Just wanted to double check my understanding of barrel stripes as they correspond to the bumper code for US Army tanks from mid '70s brought the '80s
Code on front left, for example D - 15
Means Delta Company, 1st platoon , 5th vehicle?
Now for the part that never seems to be consistent , barrel stripes
Color denotes what company
A - Red, B - white, C - blue, D - ?? Not certain of the colors
Number of colored stripes denotes platoon
One stripe - 1st platoon, Two stripes - second etc.
-------
Not sure if this is right, and I know there was some variability in barrel stripes - later placards and battle boards would serve this purpose and previous I think there were shapes and colors that had meanings.
Can someone confirm the most common standard for these Cold War barrel markings?
Hosted by Darren Baker
Bumper codes and barrel stripes - US Cold War
BruceJ8365
Joined: December 25, 2012
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Posted: Saturday, April 26, 2014 - 04:36 PM UTC
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
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Posted: Saturday, April 26, 2014 - 06:26 PM UTC
Bruce,
I'm not sure what "barrel stripes" you're referring to, or what vehicle said stripes would be on. I was a platoon leader and executive officer in the 11th Armored Cavalry, and spent four years in Germany from 1976-80. I never saw a "barrel stripe" at that time. I know during Desert Storm, some CONUS based units used barrel rings painted in black to denote the platoon number. I don't believe any were in color. During WWII, the Germans painted stripes on gun barrels to denote kills. We did mark the barrels of our Sheridans and M60s with with a white arrow about 2/3rds of the way down the length of the barrel to the muzzle on the track commanders side. This assisted the tank commander with laying the gun quickly. As to the bumper codes, you are generally correct with your description, however, depending on the type of unit, a specific number might designate who was in the vehicle. For instance, given your example, D-16 would be the 1st Platoon of Delta company/troop/battery, the 6 being the commander's vehicle. My Sheridan was F-36, (Fox Troop, 3rd Plt, Platoon leader's vehicle) A number ending in 5 was usually the company executive officer's. At the major unit HQ level, a 3 designated operations staff, a 2 was for the intelligence staff (i.e.; HQ 31 or HQ 21). Line company commanders would always be "66" as in "D-66". The right front top corner of the hull (or bumper)would have the unit of assignment, usually stenciled in black on a tan background-- my unit was V/2-11CAV, which stood for Fifth Corps, 2nd Squadron, 11th Cavalry (later CAV was changed to ACR for Armored Cavalry Regiment). But there were many unit variations, for instance, the 1st Armored division would use a 1, followed by a triangle, then the brigade number. It's probably best to look at a specific photo taken during the time frame you are modeling, because bumper numbering systems changed frequently. Hope this helps a little.
Very Respectfully, Russ
I'm not sure what "barrel stripes" you're referring to, or what vehicle said stripes would be on. I was a platoon leader and executive officer in the 11th Armored Cavalry, and spent four years in Germany from 1976-80. I never saw a "barrel stripe" at that time. I know during Desert Storm, some CONUS based units used barrel rings painted in black to denote the platoon number. I don't believe any were in color. During WWII, the Germans painted stripes on gun barrels to denote kills. We did mark the barrels of our Sheridans and M60s with with a white arrow about 2/3rds of the way down the length of the barrel to the muzzle on the track commanders side. This assisted the tank commander with laying the gun quickly. As to the bumper codes, you are generally correct with your description, however, depending on the type of unit, a specific number might designate who was in the vehicle. For instance, given your example, D-16 would be the 1st Platoon of Delta company/troop/battery, the 6 being the commander's vehicle. My Sheridan was F-36, (Fox Troop, 3rd Plt, Platoon leader's vehicle) A number ending in 5 was usually the company executive officer's. At the major unit HQ level, a 3 designated operations staff, a 2 was for the intelligence staff (i.e.; HQ 31 or HQ 21). Line company commanders would always be "66" as in "D-66". The right front top corner of the hull (or bumper)would have the unit of assignment, usually stenciled in black on a tan background-- my unit was V/2-11CAV, which stood for Fifth Corps, 2nd Squadron, 11th Cavalry (later CAV was changed to ACR for Armored Cavalry Regiment). But there were many unit variations, for instance, the 1st Armored division would use a 1, followed by a triangle, then the brigade number. It's probably best to look at a specific photo taken during the time frame you are modeling, because bumper numbering systems changed frequently. Hope this helps a little.
