joined: January 27, 2009
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Posted: Monday, January 21, 2013 - 04:22 PM UTC
Tiger_213
Joined: August 10, 2012
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Posted: Monday, January 21, 2013 - 04:39 PM UTC
In August of '44 they were ordered to stop all applications of zimmerit. And the G model was only started production in March so it should not have the zimmerit.
AFVFan
Joined: May 17, 2012
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Posted: Monday, January 21, 2013 - 05:17 PM UTC
As Christopher pointed out, there were some built during the zim period. That means the choice is yours whether to add it or not.
Tiger_213
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Posted: Monday, January 21, 2013 - 05:24 PM UTC
As a side note; they banned applications of zimmerit because of rumors that it was catching fire when damaged in combat.
ElMorientez
Joined: November 28, 2012
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Posted: Monday, January 21, 2013 - 09:17 PM UTC
There are quite a few examples of Panther Ausf.G with zimmerit. The Panther G currently being restored in Saumur had it, and the Panther G the british captured and named "Cuckoo" had it applied. Here's a few examples i quickly found....
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/071.jpg
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/131.jpg
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/189.jpg
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/071.jpg
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/131.jpg
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/189.jpg
Hederstierna
#247
Joined: January 03, 2008
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Posted: Monday, January 21, 2013 - 10:11 PM UTC
Yes, but as alreaddy stated, the Panthers produced after September 1944 did not have zimmerit, so Panther G's produced before that, were zimmerit coated. Some of these vehicles did survive to the end of the war, and were used by the French armed forces after the war.
Regards
Jacob
Regards
Jacob
PantherF
Joined: June 10, 2005
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Posted: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 - 02:13 AM UTC
THAT Late Production Panther with the steel wheel at the last station should have NO zimm!
HTH
~ Jeff
HTH
~ Jeff
Beastmaster
Joined: January 27, 2009
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Posted: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 - 12:41 PM UTC
Thanks guys. Just thought I'd check and saves the hassle of adding Zimmerit to it.
Tiger_213
Joined: August 10, 2012
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Posted: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 - 01:08 PM UTC
Quoted Text
There are quite a few examples of Panther Ausf.G with zimmerit. The Panther G currently being restored in Saumur had it, and the Panther G the british captured and named "Cuckoo" had it applied. Here's a few examples i quickly found....
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/071.jpg
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/131.jpg
http://www.panzernet.net/panzernet/fotky/tanky/pz5/189.jpg
Sean, not to be a jerk, but you've decided to prove your self wrong. All late Ausf. G's have the all steel road wheels as I understand it. So they shouldn't have zimmereit applied. All of your pictures show rubber-rimmed wheels.
They're nice pictures though.
Killian
Joined: November 26, 2005
KitMaker: 30 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 - 05:20 PM UTC
I have kit n° 6370, which is this kit + the earlier small diameter idler wheel and steel wheels overall, to represent a Panther of the September 1944 production, and I confirm : NO zimmerit.
The kit you have is the late production G, the earliest tank you can build with that one is a tank of the October 1944 production batch : definetely no zimmerit on those, and "factory" 3-tone paint scheme.
If you can get a set of early idler wheels, you could eventually build Panther "202" of the Leibstandarte which was a Daimler built vehicle with a recycled zimmerited tower, but that's about it.
Dragon have done the Panther G of the pre-september production as a kit in their "zimmerit" series.
The kit you have is the late production G, the earliest tank you can build with that one is a tank of the October 1944 production batch : definetely no zimmerit on those, and "factory" 3-tone paint scheme.
If you can get a set of early idler wheels, you could eventually build Panther "202" of the Leibstandarte which was a Daimler built vehicle with a recycled zimmerited tower, but that's about it.
Dragon have done the Panther G of the pre-september production as a kit in their "zimmerit" series.
Hederstierna
#247
Joined: January 03, 2008
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Posted: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 - 09:29 PM UTC
Christopher, sorry, but only around 20 something Panthers were steel wheelers. Some of the final vehicles produced by MAN had a steel wheel on the last outer road wheel station.
Jacob
Jacob
Tiger_213
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Posted: Tuesday, January 22, 2013 - 09:48 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Christopher, sorry, but only around 20 something Panthers were steel wheelers. Some of the final vehicles produced by MAN had a steel wheel on the last outer road wheel station.
Jacob
Really? Sounds just as likely. I remember reading that the 'late' Ausf. G's were all steel wheels. I stand corrected. I learned something today!
blaster76
Joined: September 15, 2002
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Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 - 03:01 PM UTC
I had almost forgotten what it was like to see mature people disagree on a web site. I read the world of tanks forums all the time and when you get differing opinions it just gets plain stupid and absolutely irrational with stuff being thrown in about your heridty (or lack of) and how well you play the game. I havae always appreciated teh wealth of knowledge available on this site as well as the matue and responsible ways we deal with each other. Trolls don't last long here.
