Hosted by Darren Baker
King Tiger
b2nhvi
Joined: June 17, 2016
KitMaker: 1,124 posts
Armorama: 1,014 posts
Posted: Friday, July 13, 2018 - 06:21 PM UTC
O.K..... Got my King Tiger on order. Dragon 6302. One big question, did the SS get any tanks with the pre production / Porsche turret? All info I've has been related to Wehrmacht ones. I saw a photo of an SS s.PzAbt 101 King Tiger in Aug (?) 44 in France. (14 rushed to France while balance of unit re equipped with Kings and was re numbered 501) but it was a Production turret. I know there were only 50 Pre production turrets built so they are rare cat. Also, I've not got the kit yet, but I believe it's from the early run. Anybody have a set of the DS tracks from the 2016 run?
GeraldOwens
Joined: March 30, 2006
KitMaker: 3,736 posts
Armorama: 3,697 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2018 - 12:30 PM UTC
Quoted Text
O.K..... Got my King Tiger on order. Dragon 6302. One big question, did the SS get any tanks with the pre production / Porsche turret? All info I've has been related to Wehrmacht ones. I saw a photo of an SS s.PzAbt 101 King Tiger in Aug (?) 44 in France. (14 rushed to France while balance of unit re equipped with Kings and was re numbered 501) but it was a Production turret. I know there were only 50 Pre production turrets built so they are rare cat. Also, I've not got the kit yet, but I believe it's from the early run. Anybody have a set of the DS tracks from the 2016 run?
It appears that the Army units in Normandy received 31 "Porsche" King Tigers. The rest had been used for evaluation and training, and were returned to the factory for upgrades before being issued. They turn up randomly amid the production turret tanks, but few were photographed (at least two went to the Army 506th in August, 1944, and there's a murky photo of one knocked out in an urban setting near the end of the war, though I'm not sure of the unit). So the definitive answer is maybe.
Regarding tracks, the only ones with the early track were the five issued to the Panzer Lehr Division. The rest all received the production track with the nine-tooth drive sprocket.
b2nhvi
Joined: June 17, 2016
KitMaker: 1,124 posts
Armorama: 1,014 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2018 - 06:46 PM UTC
Thanks, Gerald. Regarding the tracks, I meant kit tracks. Photo seller had posted of the box looks like it is from the first run of the kits with individual links. I prefer the DS 1 piece tracks.
brekinapez
Joined: July 26, 2013
KitMaker: 2,272 posts
Armorama: 1,860 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2018 - 06:52 PM UTC
I concur with Gerald. I was looking at the meager references I own and saw references only to Heer units and some chassis numbers mentioned but not all of them, so it's definitely maybe.
b2nhvi
Joined: June 17, 2016
KitMaker: 1,124 posts
Armorama: 1,014 posts
Posted: Saturday, July 14, 2018 - 07:59 PM UTC
Kinda what I thought. Wehrmacht it is. Any ideas on attrition on the Porsches? I think s.Pz.Abt. 503 had a couple left in Hungary im 1945. Would they have been relegated to training, research , etc. as the production turret ones came in? What sort of logistics difference between the turret types would there have been?
GeraldOwens
Joined: March 30, 2006
KitMaker: 3,736 posts
Armorama: 3,697 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 15, 2018 - 07:44 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Kinda what I thought. Wehrmacht it is. Any ideas on attrition on the Porsches? I think s.Pz.Abt. 503 had a couple left in Hungary im 1945. Would they have been relegated to training, research , etc. as the production turret ones came in? What sort of logistics difference between the turret types would there have been?
Two tanks issued to the 503rd's third company broke down during a firing range demonstration for the newsreel cameras, and were left behind at Mailly Le Camps, east of Paris, while the rest of the company rushed to join the battalion as the Normandy front collapsed. The company was stopped and assigned to support a Luftwaffe Field Division, and they lost their vehicles within a few weeks.
The First Company's King Tigers and Second Company's Tiger I tanks were all lost in Normandy.
Lieutenant Von Rosen arranged for the two disabled "Porsche" tanks at Mailly to be recovered and transferred to Paderborn, where the unit was issued new King Tigers and entrained for operations in Hungary.
King Tigers were in desperately short supply, due to Allied bombing, and all available vehicles were issued to combat units for as long as they remained serviceable. Eventually, even training vehicles were formed into small battle groups. The differences in turret construction were trivial, and the two turret types were used side by side in the same unit. One prototype King Tiger was captured at war's end at its proving ground.
b2nhvi
Joined: June 17, 2016
KitMaker: 1,124 posts
Armorama: 1,014 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 15, 2018 - 08:04 AM UTC
Looks like I'll be building a 503d tank. Dragon, provided their info is right, has markings for one in France and another in Hungary with the 503d and after it was absorbed into FFH. I'm thinking that maybe the on in Hungary was one of the two recovered from France. Paint jobs are way different. Would they have repainted it prior to the deployment to Hungary?
GeraldOwens
Joined: March 30, 2006
KitMaker: 3,736 posts
Armorama: 3,697 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 15, 2018 - 05:40 PM UTC
Quoted Text
Looks like I'll be building a 503d tank. Dragon, provided their info is right, has markings for one in France and another in Hungary with the 503d and after it was absorbed into FFH. I'm thinking that maybe the on in Hungary was one of the two recovered from France. Paint jobs are way different. Would they have repainted it prior to the deployment to Hungary?
Two companies had Zimmerit, and the third had none (they were built in September during the changeover). The cammo on the first two companies looked much like the Normandy scheme, while the third company had the hard-edged ambush scheme with the polka dots. One of the Porsche tanks, "Annaliese," was photographed in the winter with a coat of whitewash, Can't imagine why they would repaint the underlying camouflage, as the paint was literally brand new.
b2nhvi
Joined: June 17, 2016
KitMaker: 1,124 posts
Armorama: 1,014 posts
Posted: Sunday, July 15, 2018 - 07:46 PM UTC
One of the Dragon schemes is Annalise with the white wash. One review said a prior release of the kit had it without the white wash. Wish I could find the painting ifo for that kit, just for grins and giggles. I saw one listed as belonging to FFH with the white was on the lower part of the turret and the shirts. Not sure if it was applied that way or it was from wear and tear.
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