Very Respectfully, Russ
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
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Posted: Saturday, April 26, 2014 - 06:38 PM UTC
Bruce,
I forgot to mention your question about placards/shapes and colors. If you are referring to the large square turret placards in orange and blue, those are temporary vinyl or cloth placards that were taped or tied during Reforger and other exercises in Europe, or for MILES exercises in CONUS and Korea. for the purpose of the exercise, each unit would be given a number and color. The purpose of the placard was to allow umpires to do engagement assessments, and simply to tell the "bad guys" from the "good guys" since we all had the same equipment. Orange usually was an OPFOR unit, Blue was usually a defending unit. There were also placards in white, green or red depending on the exercise. Again, hope this helps a little. Very Respectfully, Russ
I forgot to mention your question about placards/shapes and colors. If you are referring to the large square turret placards in orange and blue, those are temporary vinyl or cloth placards that were taped or tied during Reforger and other exercises in Europe, or for MILES exercises in CONUS and Korea. for the purpose of the exercise, each unit would be given a number and color. The purpose of the placard was to allow umpires to do engagement assessments, and simply to tell the "bad guys" from the "good guys" since we all had the same equipment. Orange usually was an OPFOR unit, Blue was usually a defending unit. There were also placards in white, green or red depending on the exercise. Again, hope this helps a little. Very Respectfully, Russ
18Bravo
Joined: January 20, 2005
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Posted: Sunday, April 27, 2014 - 03:16 AM UTC
I thought the stripe color denoted platoon. I'm building a tank similar to the one below for a friend whose storied career includes the Golden Knights, 2 ACR, and my current unit. Yes, approaching 40 years of service.
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
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Posted: Sunday, April 27, 2014 - 05:07 AM UTC
Bruce,
I can't tell the unit of assignment this M60(A3?)is assigned -- but the camouflage scheme was a very short- lived experimental style used in the late 1980 and early 90s by some units. I suspect the three blue rings on the evacuation cylinder on the barrel were particular only to that unit, as they are not standard Army practice-- is this a 2ACR tank? The 2ACR was a unit that was frequently used to test various concepts in tactics, doctrine and yes camouflage schemes. This is a likely an M60A3, since it has the ribbed road wheels and smoke grenade hangers on the turret, which are post 1980 additions, but almost all M60s went through M60 rebuild at some point at Anniston Army Depot, and would have been upgraded. FYI, the bumper numbers at the rear of the tank would have been painted on the final drive access covers which are the small square objects beneath the grill doors. Do you know where this photo was taken? VR, Russ
I can't tell the unit of assignment this M60(A3?)is assigned -- but the camouflage scheme was a very short- lived experimental style used in the late 1980 and early 90s by some units. I suspect the three blue rings on the evacuation cylinder on the barrel were particular only to that unit, as they are not standard Army practice-- is this a 2ACR tank? The 2ACR was a unit that was frequently used to test various concepts in tactics, doctrine and yes camouflage schemes. This is a likely an M60A3, since it has the ribbed road wheels and smoke grenade hangers on the turret, which are post 1980 additions, but almost all M60s went through M60 rebuild at some point at Anniston Army Depot, and would have been upgraded. FYI, the bumper numbers at the rear of the tank would have been painted on the final drive access covers which are the small square objects beneath the grill doors. Do you know where this photo was taken? VR, Russ
BruceJ8365
Joined: December 25, 2012
KitMaker: 441 posts
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Posted: Sunday, April 27, 2014 - 12:33 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Bruce,
I can't tell the unit of assignment this M60(A3?)is assigned -- but the camouflage scheme was a very short- lived experimental style used in the late 1980 and early 90s by some units. I suspect the three blue rings on the evacuation cylinder on the barrel were particular only to that unit, as they are not standard Army practice-- is this a 2ACR tank? The 2ACR was a unit that was frequently used to test various concepts in tactics, doctrine and yes camouflage schemes. This is a likely an M60A3, since it has the ribbed road wheels and smoke grenade hangers on the turret, which are post 1980 additions, but almost all M60s went through M60 rebuild at some point at Anniston Army Depot, and would have been upgraded. FYI, the bumper numbers at the rear of the tank would have been painted on the final drive access covers which are the small square objects beneath the grill doors. Do you know where this photo was taken? VR, Russ
This is Dual Tex, used by 7th Army 2 CAV after Masster and prior to MERDC started use about 76 and until they were replaced or repainted.
