_GOTOBOTTOM
Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
Hosted by Darren Baker, Mario Matijasic
Dragon M4 Sherman vs Asuka?
Vierville
Visit this Community
Gauteng, South Africa
Joined: April 05, 2014
KitMaker: 384 posts
Armorama: 372 posts
Posted: Monday, April 25, 2016 - 02:05 PM UTC
Hello everybody.

Im not a Sherman expert,so was wondering if I could get the opinion of the real aficionados on here about which 1:35 M4 kit is better...The Dragon (6511) M4 75mm Normandy kit or the Asuka 35032 M4 late "Fay" kit?

This would be to build a D-Day period tank.


I know that Asuka/Tasca make possibly the most highly regarded Sherman series kits,but there seem to be very few reviews of the particular kit in question,so I'm just wondering if anyone here has advice?

Thanks!
marcb
Visit this Community
Overijssel, Netherlands
Joined: March 25, 2006
KitMaker: 1,244 posts
Armorama: 1,226 posts
Posted: Monday, April 25, 2016 - 02:55 PM UTC
The Asuka is the better kit, but the Dragon one has more features of the "classic" US D-day Sherman. (Welded turret cheeck and 3 piece transmission cover.)
To make things more complicated, Fay is based on pics of a US Sherman in the UK before D-day, so could just as well be used for a D-day Sherman...
GeraldOwens
Visit this Community
Florida, United States
Joined: March 30, 2006
KitMaker: 3,736 posts
Armorama: 3,697 posts
Posted: Monday, April 25, 2016 - 08:33 PM UTC

Quoted Text

Hello everybody.

Im not a Sherman expert,so was wondering if I could get the opinion of the real aficionados on here about which 1:35 M4 kit is better...The Dragon (6511) M4 75mm Normandy kit or the Asuka 35032 M4 late "Fay" kit?

This would be to build a D-Day period tank.


I know that Asuka/Tasca make possibly the most highly regarded Sherman series kits,but there seem to be very few reviews of the particular kit in question,so I'm just wondering if anyone here has advice?

Thanks!


Dragon's kit depicts a tank built by Alco, Asuka depicts a tank built by Pullman Standard. Time periods overlap, basically early to mid-1943, typical for tanks stockpiled for the invasion. I've always liked the Dragon kits, but I am in the minority. The front corners of the Dragon driver's hoods need to be a little more rounded (fine sandpaper will fix it).

Asuka's fit of parts is better. Their suspension is posable, but fiddly to build.
IPLawyer
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: March 18, 2015
KitMaker: 71 posts
Armorama: 63 posts
Posted: Monday, April 25, 2016 - 11:13 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Quoted Text

Hello everybody.

Im not a Sherman expert,so was wondering if I could get the opinion of the real aficionados on here about which 1:35 M4 kit is better...The Dragon (6511) M4 75mm Normandy kit or the Asuka 35032 M4 late "Fay" kit?

This would be to build a D-Day period tank.


I know that Asuka/Tasca make possibly the most highly regarded Sherman series kits,but there seem to be very few reviews of the particular kit in question,so I'm just wondering if anyone here has advice?

Thanks!


Dragon's kit depicts a tank built by Alco, Asuka depicts a tank built by Pullman Standard. Time periods overlap, basically early to mid-1943, typical for tanks stockpiled for the invasion. I've always liked the Dragon kits, but I am in the minority. The front corners of the Dragon driver's hoods need to be a little more rounded (fine sandpaper will fix it).

Asuka's fit of parts is better. Their suspension is posable, but fiddly to build.


I'm just building my first Ausuka Sherman, and the VVSS suspensions turned out to not be as much trouble to build as I thought they would be. Because I had heard the suspensions were fidelity, I made sure to try dry fitting one together to see how the parts went together.

I personally found the tricky parts of the suspensions to be the sides, not the sponges, which I thought would be really fiddily. It took me a while to figure out that the trick with the sids is to slide them into place vertically until they are stopped by the back part of the suspension. At that point, everything will be flat for loading in the sponges.

In addition to the nice fit on the Asuka, another nice thing about the Asuka Shermans is that they usually include sprues for both the one-piece and the three-piece differential.
trickymissfit
Joined: October 03, 2007
KitMaker: 1,388 posts
Armorama: 1,357 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 - 12:46 AM UTC
Never really took a serious look see as to what Shermans hit the beach at Normandy. Still Asuka has the early direct vision kit out right now. There's also a mid M4 and a Late M4 (fay). I'm probably wrong here, but don't think any 76mm gunned tanks were involved in the invasion.

In the 75mm gunned tanks, I think there's nobody close to Asuka. Still the later Dragon kits are getting much better in accuracy and quality. The older kits are a distant second place.

gary
Vierville
Visit this Community
Gauteng, South Africa
Joined: April 05, 2014
KitMaker: 384 posts
Armorama: 372 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 - 01:22 AM UTC
Thanks to everybody for the replies and for the info!

