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Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
M48 And M60 Tank Roadwheels
long_tom
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Posted: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 - 11:30 PM UTC
Were they all the same, or did they vary? I would assume the latter but I wouldn't know.
RLlockie
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Posted: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 - 11:43 PM UTC
M48 wheels were steel and had no ribs. M60 road wheels were aluminium and had ribs. Some M60s had steel wheels fitted when they were used to replace failed aluminium ones though.
HeavyArty
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Posted: Wednesday, January 20, 2016 - 11:52 PM UTC
Same - same.
hazzardm
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 12:16 AM UTC
Regarding availability of wheels, the best M60 ones in 1/35 are probably the ones in the AFV Club kit, which incidently also includes a set of M48 (steel)ones as well....so two birds killed with one stone.

I am not sure if the Academy M60s supply the original wheel or just use the M48 standard

ESCI/Italeri etc are usable

The M48 ones supplied by DML are not very good so need replacing.

Academy M48 ones are not bad but have a separate vinyl tyre to fit and may be a lttle big diameter wise.

The AFV club M88 is another option but from memory they loo a little big as well

best ignore Tamiya ones of either variety

MJH
panamadan
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 12:40 AM UTC
When I served on '60's we had a mixture of both.
Dan
Garrand
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 12:43 AM UTC
Word of caution about the Academy m48 wheels with the seperate tires. I bought an Academy M48A5/K kit a couple years ago, and the vinyl in the tires melted some of the plastic on the kit. I immediately trashed them, and replaced with a set from the Tamiya M48A3.

Damon.
GeraldOwens
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 03:19 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Were they all the same, or did they vary? I would assume the latter but I wouldn't know.


The M48 series used steel wheels (with rubber tires). The M60 introduced a rubber-tired aluminum wheel with reinforcement ribs on the inside rim. The wheel also had a steel inner rim to protect the aluminum from being chewed up by the steel track teeth.

These wheels were lighter, but failed more often. In 1980, the Army reversed itself, and went back to steel wheels for M60A3 tanks, but both types were seen right up until the M60A3 was retired from service.
long_tom
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 05:23 AM UTC
Thanks! In return, you might want to know about these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1-35-BitsKrieg-BK-060-U-S-M48-M60-Wheels-Steel-type-w-Quickwheel-mask-/261932143688?hash=item3cfc5f5448:g:A3AAAOSwDk5UKre~

For sale in both the aluminum and steel wheel versions. And Quickwheel does make some masks for the newer tank kits, such as the Dragon M48A3.
SgtSnake
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 06:36 AM UTC
Aside from the M113 and M551 I spent the majority of my career with the 60 series. Steel wheels for the M48 will not fit the M60 series due to changes, believe it or not, to the center guides. An M88 wheel will not fit the M60 series whatsoever. In order to keep the wheels from being destroyed by the center guides, aluminum wheels on the 60 series had the addition of two half-moon wear plates bolted to the inside of each roadwheel. Look at your kits' roadwheels and you'll see small bolt heads around the circumference of the face-each piece has pre-drilled and pre-tapped holes in the wear plate and each bolt was run through the roadwheel and threaded into the wear plates' mount holes. These bolts are 3/8"x2.5" long. Once mounted, when the vehicle moves the center guides snapped off the end of the bolts. And let me tell all of you from experience that replacing wear plates is one of the hardest crew-based jobs in all of tanking. Why? because the wear plates' mount holes are juuuust out of line with the holes in the roadwheel. You MAKE them fit. Oh, by the way, you know the 'squee-squee' sound tanks make in the movies? Here's your bubble burster-It's the sound the center guides make when forced against the roadwheels(wear plates in this case)ONLY DURING TURNS. Once the vehicle travels in a straight line the center guides just slide right through, with only an occasional squeak.
Kevlar06
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 06:58 AM UTC
When I was in the 11th CAV, our M60A1s had a mixture of aluminum and steel wheels, but when we went to the M60A3 in the Spring of 1980 they were all steel-- as was said previously, the aluminum wheels didn't hold up as well. Joel is correct about the wear plates, but in the three years I spent in the CAV, I never saw a wear plate replaced by the crew in the field-- we just received a new road wheel half as a replacement--they really didn't wear out all that often depending on their location. Could be we got all the new stuff due to our location and priority in Europe.
VR, Russ
SgtSnake
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 09:37 AM UTC
Yeppers, Russ, while I was in USAREUR we had the same luxury. I was in A3/8 Cav; after grudgingly losing our Sheridans we got hand-me-down A1s from 2-and 3-68 Armor with the steel-aluminum mix, and all replacements were aluminum. When we finally started getting the first RISE models it was all aluminum roadwheels, but when I hit 1/124 Cav it was like time travel-they still had M60s, no A no 1,2 or three. Those dogs were so worn out and parts scarce they would send us 'kits'. It was a nightmare of pinched fingers, smashed thumbs and two tanker bars to fit those buggers. Be happy knowing you avoided that PIA job, har de har
long_tom
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Posted: Thursday, January 21, 2016 - 11:31 PM UTC
I have the AFV Club M88 (early) which I haven't started. Would the Bitskrieg steel wheels be appropriate for it?
HeavyArty
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Posted: Friday, January 22, 2016 - 12:21 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I have the AFV Club M88 (early) which I haven't started. Would the Bitskrieg steel wheels be appropriate for it?



Yes, they will be fine on an M88. In 1/35 scale, the differences listed above are not really noticeable.
long_tom
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Posted: Friday, January 22, 2016 - 04:00 AM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

I have the AFV Club M88 (early) which I haven't started. Would the Bitskrieg steel wheels be appropriate for it?



Yes, they will be fine on an M88. In 1/35 scale, the differences listed above are not really noticeable.


Does this mean the kit roadwheels are the correct size then?
HeavyArty
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Posted: Friday, January 22, 2016 - 06:23 AM UTC
The kit ones look right to me. I haven't taken a caliper to them, and don't intend to either.
TankSGT
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Posted: Friday, January 22, 2016 - 11:10 PM UTC
I was in 1/11 77-79 as a driver and I replaced several several wear plates. They were a royal PITA. If memory serves at least 1 a month.
The bolts were to small for the wear exerted on them. The M1 uses wear plates that are 1 piece and the bolts are twice the size.

Tom
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