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Dioramas: Techniques
Diorama techniques and related subjects.
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Questions about celluclay
Wolf-Leader
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New Hampshire, United States
Joined: June 06, 2002
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Posted: Tuesday, December 23, 2014 - 09:02 PM UTC
Hi,
I was in my local art supply store the other day and found some nice looking bases for figures.Now weather they are for the artist or for us modelers the bases are nice and at a price of $5.95 each you can't beat it.Only one problem they are made of hard plastic.
Now my questions to you guys is this;how do you make ground work with celluclay and adhere it to these bases?
Normally I would use water and white glue then put it on my base (wooden).
Is there a way to put celluclay on plastic bases so they will not peel up from the base?
Thank you and merry christmas.
Biggles2
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Quebec, Canada
Joined: January 01, 2004
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Posted: Tuesday, December 23, 2014 - 09:25 PM UTC
Celluclay is my no.1 material for ground and water. No matter if you lay it on plastic, varnished wood, or resin, it will curl up at the edges. Things to do: drill several 1/4" holes in the plastic base - the celluclay will seep into the holes and help anchor it to the base; I mix wall patching plaster, or hydrocal, as well as some white glue (I have also used papier mache powered paste) to make the celluclay stronger and stick better; have some extra celluclay mix at hand to patch cracks and lifting when your base dries, because it will lift and curl anyway. I also pre-color my mix with cheapo acrylic craft paints, or tempra powders.
shavebeard
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Oregon, United States
Joined: October 10, 2012
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Posted: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 - 10:27 PM UTC
hi fellas, if ya haven't tried wall Spackle for ground work yet i would recommend it, allot easier to work with and achieve a realistic finish [imho]. i always just tac't in a bunch of little nails into my dio boards when using cellu-clay that cured the curling [model railroad type].
happy modelling!
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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England - South West, United Kingdom
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Posted: Wednesday, December 24, 2014 - 11:23 PM UTC
Bang some panel pins into the base and the clay will hold to that.
GeraldOwens
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Florida, United States
Joined: March 30, 2006
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 12:59 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Hi,
I was in my local art supply store the other day and found some nice looking bases for figures.Now weather they are for the artist or for us modelers the bases are nice and at a price of $5.95 each you can't beat it.Only one problem they are made of hard plastic.
Now my questions to you guys is this;how do you make ground work with celluclay and adhere it to these bases?
Normally I would use water and white glue then put it on my base (wooden).
Is there a way to put celluclay on plastic bases so they will not peel up from the base?
Thank you and merry christmas.


I never liked Celluclay. Not only does it curl up and separate, it can become a home for weevils in tropical climes (like Florida).
Durham's Water Putty will adhere nicely, especially if you lightly sand the surface of the base to give it some tooth. Durham's is a plasticized spackling compound available in hardware stores. It comes as a dry powder in can. The color is tan, rather than glaring white, and application is easy. Mix a batch to the consistency of batter, and apply it to your base. Then sprinkle dry Durham's onto the surface. It will soak up excess water and create an instant, gritty, earth texture. You can mix pigments or water based paint into it, or paint is afterward. You can embed rocks, plants and other scenic elements. If you need to build up terrain, carve styrofoam to shape, and cover with Durham's. When dry, it is considerably harder than plaster of paris or spackle, so chipping is rare.
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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England - South West, United Kingdom
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 01:11 AM UTC
This spackle you often talk about is it what we Brits call wall plaster?
AndyMc
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Massachusetts, United States
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 01:47 AM UTC
Ex-Brit DIYer speaking, now US-based. Polyfilla is the same as spackle in terms of how it behaves and the purpose it serves. Both come ready-mixed in little plastic tubs. I don't know if they identical in terms of how they are formulated, my knowledge only extends as far as using the stuff (albeit enough to sink a ship over the years)
CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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England - South West, United Kingdom
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 03:42 AM UTC
Thanks Andy it was the indicated colour that made me think wall plaster.
AndyMc
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Massachusetts, United States
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 07:45 PM UTC
I don't know if you have ever used wall plaster, but most of the thickness is built up from a base coat which is relatively coarse and gritty. The almost-polished surface is put on with a thin coat of much finer top coat plaster.

Maybe the base coat might have an application where you want a sandy, gritty appearance - maybe a desert? I don't know, its just a thought triggered by your mention of plaster. Now if I could think of a way of sneaking a 50lb bag of base coat plaster into the house as a modeling essential .....

CMOT
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ARMORAMA
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England - South West, United Kingdom
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 08:51 PM UTC
I have used both as plasterers are expensive. In the post where wall plaster jumped into my head there are 2 things that made me thing wall plaster:
1 is the colour of the material, a chocolate brown colour
2 it was mentioned about adding dry plaster to the surface to provide a rough texture.
that all said your mention of wall filler has merit if a non shrinking filler is used.
Biggles2
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Quebec, Canada
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 10:39 PM UTC
Another alternative is to roughly shape a piece of styrofoam (any quality), glue it down to the base with epoxy, or carpenter's glue, then coat it with a thin layer of Celluclay, or Pollyfilla, etc. I tried Krylon spray adhesive, but it dissolves styrofoam! Drying time will be considerably shortened, and less chance of any edge lifting. BTW, is Durham's available in Canada, or similar under a different name?
GeraldOwens
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Florida, United States
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Posted: Thursday, December 25, 2014 - 11:26 PM UTC

Quoted Text

BTW, is Durham's available in Canada, or similar under a different name?



Don't know--I haven't visited the Great White North since 1968. I found Durham's Water Putty at Home Depot, the national chain of "big box" home improvement stores. It was recommended by legendary diorama maker Ray Anderson in his books and articles, so I picked some up and experimented. It makes great ground cover. It does not make good Zimmerit for German tanks (not stiff enough to hold the pattern, and a bit too gritty). Since it is water based, it must shrink as it dries, but it shrinks down onto the surface--it does not contract laterally into a fibrous cookie that pops loose from the base, as Celluclay sometimes does.
And for our cousins across the pond, spackle is a slow drying plaster that is used for patching walls. It is available as a powder or as a premixed putty in a can, and it has a smooth white finish. If you do use it for diorama work, is is best to mix it with water based paint or dry pigment, so any spots that are missed during painting (or are chipped afterwards) don't have that white glare. Durham's is already a desert tan color, so that's less of an issue, and it is more resistant to chipping.
PzDave
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Posted: Friday, December 26, 2014 - 12:04 AM UTC
Very true--good advice! When I was using it (a long time ago) You have to be careful about making the mixture too wet. I even had it warp the wooden base if the base was too thin. Score the base or drill hles (if its plastic)
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