I've downloaded the Asuka instructions for this kit and the rubber above the suspension is different to say the least,at least for a relatively inexperienced armor modeler like me.

How are the casting textures of the turret compared with the Dragon kit?

Thanks again!
IPLawyer
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: March 18, 2015
KitMaker: 71 posts
Armorama: 63 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 - 01:47 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Thanks to everybody for the replies and for the info!

I've downloaded the Asuka instructions for this kit and the rubber above the suspension is different to say the least,at least for a relatively inexperienced armor modeler like me.

How are the casting textures of the turret compared with the Dragon kit?

Thanks again!


I would worry about the rubber pieces too much, what I referred to as "sponges". They are sponge rubber and easy to cut with a #11 hobby knife. I used a metal ruler with cork backing to hold done the piece of foam rubber and act as a guide so I could make straight cuts. I could also freehand cut the corners to fit into the recess, because the tolerances are not that tight, because the sponge rubber will compress. The sheet of foam rubber Asuka gives you is also more than twice as much as you need.
IPLawyer
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: March 18, 2015
KitMaker: 71 posts
Armorama: 63 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 - 01:53 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Never really took a serious look see as to what Shermans hit the beach at Normandy. Still Asuka has the early direct vision kit out right now. There's also a mid M4 and a Late M4 (fay). I'm probably wrong here, but don't think any 76mm gunned tanks were involved in the invasion.

In the 75mm gunned tanks, I think there's nobody close to Asuka. Still the later Dragon kits are getting much better in accuracy and quality. The older kits are a distant second place.

gary


I believe you are right. I've checked my Osprey by Zaloga on the US 76mm Shermans, and they do not appear to be in use until the time of Operation Cobra in July 1944.
IPLawyer
Visit this Community
Virginia, United States
Joined: March 18, 2015
KitMaker: 71 posts
Armorama: 63 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 - 02:07 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Thanks to everybody for the replies and for the info!

I've downloaded the Asuka instructions for this kit and the rubber above the suspension is different to say the least,at least for a relatively inexperienced armor modeler like me.

How are the casting textures of the turret compared with the Dragon kit?

Thanks again!


Don't own the Dragon kit, but there is one significant difference between the turret on the Dragon M4 75 Normandy kit (6511) and the Asuka M4 Fay kit: the turret on the Dragon kit has appliqué cheek armor while the Fay kit (which do have) has cast cheek armor.

Also, unlike the M4A1 Asuka Shermans I have, Fay only includes the one piece transmission.

By the way, if doing a June '44 M4A1 is possible for you instead of doing a June '44 M4 kit, the Eduard M4A1 kit is often available for significantly less than an Asuka Sherman (other than the direct vision "introductory kit") and is basically the Asuka M4A1 Sherman (35010) with extra photo etch accessories from Eduard:

http://www.cybermodeler.com/hobby/kits/edu/kit_edu_3716.shtml
ALBOWIE
Visit this Community
New South Wales, Australia
Joined: February 28, 2006
KitMaker: 1,605 posts
Armorama: 1,565 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 - 03:12 AM UTC
The DML kit is one of their best Sherman kits and the detail is spot on for a D-Day M4. THe only problems with it are minor fit issues and missing details such as the bolt strip on the sides of the FDA. THe fit of the FDA is poor and will need a little work to get right (Look up Paul Budziks excellent articles on correcting this: http://paulbudzik.com/tools-techniques/Sherman%20Construction/sherman-construction.html
There are a few other minor fit issues such as the alignment of the Final drive covers and the rear lower hull plate with gaps at the corners etc. It is still an excellent kit just needs a bit of work putting it together.
The Asuka kit is a dream build in comparison and very accurate. As a bonus it gives you a Hedgerow cutter. The only real problem is the missing weld seam where the glacis meets the hull sides. The suspension can be made to work but Asuka also give you plastic spacers which I would reccomend as the foam compresses overtime

DML win the Markings battle with a few options whilst Asuka give you only the one scheme. Having wrestled with DML FDA fit issues I would rather build a Tasca/Asuka anytime.
Cheers
Al
pbudzik
Visit this Community
California, United States
Joined: January 12, 2014
KitMaker: 55 posts
Armorama: 47 posts
Posted: Tuesday, April 26, 2016 - 09:28 PM UTC
I agree with Al, he is one of the real Sherman experts. Being a bit OCD, I have found one of the most annoying things about Dragon kits, is that they almost always miss the mark on the final drive housing geometry and the resulting bolt strip detail as it meets the hull. The Tasca/Asuka kits pretty much mail it. I guess it's only a problem when you get overly focused on something.

What I usually do with the suspension (assuming the tank is sitting on a level surface) is level out the assembled tank and then lock up the suspension with a little liquid cement. Here is a short video on my how I assemble the suspension units. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nop87oyqzMQ
 _GOTOTOP