This one is an M60A1 , note no thermal sites, cover over range finder blister or thermal sleeve on the barrel.
Here's my version of Dual Tex
The battle boards were the ones to ID the vehicle, not the blue and orange war game unit signs.
There's quite a few references to the barrel rings and their colors - but some are contradicting, most come from the Tankograd books so maybe it's a translation thing - the first two Reforger and the MASSTER DualTEX book reference them. Maybe more like early 70s than closer to 80s.
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
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Posted: Sunday, April 27, 2014 - 07:04 PM UTC
Bruce,
The barrel bands are certainly non-standard for the "big" Army, and are likely a unit practice. When I joined the Army in 1973, MERDC was the standard scheme. The Dual Texture scheme was experimented with in some units beginning in about 1978(2 ACR) but was never accepted as a "big" Army standard. The DT scheme used the MERDC patterns. Both MERDC and DT were supplanted by the NATO scheme when the Army adopted CARC paints in the late 1980s. DT was too difficult to apply quickly, since there was really no way to ensure uniformity of the squares which were usually brush painted. But, as I said you are probably OK to use it for your friends M60 circa 1978-1988 in the 2ACR. The MERDC pattern was supposed to be painted twice a year depending on location and season-- in Europe 1976-1980, we repainted in September and April-- in September we painted the green parts of the scheme brown, and in April we repainted them green. When I was the S4 in 1979-80, my squadron commander had me looking all over Europe for USAF SEA light forest green, because he wanted his tanks to be "distinctive" from all others! So there are variations to the rules, especially in Armored Cavalry Units, so the color bands don't surprise me, but they are not Army standard practice. The background for the "bumper numbers" was a standardized practice, and was always done in a desert tan throughout the Army. However, the bumper numbers were routinely covered in tape or painted over altogether during deployments -- makes you wonder why the Army bothered.
Your DT M577 is fabulous by the way-- difficult at first glance to tell if it was a model, other than it's sitting on a tabletop. As to the accuracy of Tankograd publications, I have several. I find them useful for photos, but they tend to be thin on detail and often contain historical errors, but no more so than many others. VR, Russ
The barrel bands are certainly non-standard for the "big" Army, and are likely a unit practice. When I joined the Army in 1973, MERDC was the standard scheme. The Dual Texture scheme was experimented with in some units beginning in about 1978(2 ACR) but was never accepted as a "big" Army standard. The DT scheme used the MERDC patterns. Both MERDC and DT were supplanted by the NATO scheme when the Army adopted CARC paints in the late 1980s. DT was too difficult to apply quickly, since there was really no way to ensure uniformity of the squares which were usually brush painted. But, as I said you are probably OK to use it for your friends M60 circa 1978-1988 in the 2ACR. The MERDC pattern was supposed to be painted twice a year depending on location and season-- in Europe 1976-1980, we repainted in September and April-- in September we painted the green parts of the scheme brown, and in April we repainted them green. When I was the S4 in 1979-80, my squadron commander had me looking all over Europe for USAF SEA light forest green, because he wanted his tanks to be "distinctive" from all others! So there are variations to the rules, especially in Armored Cavalry Units, so the color bands don't surprise me, but they are not Army standard practice. The background for the "bumper numbers" was a standardized practice, and was always done in a desert tan throughout the Army. However, the bumper numbers were routinely covered in tape or painted over altogether during deployments -- makes you wonder why the Army bothered.
Your DT M577 is fabulous by the way-- difficult at first glance to tell if it was a model, other than it's sitting on a tabletop. As to the accuracy of Tankograd publications, I have several. I find them useful for photos, but they tend to be thin on detail and often contain historical errors, but no more so than many others. VR, Russ
Railspltr
Joined: March 19, 2010
KitMaker: 96 posts
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Posted: Sunday, April 27, 2014 - 11:35 PM UTC
What an interesting topic. I was in Germany twice during the 80s. Some of the bumper codes the units I was in showed some variation also. For example a dash instead of a slash between the Battalion and Regiment numbers and an extra space between the Division number. 
