I am trying to find information on the design for the prototype Tiger turret used during the Tiger prototype testing. I know there was a "bulge" on the top of the turret between the commander's and gunner's hatches, but I can find not any drawing of its shape or pictures.

I am trying to model the Tiger (P) prototype and the following Ferdinand series, including the "paper panzer" the Rammtiger(P).

I found these images. Hope they help

I was looking for something a little more "official", but if that is all I can come up with, then what could a "judge" have access to?

There may be something on the Panzer Tracts issue on Tiger P -- let me to check.

On the prototypes of the Tiger 1 there are a few items.First Trumpeter has one of the Tiger prototypes,the VK-3001.They were also tested with three concrete rings to simulate the weight of the turret which was not mounted.Later the Porsche Tiger I was tested with a test turret also.

Jim,

This is the book I mentioned earlier. Offers a wealth of information on the Tiger P, including line drawings:

Unless your "judge" has a Tiger P parked in his garage, I would guess that this is one of the references he'd be looking into as well.

Google "Tiger P" and you can get these (similar to what's in the Jentz and Doyle book):




Cheers,

Tat

The best drawings of this turret are in Panzer Tracts 6.

The bulge is pretty well represented in the Italeri Tiger (P) kit. Though many parts of that kit are crude, I think they shaped this turret fairly well, and it's the only one that you can buy in plastic.

You should be aware, if you are modifying some other turret, that it's not merely different through the addition of a bulge. The side walls are lower than in a regular turret, and they don't have the kink halfway along; they slope constantly from back to front. The cupola sits lower than normal so that it matches the lower roof.


The pistol ports are the opposite way around to a normal Tiger's. The side wall vision ports are lower than those of a normal turret. The diagram that Tat posted doesn't have these details correct!

I believe that the front of the "bulge" actually matches the shape of a normal Tiger turret, and all the rest of the roof is different. The width of the "bulge" probably matches the interior ribs on a normal Tiger turret. But the "bulge" has a sloping segment at the rear, which the normal turret did not.

David


David

Interesting! I assume the bulge on the roof is there to clear the breach during recoil when fired at targets below horizontal, and the width is the minimum needed for the purpose. The rest of the roof is at a constant angle to keep it as low as possible and reduce the volume under armour, but the end result is a roof made up of at least seven separate plates all needing careful alignment and welding.

I can see why production turrets did away with this complex multi-part (and multi-weld) roof and made a simpler two-part lid following the contours of the bulge!

Always liked this version of the Tiger. How did the side escape hatches work ? They seem to be blocked when the tow cables are mounted . Did the hatch open inward , still have to push through the cables to get out though ...

@goldnova72 – Jim,

At some point prior to the first Porsche VK45.01 prototype being assembled a decision had been made to weld the escape hatch openings on the chassis closed.

~ Eddy

Hmm , wouldn't like to be the fifth crewman trying to get out of this thing if it caught on fire then . Belly hatch maybe ? I guess at the time these were built they would have been the biggest kid on the block , the only thing to take them out would have been a direct hit by a 152mm shell

152 rounds hit a couple of Ferdinands w/o major damage. A jammed main gun was the only damage IIRC, that was repaired in the field.

I wonder if any thought was given to replace the electric drive with a standard drive train to the rear sprockets? Ferdinands' weak spot was the drive system.

If you're building one of the prototypes with that turret my suggestion would be to buy Italeri's kit as well. I bought it just for the turret pieces. Also note that you shouldn't install the turret bin as only the Zimmerit covered standard turret version that served with 653 had that.