I'm not talking about aging paint, I'm talking about us modelers aging. Today, I was doing some checking on colors, and the topic was the modern IDF 'Baby Sh*t Brown' as some have called it. I had done a whole bunch of testing Tamiya mixes several years back, and had come upon the statement, by Michael Mass, the acknowledged IDF armor expert, that Humbrol 84 was the best out of the bottle match for the current IDF armor color. Because I was, and am, such a fan of Tamiya paint, I had done a lot of mixing and found that a 2:1 mix of XF-20, Medium Gray, and XF-49, Khaki, was an almost exact match to Humbrol 84, or close enough to not make a difference. Today, I was making up a new batch of the Tamiya mix, and found that the mix no longer matches, close enough, to the Humbrol color. I did find, though, that the Tamiya 2:1 mix, with a rather substantial addition of XF-51, Khaki Drab, now looks, to my eyes, as a perfect match to Humbrol 84. I'm wondering if it's my tired old eyes changing, and thus I'm seeing colors differently. I know some may say that the colors in the bottles/jars may have changed over the years, and I suppose that's true, though I'd like to think the manufacturers try to maintain their colors as consistent as possible over time. Any thoughts on this? I'm happy that my new mix matches so well, but wondering where the differences occur...

Interesting topic Curt, I’ve also found – or maybe perceived is a better word – colour changes on a number of older productions with no particular commonality, I’ve always mixed&matched various manufacturers’ enamel & acrylic paints.

I don’t claim to have any definitive answers but with a background in art history & special interest in materials my thoughts are thus: in the realm of pigments organic & latterly synthetic, red has usually been the first to degrade over time – your browns would contain at least 25% of it. I doubt Humbrol, Tamiya or any other manufacturer did much research into – or cared about - their products’ permanence beyond 5 years or so. If you think your shade’s gone yellower/bluer/greener I rest my case.

Other factors include (as Patrick discusses) light sources, and one’s own eyesight. Apart from the natural deterioration we all experience, I was interested to learn years ago that as we age our corneas begin to yellow (from being clear) BUT the brain’s optic receptors gradually adjust our colour perception to counteract it. Amazing feat, but it isn’t a perfect mechanism so it’s possible we really are seeing colours slightly differently to when we were younger.

So what is your new ratio for this mix? XF20:2, XF49:1,XF51:???

Curt;

You cite Michael Mass as endorsing Humbrol 84 as being the "best out-of-the-bottle" for the (then) current IDF armor color, several years back. And you did some Tamiya mixology and arrived at a combo of XF-20 and XF-49 as being a pretty near perfect match... several years ago.

Question: It seems that you are doing up a different Tamiya mix TODAY - to match the Humbrol 84. So... Are you mixing CURRENT PRODUCTION (possibly different pigments and possibly different tints) Tamiya XF-20, XF-49, and XF-51 to match CURRENT PRODUCTION Humbrol 84, or are you mixing current production Tamiya paints to match an old sample of Humbrol 84 "fresh" from its tin, or are you mixing current production Tamiya paints to match an old, long-dried and exposed-to-light-and-atmosphere Humbrol 84 sample on an old painted kit? Or are you mixing current Tamiya paints and comparing them to wet or dry samples of your old Tamiya mix?

Have you compared current production Humbrol 84 (if you have that...) to wet or dry samples of older Humbrol 84?

Each comparison has "its moments"! Humbrol is known to have gone through some variation in quality over the past couple of decades, and there are certainly those who will say that some Tamiya colors have changed over time, as well.

As noted elsewhere, eyes do change as we age (VERY intriguing issue to me, on acct that my 2 eyes actually see different apparent spectra... each is "color blind" somewhere, according to military pilot color-testing, but each sees colors that the other doesn't! ), paints age in the jar or tin and change color, dried paints age and change color, view lighting always matters, and paint manufacturers alas change their production recipes...

In the end, I find it works reasonably well to find a color reference for the subject that I can accept as being pretty good and which is "the color" I seek to match, and then do mixology to get near to that color. Probably each run is color-specific to the subject and the kit... But that may well be close to the truth in many real cases, so... I'm happy with this subjective route.

Alternatively, you might well be good to stay with the recipe that you originally had (XF-20 and XF-49 mix compared to Humbrol 84). IF that mix - as an old, dried sample on an old kit - looks different from new dried samples your new mix, I would compare each old component color as a wet sample to its current wet color - if the new wet looks like old wet, then the color mix using new colors should look like the color mix did "back when" when wet... and I would assume that the new = old mix would generally age the same and new kits would eventually age to look more like those old kits do. Otherwise, I think you are caught up in variables out the wazoo and you should best just mix up a new color which pleases you NOW, and not worry about what things may have changed over the years!

Just my thoughts on this stuff! Bob