TankSGT
Joined: July 25, 2006
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Posted: Monday, April 28, 2014 - 12:52 AM UTC
I remember battle boards coming out in the 80s with Division 86, It was attached to the bustle rack and involved several geometric shapes to distinguish units and sub units. I remember it being overly complex.
Russ it looks like we were troopers together I was in Alpha Troop 1/11 77 to 79, I drove A-10 m551 and later A-11 an M60A1 both were platoon Sgt tracks. "Blackhorse"
Tom
Russ it looks like we were troopers together I was in Alpha Troop 1/11 77 to 79, I drove A-10 m551 and later A-11 an M60A1 both were platoon Sgt tracks. "Blackhorse"
Tom
BruceJ8365
Joined: December 25, 2012
KitMaker: 441 posts
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Posted: Monday, April 28, 2014 - 02:01 PM UTC
Ok - through deduction I've figured out some of the barrel stripe things...
From examining multiple pics and especially those of clearly identified CAT 87 tanks,
Color = platoon
Number of Stripes = vehicle number
Platoon
1 = Blue
2 = White
3 = Red
At least this is what the 4/8 Cav V US Corps was using.
Because I thought color meant company and number of stripes was platoon, it looked like lots of conflicting info .... It makes more sense now and matches a lot more of what I've seen in early to mid 70s pics of USAEUR.
From examining multiple pics and especially those of clearly identified CAT 87 tanks,
Color = platoon
Number of Stripes = vehicle number
Platoon
1 = Blue
2 = White
3 = Red
At least this is what the 4/8 Cav V US Corps was using.
Because I thought color meant company and number of stripes was platoon, it looked like lots of conflicting info .... It makes more sense now and matches a lot more of what I've seen in early to mid 70s pics of USAEUR.
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, April 29, 2014 - 06:06 PM UTC
Bruce,
Your reasoning makes sense, but I think the timing of when those colored bands were put on is not certain. The Canadian Trophy 1987 photos are from a different era. A 2nd ACR M60A1 tank from the 70s was likely not marked the same way a 4/8 CAV tank was marked in 1987. I do recall there were some units with barrel bands to designate platoons, but they were done in black in the 1970s, and it was not a real common practice. I forgot to mention in my previous post the 11th CAV copied the British method of keeping track of vehicles during WW1-- tanks had a name painted on the barrel. The name corresponded to the troop/company letter designation-- My M60 from H Company was the "Hawk" (we had all sorts of creative names-- Hawg, Hound, Hell Hound, Hag-- etc.). My Sheridan from Fox Troop was Fantom. Cavalry Regiments in the 1970s used the alphabet to designate squadrons. That is, 1st Squadron would have Troops A-D, 2nd Squadron would be E-H, and 3rd Squadron would be I-L troop. The Howitzer (M109) battery would use "HOW" and a number (there was one howitzer battery per squadron). If I recall correctly, the last lettered unit in the squadron was always the tank (M60) Company - (D,H,L). 2ACR in the 70s would have been set up this way, it was a standard Army practice. Good luck with your project-- judging by your excellent work, whatever way you choose to mark it, your friend will be pleased. VR, Russ
Your reasoning makes sense, but I think the timing of when those colored bands were put on is not certain. The Canadian Trophy 1987 photos are from a different era. A 2nd ACR M60A1 tank from the 70s was likely not marked the same way a 4/8 CAV tank was marked in 1987. I do recall there were some units with barrel bands to designate platoons, but they were done in black in the 1970s, and it was not a real common practice. I forgot to mention in my previous post the 11th CAV copied the British method of keeping track of vehicles during WW1-- tanks had a name painted on the barrel. The name corresponded to the troop/company letter designation-- My M60 from H Company was the "Hawk" (we had all sorts of creative names-- Hawg, Hound, Hell Hound, Hag-- etc.). My Sheridan from Fox Troop was Fantom. Cavalry Regiments in the 1970s used the alphabet to designate squadrons. That is, 1st Squadron would have Troops A-D, 2nd Squadron would be E-H, and 3rd Squadron would be I-L troop. The Howitzer (M109) battery would use "HOW" and a number (there was one howitzer battery per squadron). If I recall correctly, the last lettered unit in the squadron was always the tank (M60) Company - (D,H,L). 2ACR in the 70s would have been set up this way, it was a standard Army practice. Good luck with your project-- judging by your excellent work, whatever way you choose to mark it, your friend will be pleased. VR, Russ
