The Canadian Army trophy shoot is something that I have seen mentioned in a Concord book that I have . There are a few M1s with some cool paint jobs in some of the pics . So what I would like to know is : Do they still do this ? What are the tank tables used ? Which nations participate ? and is there one tank that stands above the rest ? Have any of the active duity tankers on this site ever competed in one ? Just wondering , thanks Toad out

From what I have heard from some of my friends that serve in the Canadian Forces, have said that despite the technological edge that the US equipment has...the Canadian Forces generally end up winning the event....

Usually Nato countries participate.....Canada, US, UK, Germany, etc etc

I'm not a tanker but I got a chance to go to CAT '89 at Bergen-Hohne which the Dutch won.
http://www.3ad.org/cat_teams/cat_89/cat_89_%20results.htm

More pictures:
http://flashpages.prodigy.net/ptruhe/temp/CAT89/catm1.jpg
http://flashpages.prodigy.net/ptruhe/temp/CAT89/catleoc1.jpg
http://flashpages.prodigy.net/ptruhe/temp/CAT89/catgeleo.jpg
http://flashpages.prodigy.net/ptruhe/temp/CAT89/catleobe.jgp.jpg
http://flashpages.prodigy.net/ptruhe/temp/CAT89/chester.jpg



Paul

Arrrggh Paul,
You've gone and spoilt my day before it's begun #:-) seeing those pics brings back some memories for me I used to travel up and down the range road there twice a day I think |I even know were that photo was taken

Hey TurretLoad,
That competition was open to all NATO coutries operating in Europe. Once canada left Germany that was pretty much the end of the CAT. I'm pretty sure the CAT trophy now resides in the trophy case at the front door of th Normandy Building where I work. I pass it every day and never really stopped to look that closely at it.
The Strathconas still try to carry on the tradition with our American cousins. Check these links.
http://www.strathconas.ca/News/edm_sun_oct03.jpg
http://www.strathconas.ca/News/13_apr_02.htm

Maybe we could have an MGS shootoff?

Not to belittle the strats, but going up against a National Guard unit...owgh....hardly fair.

Hey Storm,
I have had the pleasure of cross training on the M1 at Gowan field in Boise. It is a NTC base and is staffed with regular force members. Their National Guardsman are very highly trained and professional soldiers. They stand head and shoulders above our armoured reserve forces, which I assume is your point of reference. Not to slight our reserves, but if Canada would protect our reserve's civillian jobs with Federal legislation like our American cousins, we would have a much greater talent pool to draw from.
All things considered, our "baby tankers" do fairly well with what they have to work with.

Ack.

Do we have an "armoured" reserve still? Ie, with Cougars?

The cougars are going the way of the Leopards.

Interesting.. some trials in the pipe include ATV's and "Recce" LUVW's. Guess I know where they are headed now....

Hey Storm,
The new LUVW , "lovebug I call it) won't be fit for anything but a VERY light recce role. The only weapons mounted so far here on T&E was the .50, C-6, and C-9. The C-9 was about the only weapon that could be used with any accuracy at all. As for the Cougars, I see them hanging around for awhile yet. If and when we ever start fielding Strykers, it will probably proev to be a decent trainer. The tanks,( insert long sigh) will be sorely missed by many, not gone fast enough for others, and is yet another ailing piece of Canadian kit, used long past its useful life span. While I agree the Leopard has outlived it's expected lifespan, and doesn't necessarily fit in to our overseas operations, a battle tank will always be needed on the battle field.
It should be replaced but not with a problem plagued piece of American kit which is no more deployable than the Leopard is at the current time.

I recently attended a briefing on Canadian Army transformation. IN a subsequent discussion it was agreed that there were a lot of holes in the process, created mainmy by a lack of funds. The tank will be replaced by a 'system of systems' which includes the LAV III MGS, the LAV III TUA, and the LAV III MMEV V1 (multi-mission effects vehicle - read ADATS) This sees the ADATS taken out of the Air defence role, leaving only the Javelin for that role. The M109s will be retired in favour of some yet to be procured 155 system and the current towed 105mm. there are a bunch of other questions including mobility support. It recognizes the risk of preparing for only a low to mid intensity conflict, but is overly optimistic (in my view) the willingness of allies such as the US or UK to want us in their coalition if we cannot fully support ourselves in the field.
I don't believe we will be capable of being an effective member of a coalition in a high intensity war without being in some way a burden on the rest o the coalition.

leogunner, you missed one, we trialed the LUVW with the Mk 19 AGL at APG in prep for the CASW project. There are some changes recommended to LUVW wrt to the 50 cal mount - firing the 50 from softskins has always been a challenge, the WMIK kit for the Landrover experienced similar issues.

Paul, don't get me started on MMEV or MGS. The LAV TUA is overweight with that small turret.. Imagine what a 7 ton ADATS turret will do stability and mobility? Unfortunately, we are in an army where discussion is dissension. I feel for the Army of tomorrow, we've done them a huge disservice by allowing MGS to go through. We'll be limited to rear-area security and convoy escort, but even then the doctrine seem to be you have to be able to absorb a hit and then return fire...something MGS cannot do.

BTW - MMEV will still do Air Defence. Javelin is gone in 3 years, with no replacement on any books at DLR.

Hey Storm,
I just happened to run into the Armour School RSM today. I mentioned somethinfg about the actual CAT trophy. It has been on a bit of a road trip it seems. It was loaned out to the Dutch who also competed in the competition, for their Armour Corps birthday. It just returned to Canada this week, and should be back in our trophy case by the end of next week.

Hope you had a good haircut and your boots were shined!

I'll have to make the trek over to J-7 and have a look at it. Is that big (1/5?) scale leopard still there?