Tiger_213
Joined: August 10, 2012
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Posted: Wednesday, January 30, 2013 - 03:26 PM UTC
Quoted Text
I had almost forgotten what it was like to see mature people disagree on a web site. I read the world of tanks forums all the time and when you get differing opinions it just gets plain stupid and absolutely irrational with stuff being thrown in about your heridty (or lack of) and how well you play the game. I havae always appreciated teh wealth of knowledge available on this site as well as the matue and responsible ways we deal with each other. Trolls don't last long here.
I believe that the source of information about 'all Late G's having steel wheels' was presumed due to MAN picking up a majority of Late G production as factories were bombed or captured. And they were technically right, for about twenty examples, and considering in the whole war only around 6,000 Panthers were built, 20 vehicles would make a fairly large portion of all Late Ausf. G's.
Sorry if I've ever harassed you on WoT; I just feel the urge to put stupid-people-who-act-stupidly in their place when I can.
And plus, I sort of have to agree with people here. Many people on this forum have been building models and researching all this good stuff longer than I've been alive.
Chillidragon
Joined: September 20, 2012
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Posted: Thursday, January 31, 2013 - 11:26 AM UTC
Somewhat tangential, but...
Rumours of fire? I thought that the Zimmerit coating needed to be hardened by a pass with a blow torch. I wish I could remember where I read that...
Another reason for discontinuing it was the lack of magnetic anti-tank grenades in any army but one - the Germans. Perhaps they applied it as a deterrent to stop the soviet Union from developing such a grenade.
Rumours of fire? I thought that the Zimmerit coating needed to be hardened by a pass with a blow torch. I wish I could remember where I read that...
Another reason for discontinuing it was the lack of magnetic anti-tank grenades in any army but one - the Germans. Perhaps they applied it as a deterrent to stop the soviet Union from developing such a grenade.
Tiger_213
Joined: August 10, 2012
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Posted: Thursday, January 31, 2013 - 11:56 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Somewhat tangential, but...
Rumours of fire? I thought that the Zimmerit coating needed to be hardened by a pass with a blow torch. I wish I could remember where I read that...
Another reason for discontinuing it was the lack of magnetic anti-tank grenades in any army but one - the Germans. Perhaps they applied it as a deterrent to stop the soviet Union from developing such a grenade.
Zimmerit is made with a pretty fair amount of saw dust in it, as well as chemicals involved in making glow-in-the-dark items and also used with old film photography. Plus the addition of polyvinyl acetate, which is pretty much wood glue. Plus you've got paint and possibly spilled fuel.
Chillidragon
Joined: September 20, 2012
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Posted: Thursday, January 31, 2013 - 12:23 PM UTC
Interesting. Sounds almost like Fibreboard!
RotorHead67
Joined: May 07, 2003
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Posted: Thursday, January 31, 2013 - 02:29 PM UTC
Gentlemen;
Don't intend to feed a fire....But Late Panther G's w/ steel
wheels indeed Did not have zimmerit, but those few do not compare to the more number of late G's w/ rubber rim wheels
that did possess zimmerit. To make an arbitrary statement of
build features is inaccurate. That is why it is always irreproachable to model a specific tank from an actual photo.
I don't Think there is any arguing or disputing what the photo
shows, regardless of ones own personal opinion. That's why I always build with photographic reference. We educate others
with documented reference, not ideas or beliefs of manufacture. This is why contest judging is CRITICAL to being Well informed.
Don't intend to feed a fire....But Late Panther G's w/ steel
wheels indeed Did not have zimmerit, but those few do not compare to the more number of late G's w/ rubber rim wheels
that did possess zimmerit. To make an arbitrary statement of
build features is inaccurate. That is why it is always irreproachable to model a specific tank from an actual photo.
I don't Think there is any arguing or disputing what the photo
shows, regardless of ones own personal opinion. That's why I always build with photographic reference. We educate others
with documented reference, not ideas or beliefs of manufacture. This is why contest judging is CRITICAL to being Well informed.
Removed by original poster on 02/01/13 - 02:48:57 (GMT).
jrutman
Joined: April 10, 2011
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Posted: Friday, February 01, 2013 - 02:35 AM UTC
The inclusion of the steel wheels was a test to see if they worked well enough to be put in final production and thus there were a limited number so equipped. The late production Panthers issued to the LSSAH,for instance,that had all steel wheels were all issued to company and platoon leaders in the 1st and 2nd companies of the combined Panzer Bn. There were not enough tanks on hand to fully equip the whole 1st Bn so the other 2 companies were given late model PzIVs and the missing 2nd Bn was replaced by attaching the 501 Heavy tank Bn to the 1SS PzRegt.
I can only surmise that the steel wheel test did not work out as they went back to the rubber rims for the rest of production.
J
I can only surmise that the steel wheel test did not work out as they went back to the rubber rims for the rest of production.
J
Chillidragon
Joined: September 20, 2012
KitMaker: 104 posts
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Posted: Friday, February 01, 2013 - 08:56 PM UTC
As for modelling from a photograph - I always model railway rolling stock this way, mking 'portraits' of specific wagons after Geoff Kent (well known railway modeller and author). I wholeheartedly recommend it for accuracy and extra satisfaction.
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