BruceJ8365
Joined: December 25, 2012
KitMaker: 441 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 30, 2014 - 01:32 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Bruce,
Your reasoning makes sense, but I think the timing of when those colored bands were put on is not certain. The Canadian Trophy 1987 photos are from a different era. A 2nd ACR M60A1 tank from the 70s was likely not marked the same way a 4/8 CAV tank was marked in 1987. I do recall there were some units with barrel bands to designate platoons, but they were done in black in the 1970s, and it was not a real common practice. I forgot to mention in my previous post the 11th CAV copied the British method of keeping track of vehicles during WW1-- tanks had a name painted on the barrel. The name corresponded to the troop/company letter designation-- My M60 from H Company was the "Hawk" (we had all sorts of creative names-- Hawg, Hound, Hell Hound, Hag-- etc.). My Sheridan from Fox Troop was Fantom. Cavalry Regiments in the 1970s used the alphabet to designate squadrons. That is, 1st Squadron would have Troops A-D, 2nd Squadron would be E-H, and 3rd Squadron would be I-L troop. The Howitzer (M109) battery would use "HOW" and a number (there was one howitzer battery per squadron). If I recall correctly, the last lettered unit in the squadron was always the tank (M60) Company - (D,H,L). 2ACR in the 70s would have been set up this way, it was a standard Army practice. Good luck with your project-- judging by your excellent work, whatever way you choose to mark it, your friend will be pleased. VR, Russ
Thanks Russ.
Current project is an old M60 - using markings based on a Reforger photo in early 70's. It's the basic semi-gloss OD, before very thing came from the factory in Forest Green. In the photos, the several tanks on the road clearly have blue bands on the barrels - because I could only make out one of the bumper codes, I couldn't determine what the factor was as the number of blue stripes varied on the other tanks.
Note I've since corrected the unit code and scraped off the One and replaced with a Three... I got sidetracked with the dry transfers and focused on getting them in place and had a brain fart and used the wrong number. It now reads correct for the 3rd Batt, 64th Armor Reg.
Also note that the "plastic" Coke bottles would be wrong era, these have been removed since.
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 30, 2014 - 12:59 PM UTC
Bruce,
Fantastic job on the M60, I'm not good at posting photos, but there is an M60 outside the Range Control facility here at Fort Lewis WA. Our local IPMS president will be coming down for a visit before summer, perhaps I can get him to post a photo or two for you. One comment-- the bumper number you show in the photo is actually for the 3rd Armored Division,(3 with a triangle), 64th Armored Brigade. The "B" on the right hand side would show that this tank is in the 1st BDE, 1st Bn. I'm not sure what the "1" above the 3rd Armored Division represents. The Army adopted the triangle to represent an Armored Division just before WWII, and it matches the numbered Armored Division (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc.) "three color" patches the soldiers wore on their shoulder sleeve. The three colors were yellow, red and blue, which represented the three Army Combat arms-- Yellow for Armor, Blue for Infantry and Red for Artillery. VR, Russ
Fantastic job on the M60, I'm not good at posting photos, but there is an M60 outside the Range Control facility here at Fort Lewis WA. Our local IPMS president will be coming down for a visit before summer, perhaps I can get him to post a photo or two for you. One comment-- the bumper number you show in the photo is actually for the 3rd Armored Division,(3 with a triangle), 64th Armored Brigade. The "B" on the right hand side would show that this tank is in the 1st BDE, 1st Bn. I'm not sure what the "1" above the 3rd Armored Division represents. The Army adopted the triangle to represent an Armored Division just before WWII, and it matches the numbered Armored Division (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc.) "three color" patches the soldiers wore on their shoulder sleeve. The three colors were yellow, red and blue, which represented the three Army Combat arms-- Yellow for Armor, Blue for Infantry and Red for Artillery. VR, Russ
