I have a dio planned for this Miniart kit which involves still water down at the end of the stairs.. with maybe a couple of things floating in it (maybe a dead body).. and the water part won't be large. I was wondering what is the best (easiest) product I can get to simulate still water like that?



Thanks in advance for any advice
Hisham

Don't have great clues for you, but check on the ship and Railroad sites. They may use a 'clearcast' product that's a two part resin. And I've seen a few good tricks qith gel coat medium or gloss, but that might take a lot for this size part...

Envirotex
It's a two part resin that works well for still water

Example:

I second the envirotex, I use it for all my water, if you need ripples or other effects you can brush gel medium over top after it dries.
- John

Thanks for the advice.. I'll look up this Envirotex and see where I can get it.

Any tutorials on using it? Like how thick it should be and things like that?

Hisham

Is this the same stuff you're talking about?

http://www.amazon.com/Environmental-Technology-8-Ounce-Pour-On-Finish/dp/B001CEMU3I/ref=sr_1_5?ie=UTF8&qid=1384297327&sr=8-5&keywords=envirotex+resin

Hisham

On the diorama in the photos, I poured two layers each about 1/8 inch. I painted the base to create the murky depth then poured the material. After it was completely dry, I poured a layer of 'Kleer' or 'Future' acrylic floor polish and dropped the leaf and debris onto it.
Be sure that you have a sealed area to pour on the envirotex as like water it will seek any opening, however small, and leak out.
The environtex tends to 'creep'up onto things so be aware and be sure to pour it into the base slowly and carefully.

Edit: that said, I've seen guys pour this stuff very thick (several inches) about 1/4 inch at a time. I was more concerned with the illusion of depth and worried that a pour too thick would end up too heavy

Cheers,
C.

Yes that's it

Charles,
What did you use for the weeds/reeds or whatever it is.
looks awesome-

Thanks for the pointers, Charles.. so, the things like the barrel and the pegs holding up the planks.. do you fix all those to the base and then pour the stuff around Them, or do you stick them in it after you pour it and while it's still wet?

Hisham

John,
Thanks for the kind comment. The reeds came from a craft shop and were being sold as a broom for dolls. I bought a bunch and tore them apart.

Hisham,
Everything that protrudes from the 'water' was fixed to the base first (reeds, tank, walkway supports, tree et al)
Only the soldiers and the planks they are fixed to were added after the Environtex.

Cheers,
C.

Thanks for the advice and tips, Charles.. and that dio does look very nice with convincing water effect.

Problem is I can't find a store that ships Envirotex to Egypt.. So, have you had experience with Vallejo Still Water (Item number 26230).. I found it at a hobby store in HK, where I usually buy my stuff.. and the price is comparable to Envirotex. Do you know if it's basically the same kind of material, or something totally different?

Thanks again
Hisham

Hey Guy, you should try" Realistic Water" by Woodland Scenics. I have had good luck on ponds and fountains.

Hi,
Please allow me to make an other suggestion, so look for Polyester Resin.
It is a low cost material and you could find it at places that sell products for Boat repairs, Waterproofing, Construction Materials, Building Chemicals etc.
I use this one

and as I know Polycraft has some similar solutions even on ebay.


Also found (after a little search) that Bosun Bobs’s is an online shop that ship to Egypt (link to product).

The Polyester Resin is totally transparent or light blue-ish transparent, and works with a small amount of catalyst.

In cases that the water layer is short, or I just want "dirty waters", I also add (before catalyst) some drops of very diluted enamel color, to avoid the showing of bottom ground.






Some practice it would be fine.

Happy modeling!

Dimitris, those look great. I expect this material works out cheaper than the hobby oriented materials; one question, do you know if the resin will melt or damage aplastic model? Like, is it safe to embed plastic in it? It looks like you may have done that with the oil drums. How about the paint as well, is it OK with the resin? I recall this kind of stuff is quite smelly with lots of solvent, is that right?
Hisham, I think the Vallejo water is much more gel like, sets soft, and is shades of blue; not really sure it is aimed at modellers, though I'm willing to be contradicted.

Hi Matthew,
First of all the Thixotropic Polyester Resin I use is safe for plastic - but not for the Dow styrofoam of course

Regarding the paint in resin, yes it is fine to use enamels. Actually I use a strong thinner as it is the nitrocellulose thinner, but could be use the White Spirit as well.

And yes, is a quite smelly ...but other stuff at my workplace are smelly too glue, Humbrol thinner (I hate acrylics - sorry mates) etc.

BTW I use many stuff for water simulation. Vallejo Still Water is my favorite, for use at thin and complete transparent layers.

Dimitris, thanks for the explanation and photos of your bases. Your work looks exceptional, I visited your website, downloaded your pdf and I'm impressed with what you are doing... well done!

Mario

Artist's clear acrylic gel is the safest, cheapest, and quickest way to make still water. Make your sub-surface of celluclay and color it. Install any sunken debris and apply several coats of acrylic gell, letting each coat dry thoroughly between. The gel goes on opaque whitish, but dries clear, and each coat shouldn't be more than a few millimeters deep otherwise it won't dry properly. Many model shipbuilders use acrylic gel for water, so it does have it's merits. If you use thick gel, you can form small waves and ripples. The gel can also be tinted in the successive layers to suggest depth.

And if it's not too deep you can use futuer floor plolish as I did in the dio, through the vally of death. Only problem is it takes time to build up as it evaporates a bit. You can tint it also.

Thanks to all for all the suggestions. Unfortunately, I will have to go with the product I can have shipped to Egypt.. which, so far, looks like Vallejo's Still Water. But I'll keep looking, maybe I'll find a store that ships one of those other products.

Dimitris, those are some great looking bases you got there. You even have the same one I want to do and that's exactly what I had in mind for the water part.

You mentioned that you use the Vallejo Still Water.. does it come with instructions? Is it easy to use.. like do you just pour it and let it dry? I think I'll go ahead and order one and try it out. Does that 200 ml bottle do a big space?

Thanks again to everyone
Hisham

Hi Hisham
Thank you (all) for your kind words.

I have used the Vallejo Still Water (at the small base) at many-many layers to have this result - although the puddle it is shallower.
When every layer was dried its level descended, so I added an other layer and again ...and again
Actually there are instructions of use on the bottle.



Also some useful Q&A here (look at the chapter #9).

I never tried this material to big areas. I think it will cost you a lot, of money ...and time.

I was at a model railroad structure show
( http://modelrailroadexpo.com/ ) last Friday and Saturday and got a good tip in a clinic for fighting Envirotex "creep", which I suspect many of the similar products also exhibit. The cause for this is capillary action, and the speaker said you could combat it by painting surfaces with Envirotex before the pour.

Of course, that would be impossible with the reeds that Charles used, and it also requires that you know what your final water effect height is going to be. I just had a thought - you could perhaps use water to test the effectiveness of your seals for the Envirotex, and also use that to mark your "high water line".

I'd suggest mixing a very small batch for just this purpose, and using a small - but disposable - brush. If you do this from your main batch, there's too much of a chance that you'll get distracted and let it harden too much to get a good pour.

Charles also mentioned an "illusion of depth". One way to achieve this is to use coloring agents (green, brown ?) for the bottom layer of ~ 1/8", and then maybe a light blue for a middle layer, and clear for the top one. You could also add things, such as very small fish or "half-floating" plant material, into the middle layer(s) to really create a sense of depth. I've read that it's easy to use too much color, so research on the web first (material and technique)and test in a small area before applying this on your dio.

The last thing is to make sure you have/use a level, as otherwise the Envirotex is going to flow right over the lowest edge of your containment dam.