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Gray used on some early Marine M4A2 and some
tanknick22
Joined: February 19, 2009
KitMaker: 1,139 posts
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Posted: Thursday, August 31, 2017 - 10:29 PM UTC
Can Anyone tell me what shade of gray was used on some Marine Shermans and some Amtracs and does modelmaster make it and what is the FS number
ReluctantRenegade
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 2,408 posts
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Posted: Thursday, August 31, 2017 - 10:50 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Can Anyone tell me what shade of gray was used on some Marine Shermans and some Amtracs and does modelmaster make it and what is the FS number
I'm not entirely sure, but...could it be 5-O "Ocean Grey" used by the USN? White Ensign produces the correct shade of that color...
Scipio2010
#401
Joined: December 08, 2013
KitMaker: 323 posts
Armorama: 221 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 31, 2017 - 10:52 PM UTC
Nick,
I think you might be referring to FS 35164 (Ocean Gray). AK Interactive has a paint set that includes a 17ml bottle of this Ocean Gray. Hope this helped.
AK Interactive #4220: US ARMY & USMC CAMOUFLAGE COLORS
I think you might be referring to FS 35164 (Ocean Gray). AK Interactive has a paint set that includes a 17ml bottle of this Ocean Gray. Hope this helped.
AK Interactive #4220: US ARMY & USMC CAMOUFLAGE COLORS
tanknick22
Joined: February 19, 2009
KitMaker: 1,139 posts
Armorama: 1,100 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 01:54 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Nick,
I think you might be referring to FS 35164 (Ocean Gray). AK Interactive has a paint set that includes a 17ml bottle of this Ocean Gray. Hope this helped.
AK Interactive #4220: US ARMY & USMC CAMOUFLAGE COLORS
I did some looking FS 35164 is intermediate blue
JSSVIII
Joined: March 28, 2007
KitMaker: 1,169 posts
Armorama: 1,067 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 04:35 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Can Anyone tell me what shade of gray was used on some Marine Shermans and some Amtracs and does modelmaster make it and what is the FS number
Where could I find out more info on grey USMC Shermans, I had never heard of that before.
tanknick22
Joined: February 19, 2009
KitMaker: 1,139 posts
Armorama: 1,100 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 05:39 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextCan Anyone tell me what shade of gray was used on some Marine Shermans and some Amtracs and does modelmaster make it and what is the FS number
Where could I find out more info on grey USMC Shermans, I had never heard of that before.
in the book "Modeler's Guide to the Sherman there is a section in it under the heading of Part 2 Marine Sherman Paint
in that section it mentions some tanks and amtracs were painted in battleship gray but it also said its not clear if any shermans were included (aka #21 Deep Navy Gray) the modern eqivalent would be FS 36081
Tank1812
Joined: April 29, 2014
KitMaker: 1,112 posts
Armorama: 886 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 06:59 AM UTC
IIRC the late David Harper had posted pics of Marine M3 Stuarts and Amtracks but that was it. Sherman's were green or green w/mud camo until Iwo.
AgentG
Joined: December 21, 2008
KitMaker: 1,109 posts
Armorama: 1,095 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 07:45 AM UTC
There was limited use of camo before Iwo Jima. You can see some examples at Cape Gloucester on the M4A1's the Marines used there.
Some believe a black pattern was used on some M4A2's at Peleliu, but it is really difficult to tell.
Saipan saw some limited camo on M4A2's, but mostly the turret tops were yellow with black battalion numbers painted on them for aerial ID.
In any event, paint would have been procured mostly from the US Navy so it isn't a stretch to think Navy Gray made it on USMC armor.
G
Some believe a black pattern was used on some M4A2's at Peleliu, but it is really difficult to tell.
Saipan saw some limited camo on M4A2's, but mostly the turret tops were yellow with black battalion numbers painted on them for aerial ID.
In any event, paint would have been procured mostly from the US Navy so it isn't a stretch to think Navy Gray made it on USMC armor.
