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Armor/AFV: AA/AT/Artillery
For discussions about artillery and anti-aircraft or anti-tank guns.
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what color for canons
Biggles2
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Posted: Friday, February 26, 2016 - 07:53 PM UTC
What would be the typical color of Napoleonic era canon barrels? Were they cast bronze, or iron? And would they have been painted black?
sdk10159
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Posted: Friday, February 26, 2016 - 08:03 PM UTC
A quick search on google found that 8 and 12 lb cannons, favored by Napolean, were bronze.

I don't know about the other countries, but you might try googling them.

Color. If they were iron, then I'd say black. Bronze, when it develops a patina, will be a greenish color.
Frenchy
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Posted: Friday, February 26, 2016 - 08:22 PM UTC
I believe they were made of bronze...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Year_XI_system

H.P.
Biggles2
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Posted: Friday, February 26, 2016 - 08:43 PM UTC
But when they were in service, and being maintained, would they have been painted, or greased to prevent oxidation? Or would they just be allowed to turn green? Could help with camo!
bill_c
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Posted: Friday, February 26, 2016 - 09:08 PM UTC
FYI armies in the field during the 19th century used fire ash and water to create a "pumice" that would shine up metal. American long arms, for example, were usually "brite" while the British went down in history for their "Brown Bess" muskets that were "blued" with chemicals. Bronze guns were not IIRC treated.
j76ljr
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Posted: Friday, February 26, 2016 - 11:35 PM UTC
Ive been to Gettysburg several times ,and alot of the cannons there are bronze turned green . A lot were black, but may have been painted by the park .
barkingdigger
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Posted: Saturday, February 27, 2016 - 12:28 AM UTC
I think the bronze guns would have been shined bright on parade, but were more likely to be left to go a dull brownish colour in the field. General manhandling would have rubbed off any verdigris (the green patina) pretty quickly so they'd stay "dull bronze", but if left standing unattended for a long while then green would appear. It's all a matter of context.

If the gun has turned green then it could hide any telltale signs of fatigue, so I doubt anyone would be happy firing a green piece.

Iron guns are a whole different proposition, since they would need to be painted to avoid rust.
Biggles2
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Posted: Saturday, February 27, 2016 - 08:19 PM UTC
Dull brown/bronze with a green wash sounds good for a recently abandoned gun. Thanks.
JPTRR
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Posted: Saturday, February 27, 2016 - 08:35 PM UTC
Recall that was an era that eschewed camouflage and brighter was better and more prestigious.

I did a quick google of painting of Napoleonic artillery. Period art (propaganda and historical images) show the cannons a bright shiny color. I am way out of my field of interest here but I'll bet a Franc to a croissant (in lieu of a dollar to a donut) that they polished them up right pretty.
bill_c
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 - 02:38 AM UTC

Quoted Text

I'll bet a Franc to a croissant (in lieu of a dollar to a donut) that they polished them up right pretty.


I'll see Fred's Franc and raise him a croissant by saying NCOs then were just as demanding as today's Gunny, and likely would keep the crews busy polishing their tubes. Having done ACW reenacting for over 15 years, I can tell you that ash-polished brass (and by extension, bronze) will stay bright a lot longer than you might think if regularly tended-to. And since it's fire ash, you can find some all the time. A little water, some ash and a bit of rag and you're ready to shine up any metal.

And has been said already, the armies of the past were not thinking about camouflage: ACW infantrymen on both sides went into battle with breast plates and buckles made of brass. The Federals at Gettysburg knew the South was shifting around to their left flank because Gen. Warren saw the sun glinting off their rifles from Little Round Top.

Even the French poilus in the Great War went into battle in red pants and blue coats & kepis. The Germans were considered inferior men because of their dull field gray uniforms.
Biggles2
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 - 05:13 AM UTC
"Camo" was intended as a joke - note the " ". Of course I know camouflage is mostly a 20th c. concept.
Vicious
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 - 06:14 AM UTC
i think definitely pritty shiny,specialy the French,Napoleon made is army career in the artillery,was is love,is proud and passion...the artillery for Napoleon was like the Tanks for Patton...you never forget your first love... ...and allover europe was well know Napoleon artillery like the must powerfull at that time, and he like to use it and do it really well
Frenchy
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 - 12:07 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Even the French poilus in the Great War went into battle in red kepis and blue pants.



It was the other way round Bill (but not better...)



H.P.
bill_c
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Posted: Sunday, February 28, 2016 - 09:44 PM UTC
Thanks, mon ami, for correcting my idiotic blunder. And Biggles, keep your shorts on, we knew you were joking but there are others here who might not believe that men went to their deaths marching elbow-to-elbow in uniforms that made them stand out to their targets.

Part of the reason was that until the ACW, the average musket was pretty useless until you got quite close: un-rifled barrels and round shot that needed to be able to get down into barrels fouled with black powder residue. It was generally estimated that defenders could get no more than one effective volley off before the other side was on them with "cold steel." The majority of defenders would run away in many cases. So the British liked red uniforms for two reasons:

1.) They struck fear into the hearts of their enemies
2,) Red masked blood, thus tending to help steady men in the line who might otherwise bolt and run
 _GOTOTOP