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Moving To Oils - Tips, Suggestions
KellyZak
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: August 19, 2003
KitMaker: 641 posts
Armorama: 503 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 05, 2015 - 02:57 AM UTC
Hi everyone, I am wanting to move to oils for my figures, or at least try it for a while. Never really did it, I tried a few years ago, but it ended with me being intimidated and frustrated LOL I build 1/35 scale, and have been using acrylics for years, and to shade, use a black/burnt umber oil wash for the face and uniform. I have been practicing a bit with oils lately and want to step it up.

So, I do know about lightening or darkening your paint for shadows and highlights. I am having trouble getting base shade mixes for uniforms, especially German field grey. I've looked online to see if there's any sort of paint combo that one goes by, but actually not finding much.

Is there any sort of chart that may be out there or that one of you may have made for basic uniform colours? What oils kind of need to be mixed?

Old dog trying to learn new tricks here haha Thank you so much if anyone can point me in some sort of direction
Biggles2
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Quebec, Canada
Joined: January 01, 2004
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Posted: Thursday, February 05, 2015 - 05:04 AM UTC
You'll find all the info you need here: http://hfmodeling.kitmaker.net/modules.php?op=modload&name=SquawkBox&file=index&req=viewforum&forum_id=88&page=1
SdAufKla
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South Carolina, United States
Joined: May 07, 2010
KitMaker: 2,238 posts
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Posted: Thursday, February 05, 2015 - 07:46 AM UTC
Kelly,

You might find these useful:

AMPS Central SC::Demos::Figure Painting Part One

AMPS Central SC::Demos::Figure Painting Part Two

AMPS Central SC::Demos::Figure Painting Part Three

The uniform mixes are in part two.

With some practice, you'll be surprised at how FEW oil colors you actually need.

Black, yellow, red and white are all you need for just about every shade of khaki, through OD, to field gray.

Field gray is black x 3 + yellow x 2 + red x 1 + white x 8 - or there about.

You can substitute yellow ocher for the chrome yellow, but you'll need to vary some of the other colors if you do (less black and probably less red). Also, you'll note a difference in how the mix comes out when you use lamp black as opposed to ivory black.

Substituting one part indigo for one part of the black will also "green-up" the mix, if you want that. (Indigo being a very dark blue it'll mix with the yellow to make a greener mix.)

Get an inexpensive color wheel at a local book store or art supply shop. That'll help figure out some color "conundrums."

Glad to see a new "oils" painter. Very old school technique, but incredible versatile and easy. Cracking the code on color mixes is not nearly as hard as you probably think it is at this stage. You'll get the hang of it fast.

Happy modeling!
KellyZak
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: August 19, 2003
KitMaker: 641 posts
Armorama: 503 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 05, 2015 - 09:43 AM UTC
Guys, this is awesome stuff, just what I need! Been doing this for years and finally wanting to learn something new! This is so helpful, and the wheel colour is a great idea. I have read that a blue/black colour is a good base mix as well, but I've looked at art stores online in Victoria, and no one seems to have it, it's made by Winsor & Newton, the art stores carry all but that...figures. Is that colour important, or would there be something close to it, this is a new world to me, usually it's acryllics and washes and dryburshing

Oh, forgot one thing, one of my practice figures, my paint seems to go a bit grainy here and there as I'm applying, the paints aren't that old, so I'm wondering if it may be the brand or type of oils, I got a set as a gift a couple years ago, it's a Reeves oil set, just wondering if that is a 'beginner' type of paint, and not as fine as the more expensive ones, thanks again!
PzDave
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United States
Joined: November 28, 2012
KitMaker: 319 posts
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Posted: Thursday, February 05, 2015 - 11:35 AM UTC
Funny--I just cannot force myself to use the water based paints! Try using Humbrol paints f you can still find them. Model Master is a good paint too. They dry very flat too.
SdAufKla
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South Carolina, United States
Joined: May 07, 2010
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Posted: Thursday, February 05, 2015 - 08:14 PM UTC

Quoted Text

... I have read that a blue/black colour is a good base mix as well, but I've looked at art stores online in Victoria, and no one seems to have it, it's made by Winsor & Newton, the art stores carry all but that...figures. Is that colour important, or would there be something close to it, this is a new world to me, usually it's acryllics and washes and dryburshing

Oh, forgot one thing, one of my practice figures, my paint seems to go a bit grainy here and there as I'm applying, the paints aren't that old, so I'm wondering if it may be the brand or type of oils...



Hey Kelly,

In regards to the blue-black color, something to consider is that black paints mix with other colors as if they are either a very, very dark brown or a very, very dark blue.

Lamp black tends to have a blue cast and ivory black tends to have a brown cast. So, the first, lamp black, will sometimes move your mix to green or violet because of the yellow or red in the rest of it. The second, ivory black, will sometimes move your mix to a more brown or orange shade than you intended.