G
dioman13
Joined: August 19, 2007
KitMaker: 2,184 posts
Armorama: 1,468 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 09:48 AM UTC
Hey Nick, I'm doing a U.S.M.C. South Pacific M4A2 by Dragon. So far they grey I have come up with is a light grey. The problems that arise are #1, what grey did the ship have in the paint locker to start with. Different manufacturers and even different batch #'s will turn up a whole bunch of different grays. Also, was it thinned with paint thinners, gas and what not. #2, how long was it sitting in open weather, heat/cold, salt air or in between the decks. You can go from panzer grey, navy grey, to primer grey and not be incorrect. Your usual washes and high light add and subtract from the original grey you apply.
ReluctantRenegade
Joined: March 09, 2016
KitMaker: 2,408 posts
Armorama: 2,300 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 12:03 PM UTC
In case the gray color used on early USMC LVTs/Shermans did come from USN inventory, these links might help you:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_ship_camouflage_measures_of_the_United_States_Navy
http://www.steelnavy.com/usnchips.htm
http://olive-drab.com/od_mvg_navy_paint.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II_ship_camouflage_measures_of_the_United_States_Navy
http://www.steelnavy.com/usnchips.htm
http://olive-drab.com/od_mvg_navy_paint.php
Scipio2010
#401
Joined: December 08, 2013
KitMaker: 323 posts
Armorama: 221 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 08:32 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextNick,
I think you might be referring to FS 35164 (Ocean Gray). AK Interactive has a paint set that includes a 17ml bottle of this Ocean Gray. Hope this helped.
AK Interactive #4220: US ARMY & USMC CAMOUFLAGE COLORS
I did some looking FS 35164 is intermediate blue
Nick, Im only going off of what AK Interactive provides in the paint set. Perhaps they mixed up the FS code.
AmTrac1833
#431
Joined: February 20, 2014
KitMaker: 376 posts
Armorama: 311 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 08:43 PM UTC
For WWII USMC LVTs I rely on couple sets offered by AK Interactive. One is the US Naval colors set, second is PT Boat set. This provides me all the blues, greys and greens I need for my AmTracs. I figure US Navy colors is what would have been on hand for original and touch up painting of LVTs. From there I scrounge for original color images/footage (lots of original color footage on Criticalpast.com) to mix various paints to arrive at the color that looks right to me. I should reiterate TO ME as there is so much speculation to WWII LVT colors.
highpoint
Joined: October 14, 2011
KitMaker: 55 posts
Armorama: 41 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 11:11 PM UTC
Guys,
I thought the myth/rumor about the Marines using gray on the shermans had been debunked a while back. As far as I know, all the tanks came from the factories/states already OD. There was no need to paint them prior to combat which would have been Tarawa. Just as devils advocate-if they were repainted, why paint them gray when you had plenty of stock of OD for trucks, jeeps, artillery and so forth.
Just my two cents
Jeff
PS- Wayne, I missed you in Phoenix last November.
I thought the myth/rumor about the Marines using gray on the shermans had been debunked a while back. As far as I know, all the tanks came from the factories/states already OD. There was no need to paint them prior to combat which would have been Tarawa. Just as devils advocate-if they were repainted, why paint them gray when you had plenty of stock of OD for trucks, jeeps, artillery and so forth.
Just my two cents
Jeff
PS- Wayne, I missed you in Phoenix last November.
Scipio2010
#401
Joined: December 08, 2013
KitMaker: 323 posts
Armorama: 221 posts
Posted: Friday, September 01, 2017 - 11:48 PM UTC
Jeff I think you are right about the Gray M4 myth. I read the book Tanks in Hell, which tells the story of the first Marine Tank BN to have M4A2's and they received the tanks from Army stocks (came in OD) for training in CA. Right before they deployed to the Pacific for the Tarawa campaign they were issued brand new tanks in standard OD.
AgentG
Joined: December 21, 2008
KitMaker: 1,109 posts
Armorama: 1,095 posts
Posted: Saturday, September 02, 2017 - 02:08 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Guys,
I thought the myth/rumor about the Marines using gray on the shermans had been debunked a while back. As far as I know, all the tanks came from the factories/states already OD. There was no need to paint them prior to combat which would have been Tarawa. Just as devils advocate-if they were repainted, why paint them gray when you had plenty of stock of OD for trucks, jeeps, artillery and so forth.
Just my two cents
Jeff
PS- Wayne, I missed you in Phoenix last November.
I was hospitalized during the weekend of the show. Then I had to take off work the entire month of November. Thank goodness for 10 years of accumulated sick leave.
MrsG and I will be there this year.
G
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