Hi Everyone,
I have recently purchased this Vignette base:
Now I am not sure what would be the difference between a diorama and a vignette? is it just size?
My main question is a about the inside of the corner building, as you can see from the photo, it is a two story building and my question is that in case I put a figure on the top floor would I need to provide a means of getting up there, like a ladder for example?
I ask about that because I noticed the edges of the corner building are very clean cut, this maybe means that this is just part of bigger building and it has been cut by the diorama limits but is not the full structure? or is it?
What do you think?
Hosted by Darren Baker
Help Understanding a Vignette
helkaissy
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Posted: Wednesday, January 01, 2014 - 10:04 PM UTC
roudeleiw
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Posted: Wednesday, January 01, 2014 - 10:14 PM UTC
Hi Hussein
Put someone in there without ladder, IMO absolutely no problem. The ladder is outside the view. Basta! :-)
Claude
Put someone in there without ladder, IMO absolutely no problem. The ladder is outside the view. Basta! :-)
Claude
muddyfields
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Posted: Wednesday, January 01, 2014 - 10:25 PM UTC
Hi Hussein
I'd go with No Ladder as it would have to be so Upright that it wouldn't look right in the space provided.
I always cut the edges of My builds nice & tidy where they Go Off the Base so to define the boundary of the scene & then Paint them Black so they are Not the same as the rest of the building. The difference with a vignette against Diorama is the amount of space for Figures or vehicle. In a vignette you usually only have a small vehicle ( if used)& maybe 2-3 figure's not much more anything more & I'd class that as a diorama.
Watching to see what You do with this. Good Luck
I'd go with No Ladder as it would have to be so Upright that it wouldn't look right in the space provided.
I always cut the edges of My builds nice & tidy where they Go Off the Base so to define the boundary of the scene & then Paint them Black so they are Not the same as the rest of the building. The difference with a vignette against Diorama is the amount of space for Figures or vehicle. In a vignette you usually only have a small vehicle ( if used)& maybe 2-3 figure's not much more anything more & I'd class that as a diorama.
Watching to see what You do with this. Good Luck
1stjaeger
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Posted: Wednesday, January 01, 2014 - 11:03 PM UTC
Building is artificially cut off, i.e. no ladder!!
Difference between dio and vignette is less the size than rather the story IMHO. Vignette for me is simply a form of display....vehicle alone is boring, so I add a (couple of) figure(s) and half a ruin/wall. Story...none, not included in the concept.
Take a couple of Bill Horan figures together on a small base...and it is a diorama, because the figures are telling a story.
Cheers
Romain
Maki
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Posted: Thursday, January 02, 2014 - 01:34 AM UTC
A bit off topic, but... can you tell me what is the base and where you got it from?
Mario
Mario
helkaissy
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Posted: Thursday, January 02, 2014 - 02:15 AM UTC
Hi Mario
Its "corner vignette" by north roads.
I got if from Hobby link but it was their last piece.
Hussein
Its "corner vignette" by north roads.
I got if from Hobby link but it was their last piece.
Hussein
jrutman
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Posted: Thursday, January 02, 2014 - 03:19 AM UTC
I agree with the no ladder concept. Here is another idea. You could use a thin piece of styrene and cut it to cover the back of the building corner,where the straight edges are. This would control the view more and let you put that figure in the top window with the proper lighting,IE dark. The fig up there without the backing would look kind of hokey with too much backlight. Just a thought,
J
J
SdAufKla
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Posted: Thursday, January 02, 2014 - 03:36 AM UTC
Quoted Text
...Difference between dio and vignette is less the size than rather the story IMHO. Vignette for me is simply a form of display....vehicle alone is boring, so I add a (couple of) figure(s) and half a ruin/wall. Story...none, not included in the concept. ...
Cheers
Romain
FWIW, I totally agree with this.
The vignette is focused on the aesthetic qualities of the model subject(s) (which, IMO, logically should include the terrain and the historical or technical circumstance as matters of accuracy) and makes no attempt to "tell a story." Technical and historical accuracy along with displaying the aesthetic and other interesting features of the model subjects are the measures of success with a vignette. How these model subject features are displayed so that the viewer can most appreciate them drives the composition of the vignette.
A diorama is about the story (which implies that the human element, i.e. the people involved - even if not physically depicted - is paramount) and uses the models to communicate that story to the viewer. The strength of the story and how well the diorama artist tells it is the measure of success. Human interactions on the diorama and how that connects with the viewer are the key elements that drive the composition.
The vignette is about the viewer understanding and appreciating the model subject(s).
The diorama is about the viewer understanding and appreciating the human story.
The model artist composes and crafts his work with his intended result in mind. However, sometimes there are gray areas, and as the old saying goes, "Beauty is in the eye of the beholder."
