The only Panther ausf.F I have seen that was real was the prototype that had an ausf.G turret.That photo I am not sure is real,has too many marks of Photoshop.

Now that it's been seen in a picture I wonder if we'll see it for sale as a PanzerLehr vehicle, Normandy 1944 in styrene.

Lol

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The only Panther ausf.F I have seen that was real was the prototype that had an ausf.G turret.That photo I am not sure is real,has too many marks of Photoshop.

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You're thinking of the Panther II.







Jeff

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The only Panther ausf.F I have seen that was real was the prototype that had an ausf.G turret.That photo I am not sure is real,has too many marks of Photoshop.

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You're thinking of the Panther II.







Jeff

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Whoa! I saw the Panther II depicted in the RYTON Panther Book as having a "Schmalturm" mounted, not an Ausf.G Turret- Did the Germans ever even commit an actual Panther II to paper, i.e, blueprints or conceptual drawings? Just asking...

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The only Panther ausf.F I have seen that was real was the prototype that had an ausf.G turret.That photo I am not sure is real,has too many marks of Photoshop.

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You're thinking of the Panther II.







Jeff

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Whoa! I saw the Panther II depicted in the RYTON Panther Book as having a "Schmalturm" mounted, not an Ausf.G Turret- Did the Germans ever even commit an actual Panther II to paper, i.e, blueprints or conceptual drawings? Just asking...

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The Panther II hull never received a turret, just a test weight for automotive tests. US personnel added a 1945 Ausf G turret before shipping it stateside. In this form, it sat in the Patton Museum for decades.

There were three Panther F hulls on the assembly line at the Daimler Benz plant when it was captured in 1945, but no F turrets were photographed. Delivery records for the last four days of production are missing, so some sort of F hull/G turret mash-ups may have been delivered.

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The only Panther ausf.F I have seen that was real was the prototype that had an ausf.G turret.That photo I am not sure is real,has too many marks of Photoshop.

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You're thinking of the Panther II.







Jeff

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Whoa! I saw the Panther II depicted in the RYTON Panther Book as having a "Schmalturm" mounted, not an Ausf.G Turret- Did the Germans ever even commit an actual Panther II to paper, i.e, blueprints or conceptual drawings? Just asking...

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The Panther II hull never received a turret, just a test weight for automotive tests. US personnel added a 1945 Ausf G turret before shipping it stateside. In this form, it sat in the Patton Museum for decades.

There were three Panther F hulls on the assembly line at the Daimler Benz plant when it was captured in 1945, but no F turrets were photographed. Delivery records for the last four days of production are missing, so some sort of F hull/G turret mash-ups may have been delivered.

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Let me back up a bit- The Panther II that I was referring to in the RYTON Panther book is depicted in a blueprint-type DRAWING, with a "Schmallturm" mounted atop the Hull. I expect that the old DRAGON Panther II kit (6024?) was based upon this drawing. Also, even back then, DRAGON got the Hull and Suspension wrong, i.e, the Inner and Outer Road Wheel positions are reversed, if one compares the kit to the RYTON drawing- But this is all "pie-in-the-sky", since, if I'm reading Gerald's post right, the "real" Panther II was a GI-lash-up of an Ausf.F with an Ausf.G Turret... (?)

You could very well be right about the Knox one being a II hull. I have seen it but not paid much attention. Interesting that it has been fitted for Schuerzen though, which I recall Jentz writing was the addition which caused the demise of the II project. It wouldn't have had a Schmalturm anyway.

Panther II was a late 1942 project to build a successor to the Panther that would be built in parallel to the tiger II, which was also a late 1942 project to build a successor to the tiger I.

The main difference between Panther I and Panther II are Panther II would have much heavier armor, basically armored half way between Panther I and tiger II. Panther II was also to have simplified suspension borrowed from the tiger II, and share many other minor components from the tiger II, such as engine deck and crew hatches. A narrow turret was designed for the Panther II, and it was to mount a 88mm f/56.

Panther II production plans was cancelled in early 1943 because it was too heavy, expected to have inadaquate mobility for a medium tank, the design made it impossible to use most of the interior components already being manufactured for the panther I, and the overall didn't offer sufficient improvement over the Panther I to justify the disruption that would result to stop the production of panther I and retool the factories for Panther II. Some elements of the Panther II hull design, such as the one piece sponson sides and slanting sponson floor, was worked into the panther G design.

Panther F's turret was based on the turret designed for Panther II, but was lighter, intended to mount the 75mm f/70 gun, and dimensionally different from the panther II turret.

Although Panther II production plans were cancelled, for some reason resources were allowed to dissipated by continuing the construction of the superfluous Panther II prototype. That was the prototype shipped to the US..