BruceJ8365
Joined: December 25, 2012
KitMaker: 441 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 30, 2014 - 01:37 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Bruce,
Fantastic job on the M60, I'm not good at posting photos, but there is an M60 outside the Range Control facility here at Fort Lewis WA. Our local IPMS president will be coming down for a visit before summer, perhaps I can get him to post a photo or two for you. One comment-- the bumper number you show in the photo is actually for the 3rd Armored Division,(3 with a triangle), 64th Armored Brigade. The "B" on the right hand side would show that this tank is in the 1st BDE, 1st Bn. I'm not sure what the "1" above the 3rd Armored Division represents. The Army adopted the triangle to represent an Armored Division just before WWII, and it matches the numbered Armored Division (1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc.) "three color" patches the soldiers wore on their shoulder sleeve. The three colors were yellow, red and blue, which represented the three Army Combat arms-- Yellow for Armor, Blue for Infantry and Red for Artillery. VR, Russ
I was wrong, I checked my original photos and should be I 3 # 63, 1st Infantry, 63th Armored Reg, 3rd Batt
This is from Reforger II FTX Certain Thrust in 1970
Lucky me, 1st inf div isn't too far away at Ft Riley KS and I've been there to see their static displays - some are from the old days when they had units in Germany.
Kevlar06
Joined: March 15, 2009
KitMaker: 3,670 posts
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Posted: Wednesday, April 30, 2014 - 06:03 PM UTC
Bruce,
A good rule of thumb is anytime you see a triangle, it represents an Armored Division. An "ID" is an infantry division. "ARTY" is a separate artillery Brigade. A Division Artillery Brigade would be a "DIVARTY". and frequently you will see a "BDE" or a "BN" in a bumper number-- these might be separate units (not necessarily assigned to a Division or a Corps). Some Bumper # examples:
V/1-11ACR (or CAV) = Fifth Corps, 1st Squadron, 11th ACR
3(triangle)64 AR = 3rd Armored Division, 64th Armor BDE
1ID1BDE = 1st Infantry Division, 1st Brigade
9DIVARTY = 9th Infantry Division,Divisional Artillery
VII/2-2CAV (or ACR)= 7th Corps, 2nd Squadron, 2nd Cavalry
Regiment
102MI = 102nd Military Intelligence BDE (a separate corps support brigade)
59SIG = 59th Signal Brigade (a separate signal brigade)
164CM (or CML)= 164th Chemical Company
FSCOM (or FSCM)= separate Forces Command unit(in the 1950's - 1990s)
ABN = any Airborne unit (i.e.; 82ABN)
ASG = usually a corps or theater Army Area Support Group which would look something like: 593ASG, 20ASG etc.
Then you have the Theater Army codes like:
8A/USFK = 8th Army, US Forces Korea
7A/USAREUR (or 7A/EUR) =7th Army & US Army Europe
This is by no means a complete guide of abbreviations for bumpers, but it may help with the reasoning behind the bumper number system.
The Marine Corps is similar to the Army, but the Air Force numbering system is beyond understanding!
VR, Russ
A good rule of thumb is anytime you see a triangle, it represents an Armored Division. An "ID" is an infantry division. "ARTY" is a separate artillery Brigade. A Division Artillery Brigade would be a "DIVARTY". and frequently you will see a "BDE" or a "BN" in a bumper number-- these might be separate units (not necessarily assigned to a Division or a Corps). Some Bumper # examples:
V/1-11ACR (or CAV) = Fifth Corps, 1st Squadron, 11th ACR
3(triangle)64 AR = 3rd Armored Division, 64th Armor BDE
1ID1BDE = 1st Infantry Division, 1st Brigade
9DIVARTY = 9th Infantry Division,Divisional Artillery
VII/2-2CAV (or ACR)= 7th Corps, 2nd Squadron, 2nd Cavalry
Regiment
102MI = 102nd Military Intelligence BDE (a separate corps support brigade)
59SIG = 59th Signal Brigade (a separate signal brigade)
164CM (or CML)= 164th Chemical Company
FSCOM (or FSCM)= separate Forces Command unit(in the 1950's - 1990s)
ABN = any Airborne unit (i.e.; 82ABN)
ASG = usually a corps or theater Army Area Support Group which would look something like: 593ASG, 20ASG etc.