Also, when shading blues, reds and yellows, the nature of the black you're using to mix the shadow colors can tend to shift the overall hue. With blue, this is usually not such a problem, but with red or yellow, you can get some shadows that are more violet or orange than you wanted. It really is a matter of your own artistic vision, though.

At this stage of the game, just getting started with oils, these are issues to keep in the back of your mind, but not things to worry over much about. Later, as you experiment with ideas like making a particular figure's color pallet "warmer" or "cooler" in order to convey some feeling to the viewer, then subtle changes in shades and hues can be important.

So, if you want to track down a tube of the W&N Blue-Black to experiment with, go for it. But to start out, ivory black will be the most useful. Most modern uniforms are shades of olive green or khaki and the brown trend in ivory black works well with them.

In regards to your second question, it's really hard to tell what the problem is. It could be that the tube of paint has gone bad or was poorly formulated at the factory. Sometimes, the oils and pigments are simply not mixed well or at the best ratios, or the pigments used were the grainy stuff at the bottom of the barrel. I've purchased the (very!) occasional tube of quality brand paint that was simply not suitable for figure painting.

(I actually have a tube of raw sienna like that right now. The pigment will simply not mix with the oils... It's not even any good to mix up washes.)

If this happens, I recommend just buying a new tube of the same color and not fighting it. You can sometimes squeeze out the paint until you get to the good stuff, and this is worth trying before you bin the entire tube.

However, if you do need to buy another tube, if you go to the same store, switch brands, if you can. The bad tube is likely part of a "lot" of tubes in that color from the same brand and factory all made at the same time. Odds are good that you'll just buy another tube of the same bad paint if you stick with the same brand at the same store.

So, if the bad paint was, say, Grumbacher, then switch to a tube of the same color from W&N, or vice versa.

This is one of the advantages of using "artist" materials in modeling. As an example, raw sienna is just about the same color no matter what the brand. In fact, as you use more and more "artist" paints and materials, you'll start to notice that some colors by some model paint brands may be labeled "such and thus" color, but they're really an exact match for some standard artist color.

(For instance, Citadel / Games workshop "Beastial Brown" is burnt sienna by any other other name. Their "Snakebite Leather" is raw sienna. I could go on...)

There's usually not much difference, except price, between "student" oils, "hobby-painter" oils, and "professional" oils. Boxed sets of student oils are an inexpensive way to add a lot of low-use colors to your kit. I generally buy paints based on the color I need and not the brand or the "quality." Even in well stocked art supply stores, color selection forces your to purchase this or that tube simply because that's all that's available.

I've never noticed any difference between major brands of oil paint, either. They all seem about the same as far as quality goes.

However, there can be a major difference in price between various colors because some pigments are just more expensive than others. Chrome yellow, for example, often costs 3 or 4 times as much as, say, yellow ocher. This is because the chrome yellow pigment is very expensive. So, the difference in price between brands in the case of bright yellows will be because of the amount of chrome yellow pigment used and what other pigments have been mixed in with it.

Fortunately, you don't need much chrome yellow, so a small tube will last you a very long time!

Finally, as you're starting out, the number one mistake beginning oil painters make is trying to use too much paint. You actually need very little paint, and the paint you use should be brushed out thin. Too much paint leaves heavy clumps and brush marks, takes too long to dry, is difficult to blend, and hides details. Undercoating with basic acrylic colors helps to minimize the amount of oils needed. As you blend, wipe the excess paint from your brush often to keep from over spreading the blended color to areas where you don't want it and to also remove the excess paint from the figure.

Anyways, hope this helps some.
KellyZak
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British Columbia, Canada
Joined: August 19, 2003
KitMaker: 641 posts
Armorama: 503 posts
Posted: Thursday, February 05, 2015 - 09:37 PM UTC
This is awesome info for sure, it's actually getting me more motivated LOL I do have a ton of old assembled Tamiya figures someone gave me years ago, they are now going to be my test subjects! Was playing around last night with a couple. Think I did things backwards, I'm putting dark over light, I guess it should be dark first then paint the highlights..



My Winter tank commander looks pretty rough, yikes!
SdAufKla
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South Carolina, United States
Joined: May 07, 2010
KitMaker: 2,238 posts
Armorama: 2,158 posts
Posted: Friday, February 06, 2015 - 03:27 AM UTC
FWIW, most painters start with the shadows and work their way outwards under the "paint inside out" rule of thumb.

Not a firm and fast technique, just what work best most of the time.

White is about one of the hardest colors to shade, so don't be too tough on yourself with the guy in the white cammo.

The other guy in the green looks pretty good, though.

It's mostly a matter of practice. The more you paint the better you'll get.
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