The viewer's perceptions often cross the line from what the model artist intended. The model artist may have intended to tell a story, but the viewer doesn't understand it and perceives the work only for its aesthetic qualities: the viewer perceives the intended diorama as a vignette. Conversely, viewer may look at the work and makes up a story in his own mind and turns the intended vignette into a diorama.
helkaissy
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Posted: Thursday, January 02, 2014 - 04:52 AM UTC
I agree Mike, very well explained.
But just a thought, how about one of these small round bases with two figures on it without any vehicles. What would it be considered?
But just a thought, how about one of these small round bases with two figures on it without any vehicles. What would it be considered?
SdAufKla
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Posted: Thursday, January 02, 2014 - 10:25 AM UTC
Quoted Text
I agree Mike, very well explained.
But just a thought, how about one of these small round bases with two figures on it without any vehicles. What would it be considered?
Well, I would say that it all depends on if the modeler intends to tell a story or not.
This is just the "world according to Mike," but I think of it like this:
Suppose a modeler displays a single figure on a landscaped base. Is he telling a story or just showing off the figure for the interest of the figure itself (pure aesthetics)? I believe that usually, he's constructed (maybe even sculpted) the figure and painted it to show off the interesting uniform, the accoutrements, individual weapon, etc. The purpose and intent is to show off the aesthetics of the subject (here a single figure).
Of course, the figure may be posed in a manner that's interesting and its facial features and expression may be very eye-catching, but the purpose of the figure display is to show off the aesthetics of the figure. To me the vignette is like a still life or landscape painting. The work was created to show off the aesthetic of the subject.
Now, say the modeler puts two figures on a base. we now have to ask how those figures are interacting with each other and their environment and circumstances. Posses where the figures are just "existing in their" soldierly circumstances (talking, looking, pointing, perhaps even firing their weapons) are really, IMO, just extensions of the aesthetic interest of the uniforms and equipment of the single figure.
(After all, the single figure could be firing his weapon as well, but we probably wouldn't think of a single figure firing a rifle as a figure diorama with a story.)
However, if the two figures were posed, say with one treating the wounds of the other, or they were cowering behind cover from enemy fire, or perhaps boxing with each other in hand-to-hand combat, then the main focus of the display becomes the interaction of the two figures and that interaction tells a story. In my book, this example would be a two-figure diorama.
The modeler is telling a story about tender care of a wounded comrade (or perhaps mercy to an enemy soldier); or the modeler is telling a story about the fear men under fire experience; or perhaps he's telling the story of a desperate fight to the death. The models are the medium that the model artist is using to tell his story just like an author uses words to tell his story. The book is not about the words and diorama is not about the model figures.
Of course, the viewer might find a story in the simple two figure vignette where the builder doesn't intend one. The viewer might imagine that the two figures standing next to each other and talking or pointing are involved in devising some heroic battle plan, or scheming about how much booze they're going to drink and how many girls they'll woo while on leave in Paris.
We intuitively understand that all humans have a story to tell about themselves all the time. The nature of human existence means that observers can always find a "story" in every person they see, even the person (or model figure subject) that's simply sitting still.
In the end, though, the modeler can only build and display his models according to his vision and imagination. The viewer will perceive what he will when he looks at the model, even if this means the view finds things the modeler didn't intend.
However, art (even model art) is not an exercise in democracy. It's not the viewer's vote that counts, but the modeler's (the artist's) intent and vision that's most important.
The modeler tells his story or shows off what he believes is most aesthetically appealing in his subjects. Once the work is finished, the viewer will either understand the modeler's intent and vision or not, but that intent and vision was the genesis of the work of art.
Whether the modeler is successful in conveying his intent and vision is, of course, important, but what that intent is (diorama and story or vignette and pure aesthetics) has not changed because the model artist was or was not successful and the viewer did or did not perceive the work as intended.
To be sure there are gray areas here - works that clearly convey a story even if the builder calls them vignettes and also works that have no discernible story even though the builder says he's telling one and works that the builder says are intended to tell one story but are perceived as telling a different one. This is why crafting rules sets for contests and judging of dioramas and vignettes is so difficult.
The judges are viewers whose votes do count...
Still, I think the model artist's intent and vision are the most important factor in determining whether a work is a diorama or a vignette.
Posted: Saturday, January 04, 2014 - 04:42 AM UTC
Have to agree with what Mike said above. This could be either a vignette or dio ... depending on what you want to do with it yourself.
But .... to add one thing .... if you are considering entering this in a competition later .... see that competition rules. Some have rules that describe the minimum amount of figures to be entered as a diorama, or max figures to be considered for the figures or vignette categories.
But .... to add one thing .... if you are considering entering this in a competition later .... see that competition rules. Some have rules that describe the minimum amount of figures to be entered as a diorama, or max figures to be considered for the figures or vignette categories.
AJLaFleche
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Posted: Sunday, January 05, 2014 - 02:21 AM UTC
Ultimately, the difference between diorama and vignette is ONLY important in the contest room IF the contest makes that differentiation. When this happens, the sponsor will define the each. In general , a vignette tells a small story and a dio a bigger one.