Hi guys,

with all the Fury thingy going on, just wonder what is the TO&E for a platoon of Shermans? All Easy 8s in a platoon?

Secondly, does the E8s work with M10s, M36s or M7 priest?

Hope someone can give me some idea...

Thanks
Alex

Not sure about Sherman mixes. Off the top of my head it seems like they'd issue what they had when replacements were needed, but I could be wrong.

So far as M-1/M-36/M-7 working with Shermans? Yes and no. They would be in different units but the same Division. TD's were organized in their own battalions, and artillery would have been as well. Could you make a scene with them with a Sherman? Certainly, but you'd have to be careful with the markings. HTH!

Michael

Usually it's better to have units made up of either all HVSS, or all VVSS, to have common spare parts for the unit.

Sherman mix :









(from this thread : http://www.forum-rc-panzer.com/t5567-Sherman-M4A3E8-easy-eight.htm )

H.P.

I love the strict alternating marching column in that first pic!

One thing to note was that Easy-8s were 76mm gun tanks (good against armour, but weak HE shell), while the VVSS tanks had mostly 75mm guns with their better HE "bunker-busting" gun, so there was a good reason to mix 'em up in spring of '45. Sure, parts supply got more complicated, but by that time the end was in sight and the top brass just wanted whatever it took to get the job done. The US supply chain by then was so full of new kit that most broken tanks could be simply replaced rather than fixed in the field...

But as has been said already the TDs and SPs were under separate commands within the division, so while they certainly mixed together on the field the markings were different.

As far as the TDs working with the regular armored divisions, it did happen from what I've read. The division commanders misused the TDs by using them as regular tanks. They were also used in an indirect fire role often as well. But I'm not sure how often the TDs were intermingled with Shermans. But it did happen.

Engines, too. However, it should be mentioned that many US Armored Units were re-equipped with HVSS-equipped Shermans on an "as needed" basis, while VVSS-equipped M4s, M4A1s, and M4A3s were still in service. Many wartime photos exist where VVSS and HVSS M4-series Mediums are shown operating side by side within the same unit. Wartime expediency, you see...

Combat M4s and M4A1s were equipped with the air-cooled Wright R-975 Radial Engine (aircraft-type), while the M4A3s used the Ford GAA liquid-cooled V-8 Engine. The M4s and M4A1s first saw combat in North Africa with the British, and US Armored Divisions were equipped with them very soon afterward. The initial M4A3s were built with the 56-degree welded Hull, and were the first US Tanks to be built with the Ford GAA. The M4A1E8 HVSS (cast 47-degree Hull) and M4A3E8 (welded 47-degree Hull) also made use of the Ford GAA V-8.

M4A2s, which were used in US stateside training, the USMC, and sent thru Lend-Lease to Britain/Commonwealth/Canadian Forces, as well as the Soviet Union, were equipped with twin 8-cylinder Detroit Diesel (a General Motors subsidiary) 6-71 Engines. M10 and M36 TDs were also equipped with this engine arrangement.

The M4A4 was equipped with the Chrysler A-57 Multi-bank Engine, which was made up of five L-head 6-cylinder Engines, built to run as one, with a common Crankcase, coupled to a single Transmission Unit. The M4A4s were never used by US Combat Units, but were used in US Training Units and thousands of them were sent overseas thru Lend-Lease to England and Nationalist China.

MAN, DO I LOVE SHERMANS!!!

Quite a few late M4A1 VVSS (47-degree cast Hull) and M4A3 VVSS (welded Hull) Shermans were equipped with the 76mm Main Gun. As a matter of fact, there were far MORE VVSS-equipped M4A1 and M4A3 Mediums built mounting the 76mm gun, than there were HVSS -E8s built.

There is a very good reason for the alternated spacing of 75mm and 76mm-equipped Tanks- Tactical Preparedness. The 76ers were primarily meant for Anti-Tank use, while the 75s were for Anti-Personnel, House/Bunker-busting, and limited Artillery use...

GREAT PICS, BTW...

US ARMOR RULES!!!

I think units were segregated by power plant, M4s and M4A1s with the radial and M4A3s with the Ford GAA. Most of the other parts were interchangeable with the exception of suspension units. However there were plenty of spare vertical volute suspension units from knocked out tanks available in Europe.

Yup! Belton Cooper, an Ordnance Officer serving in the 3rd Armored, says the same in his book "Death Traps", published by Presidio Press. F'rinstance- Platoons of Radial-Engined M4s and M4A1s, and the same for the GAA V-8-equipped M4A3s, irrespective of whether they were equipped with VVSS or HVSS...

Lots of good info shared already but if I can make a few corrections:

1) The M4A1 HVSS was only engined with the Radial, never the Ford GAA

2) the M36 GMC was only engined with the Ford GAA, never the GM Diesel

3) The M10 GMC was indeed engined with the GM Diesel but the later M10A1 had the Ford GAA

4) A small handful of M4A4s did see service with the US. Firstly an odd batch in the CBI theatre, from British stocks. Also, in anticipation of Operation Dragoon, some modified M4A4s from UK engineering units were given to some US units. Finally, in Normandy, several M4A4s operating flails, were also given over from UK stocks.

[quote The M4s and M4A1s first saw combat in North Africa with the British, and US Armored Divisions were equipped with them very soon afterward.
MAN, DO I LOVE SHERMANS!!! [/quote]

Just a quick correction that, the M4 first saw action with the US in Tunisia and not Britain who got M4A1 and M4A2 in North Africa. They didn't use the M4 (in limited numbers mainly in Churchill units) until italy then aftrwards in NWE with 33 AB.

Al

That may have been the case initially, but the M4 75mm was out of production by 1944, and the radial engine was also out of favor, so very few of the new M4A1 76mm tanks were supplied to NW Europe. The only replacement tanks available after the stockpiled M4 and M4A1 75mm tanks ran out were the M4A3 (and a few M4 105mm howitzer tanks). Some battalions in Third Army were equipped with M4A3 tanks from the beginning, but in battalions initially equipped with M4 and M4A1 tanks, the maintenance units just had to deal with two different engines and their associated spare parts when the M4A3 replacements appeared.