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Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
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What if the US Army Purchased the Christie Tank?
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
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Posted: Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 11:06 PM UTC
I debated putting this into the normal History Talk forum, but thought it more appropriate here.

What if the US Army didn't send Walter Christie packing with his designs to the USSR but kept and developed the tank here in the US?

My opinion on this is that we would have had a very T-34ish looking hull with a Sherman-type turret. I'd like to try a conversion using the T-34 hull and "Americanizing" it and an early Sherman turret. I'll call it the T-4 Longstreet.
210cav
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Posted: Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 11:14 PM UTC
Rob---I believe we sometimes over sell Christie. There is a thought provoking article on this same topic in the September-October 2001 issue of Armor Magazine.
Charles Baily wrote the piece entitled "Tank Myth." Also, see the equally interesting letter to the editor by George Hofmann in the November-December 2001 issue of Armor. I can not put my hands on it now, but I will find and send you the reference for a fine article on the Sherman by Cokie Sewell. Interesting subject.
DJ
GunTruck
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Posted: Thursday, February 07, 2002 - 11:57 PM UTC
Christie is good - but I think about Preston Tucker's automotive designs. Imagine what would have come out of that, had we bought his concepts in armored fighting cars. Maybe the LAV would have been called the Torpedo...

Gunnie
Sabot
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 12:22 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Rob---I believe we sometimes over sell Christie. There is a thought provoking article on this same topic in the September-October 2001 issue of Armor Magazine... Interesting subject.
DJ,
I've got the Armor Magazines in front of me. I wasn't trying to contend that one design was better than the other, just what a US medium tank would have looked like had it been based on the Christie design.

What got me thinking about it was the thread regarding fighting on the American homeland and if we had to produce tanks, any tanks, in a hurry. I though an interesting combination would be created.
210cav
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 02:59 AM UTC
Rob--my point is that the Christie design is often cited as being a unique American contribution to armored warfare. When I read the articles, I came away with a different perspective. Christie must have been a difficult individual to deal with. His engineering achievements were overshadowed by his egotistical mannerism. The M-3 (Lee/Grant) compromise tank of the 1941 era represented a vehicle design of great promise. It is, to my mind, a masterful combination of existing and new technology. I thoroughly enjoyed going through one at the Patton Museum. A very interesting design and production process. Ah, to have been at the ground level then....
DJ
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 04:12 AM UTC

Quoted Text

...think about Preston Tucker's automotive designs. Imagine what would have come out of that, had we bought his concepts in armored fighting cars.
Interesting, in my VFW magazine I got today there is a 1/18 scale diecast Tucker "48" advertised. $30+6s/h. Neat looking car. Also a neat article by Joe Galloway regarding his book and the movie "We Were Soldiers".
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 04:15 AM UTC

Quoted Text

The M-3 (Lee/Grant) compromise tank of the 1941 era represented a vehicle design of great promise. It is, to my mind, a masterful combination of existing and new technology. I thoroughly enjoyed going through one at the Patton Museum. A very interesting design and production process. Ah, to have been at the ground level then....
DJ
And be part of a world war? Nah, I like living in my own time. The M3 Lee is my favorite tank, got an Airfix 1/32 scale one coming to me. It was Bogart as a M3 TC in "Sahara" that got me wanting to be a tanker.
Kencelot
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 04:27 AM UTC
None the less... would have been very interesting to see what the Army would have done with the design. They should have bought the patent and send Walter packing.
Hmmm, a T34 with a Sherm turret. I say build it!
210cav
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 06:14 AM UTC
Rob--"Sahara" remains a classic.
DJ
drewgimpy
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 06:18 AM UTC
I have SOOO much to learn about armor history, this is almost a different language to me. I enjoy reading it though.
Sabot
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Posted: Friday, February 08, 2002 - 07:11 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Rob--"Sahara" remains a classic.
DJ
Oh yes, I truly agree. It shows that the the only tank in town is the baddest tank around.
210cav
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Posted: Saturday, February 09, 2002 - 04:10 AM UTC
Rob-got your messages and want to thank you for responding. I just received an M-3 Tamiya and want to begin it after I complete the Tamiya M-8. I put the interior in the M-8. Fits well. I also ordered AFV T-16 track for her. Have you used the AFV line of track before? I have their M-4 shoes for the next Sherman I make (either the rocket launcher or the M4 Heavy). Once again thanks for your assistance.
DJ
Sabot
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Posted: Saturday, February 09, 2002 - 05:35 AM UTC
Yes, just got back from the Spare Time Shop in Marlburo and almost bought the M3 and the AFV tracks ($12 + $14 respectively). I have several AFV track sets like the M113A1, the M60 and M88 track sets and the M4 3-bar tracks (all vinyl though). I also have the AFV M88A1 and M548A1 models. The 88 has vinyl tracks which is why I bought the workable ones. The M548's links were nice so I bout a set for my Tamiy M106.
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