Todd Michalak takes a look at Master’s 1/35th scale German 2cm L/65 Flak 38 – Flakvierling 38 Barrels set.

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If you have comments or questions please post them here.

Thanks!

Those barrels look GOOD! The grip-gnarling is a critical addition to provide that key appearance of these barrels, as are those short and long holes in the brake collar. All up, these do appear to be a good set, at least in overall appearance. It would be nice to know how long these are and perhaps to gauge them against some of the better alternative barrels out there. The length pre-base-nut and post (the extent barrel) is critical.

PS: The correct nomenclature for the original weapon in its original "FlaK" AA configuration was the Rheinmetall 2.0cm FlaK 38. The L/65 refers to the standard 65-caliber (caliber = 2cm, 65 caliber = 130cm barrel length) "FlaK-rohr" used on typical FlaK 38 and FlaKvierling 38 AA gun mounts. There were three barrels used with the same receiver and mags; the L/65 "FlaK-rohr", the shorter 55/L 110cm-long "KwK" barrel used as a vehicle gun on armored cars and some Pz II variants, and the 50/L "KwK-kurz" 100cm barrel, also used on various small armored vehicles. All had knurled grips and used the same muzzle-brake. All three could be swapped onto the same receiver interchangeably. So... for modelers building Pz II and other recon vehicles with "KwK 38" guns, you can actually "swap" barrels and use the longer 65/L FlaK barrel, as often actually happened! Cheers! Bob

Hi Bob,

Thanks for taking the time to check out the review. The added info is great! In starting the review I latched onto a couple threads out in the cyber-junkyard where some folks got hot and heavy over barrel lengths. There is a fight I did not want t have...LOL!! Anyway, the barrel is real close to the ABer version which after going through Terry Ashley's very comprehensive review of all of the other barrels out there - http://modelerssocialclub.proboards.com/thread/8831/verlinden-16-control-stick-painted

It is getting late here at the moment, but I will dig out the caliper and toss up some measurements for reference in the morning!

Hello Again Bob,

I took some measurements for you using a caliper this morning....over some coffee!!









Hope that helps you out a little. I will send these pics to Darren and ask if he will upload them to the review.

So looking quickly, and not to get into any lengthy debates about the barrel size, at the measurement and comparing them to the data you supplied and taking into consideration the "visible barrel length" should come in around 28.4mm in this scale...the 28.25mm length of the Master version of the 2cm barrel is pretty darn close.

GREAT info on the measurements, Todd! THANKS for doing and posting that stuff!

The barrels certainly look good and appear to have the correct proportions, and the knurls are the sort of correctly-done feature (as versus the crude grossly raised bands offered by a couple of the competitor barrels to represent this key detail... ) which really calls some of us (me! ).

There are two more pieces of info which could be useful... but apparently are not yet available... WHERE to get them and for how much!

I have at least one Wirbelwind looking for a set of nice metal barrels...

Bob

These barrels are certainly a nice improvement from at least most of the barrels out there..IMHO. As for availability, these are in the process of being added to the Master Website. They will be available soon from any of these fine retailers listed on the Master site - http://www.master-model.pl/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=56&Itemid=59

Would these work for any 2mm armed weapon with that style flash suppressor? Such as a Polish FK-A?

Hi Michael, While my personal opinion would say yes, mainly because of a couple reasons...first being I don't think there is actually a FK wz.38 (20 mm wz. 38 model A (FK-A)) on the market...but I could be wrong...the other being it is in the ballpark even though the flash hider is different:



I wonder if you could get away with adding a couple of scratch built or otherwise washers in between the barrel and suppressor.



After that, I think we are waiting for any one of the scale barrel manufactures to take the plunge and make one of those Polish 20mm!

I think so. But actually I believe that what you have pictured there is one of the guns that the Polish were testing and not the FK-A. Which did have a similar profile and to the German 20mm flak barrel. The Polish tested numerous guns to mount on their TK-3 platform including Solothurn and Oerlikon. They deemed these guns unsatisfactory and went ahead and developed their own 20mm autocannon which actually had more anti-tank capabilities than the other guns tested.

Here is the TKS mounting a 20mm wz.38 FK-A:



And here is the image you have:



It'd also be nice if some company might release a new, modern version of these Polish very light tanks. From the TK to the TKS.

Michael, I think what I do not understand is that there are at least two Polish based manufacturers on the list, Mast being one of them, and we have not seen the barrel in question released.

While I am not even close to being an expert on the subject of Polish armor... the weapon you asked about,the FK-A...or 20mm wz.38 FK-A,I feel was the barrel assembly I showed in the picture.

I think when it comes to Polish armor, more specifically the TKS,there has to be something that needs to be considered when looking at the information given...this goes for many other subjects as well. I tend to be a bit cautious whit information obtained from gaming sites as most of the information is copy and paste at best and often can be manipulated to work into the gaming platforms being used. In looking at the link you provided, there was the mention of the TKS z nkm 20A which "24 cars were rearmed"...this could be true but it would not be conclusive to think they were the only use of the 20mm wz.38 FK-A.

Achtungpanzer has a bit more information on the TKS subject - http://www.achtungpanzer.com/polish-armor-1939-tk-tankette-series.htm

While the widespread use of the 20mm wz.38 FK-A was probably an experimental one, but pretty much it appears the entire Polish Armor program was experimental at best for this time period.

If an effort to try and help answer you original question about the 2cm L/65 Flak 38 being used in the TKS...sure, why not? Some of the references certainly point to this barrel or similar being installed in the tankette, as seen in the picture you posted and several others found online...whether it be they were purchased by the Polish prior to out the outset of WWII or the fact that any of the remaining TKS's that were still intact after Sept. '39 would have been under new management in the German army and judging from their track record of modifications, could have easily place the 2cm L/65 Flak 38 into the Tankette themselves as well.

So I guess a final answer could be yes, the barrel could be used.

A couple of decent references on the TKS and one on the Solothurm 20mm Auto-cannon

http://www.achtungpanzer.com/polish-armor-1939-tk-tankette-series.htm

http://www.allempires.com/forum/printer_friendly_posts.asp?TID=1783

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solothurn_S-18/1000

Hate to start a side discussion of something completely unrelated to the original post but in the link to the Solothurn you posted, you can clearly see that the barrel length and then the length on the TKS tankette is the same. But if you look at a picture of the FK-A, you will clearly see how much longer the barrel is. Top if Nzm wz.38 FK and bottom is Solothurn.





The second picture I posted, while the same as the one you posted, I got from a Polish website. There is a boat load of information on this site pertaining to just the TK tankette series.

http://derela.republika.pl/tk.htm

Plus, in the Achtung Panzer link you provided, there is a picture of a FK armed TKS down around the middle of the page. This is the picture:



But I digress as we all can have our own beliefs.

Things do get derailed fairly quickly sometimes Michael. Basically, yes, a 2cm Flak was used in the TKS as was the FK-A...the how, why and when are not really mine to answer. Mine was to give my review of the German 2cm L/65 Flak 38 – Flakvierling 38 Barrels set from Master.

So again, yes, I would say the German 2cm L/65 Flak 38 could be used in the TKS. In the end, I am happy to see you found the information that you needed to hopefully answer the question you had.