Then you have the Theater Army codes like:
8A/USFK = 8th Army, US Forces Korea
7A/USAREUR (or 7A/EUR) =7th Army & US Army Europe
This is by no means a complete guide of abbreviations for bumpers, but it may help with the reasoning behind the bumper number system.
The Marine Corps is similar to the Army, but the Air Force numbering system is beyond understanding!
VR, Russ
Tankrider
Joined: October 07, 2002
KitMaker: 1,280 posts
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Posted: Thursday, May 01, 2014 - 01:53 AM UTC
Bruce,
3-64 Armor, and 3-63 Armor were both tank battalions in 3ID, not 1ID. 3-64 was in 1st Brigade in Schwienfurt and 3-63 was in 2nd Brigade in Augsburg (the other two battalions, 1-15 Infantry and 1-64 Armor were in Kitzingen)
The bumper numbers should have been either 3I 3-64^(triangle) or 3-I 3^64. 3-63 Armor will look similar.
I know that 1st Bde 3ID units used the barrel bands in the late 80's-early 90's with the color for platoons:
- Red =1st PLT
- White=2nd PLT
- Blue=3rd PLT
- Black for HQ Tanks
The number of bands correspond to the second number of the vehicle (1-6). They might have used the same company locations for the bands on the gun tube as mentioned below.
I was in 2nd Bde and we also used barrel bands but in sand paint with the position on the barrel indicating the company designation:
- A Co was at the muzzle end of the guntube
- B Co was atthe forward base of the Bore Evacuator(BE)
- C CO was on the BE itself
- D CO was at the rear base of the BE
The number of bands corresponded to the platoon. This is probably later Cold War info than what you are looking for but still might help.
HTH
John
3-64 Armor, and 3-63 Armor were both tank battalions in 3ID, not 1ID. 3-64 was in 1st Brigade in Schwienfurt and 3-63 was in 2nd Brigade in Augsburg (the other two battalions, 1-15 Infantry and 1-64 Armor were in Kitzingen)
The bumper numbers should have been either 3I 3-64^(triangle) or 3-I 3^64. 3-63 Armor will look similar.
I know that 1st Bde 3ID units used the barrel bands in the late 80's-early 90's with the color for platoons:
- Red =1st PLT
- White=2nd PLT
- Blue=3rd PLT
- Black for HQ Tanks
The number of bands correspond to the second number of the vehicle (1-6). They might have used the same company locations for the bands on the gun tube as mentioned below.
I was in 2nd Bde and we also used barrel bands but in sand paint with the position on the barrel indicating the company designation:
- A Co was at the muzzle end of the guntube
- B Co was atthe forward base of the Bore Evacuator(BE)
- C CO was on the BE itself
- D CO was at the rear base of the BE
The number of bands corresponded to the platoon. This is probably later Cold War info than what you are looking for but still might help.
HTH
John
BruceJ8365
Joined: December 25, 2012
KitMaker: 441 posts
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Posted: Tuesday, May 06, 2014 - 01:32 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Bruce,
3-64 Armor, and 3-63 Armor were both tank battalions in 3ID, not 1ID. 3-64 was in 1st Brigade in Schwienfurt and 3-63 was in 2nd Brigade in Augsburg (the other two battalions, 1-15 Infantry and 1-64 Armor were in
The bumper numbers should have been either 3I 3-64^(triangle) or 3-I 3^64. 3-63 Armor will look similar.
John
Thanks for the info on the stripes, that'll come in handy for some of the later Cold War plans I have.
I don't know the year, but I recalled reading that the 1st ID had 3 ^ 64 until the big red one went back to Kansas and it was transferred to the 3rd. It caused me some confusion when I was trying to find old photos of the unit. in the pictures of Reforger II those are clearly the bumper codes amongst the vehicles.
I'm excited about some more Dual Tex mid 70's stuff now! As well as some early 80s M60 s and old original all forest green factory paint Abrams and Bradlies!
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