Hello all, another one of my projects, this is supposed to be a vietnam dio... jeep/truck are the old Revell kit figures are Dragon elite "NAM' series recon team and two figs (two dead ones) mixed from "spare box" parts. I need some critics on the layout, some advices on how to make this one look better etc, everything is most welcome!
and one more thing, i need a name for this one becouse i cant figure out a short but interesting one, for now on i named it "Calling for help"
Basic story so far: "a conwoy has beed caught in 'sniper fire', two man kiled in just a few seconds and the rest jumped out and now preparing for fight while radioman is callin for support"
the pics:
WHOLE DIO
THE JEEP
THE TRUCK
Second view
FRONT VIEW
DEAD MAN
Offcourse nothing is painted yet except the jeep, figs recieved a primer coat and thats all so far....
Hosted by Darren Baker
In Progress - Vitenam dio - pics
Sensei
Belgrade, Serbia & Montenegro
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Posted: Friday, April 02, 2004 - 06:49 PM UTC
Davinator
Illinois, United States
Joined: March 15, 2004
KitMaker: 107 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: March 15, 2004
KitMaker: 107 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Friday, April 02, 2004 - 06:53 PM UTC
I would place the jeep at a bit of an angle... If he blew out a front tire, the vehicle probably would have veered a bit toward the left side of the road with a left front blow out... Also, the soldier near the back of the truck is too "upright" for someone near live fire that may be directed at him... He and all of the figures should probably be in more of a crouched position.... The figures seem to stiff and upright for guys who are being shot at... Just my thoughts...
slodder
North Carolina, United States
Joined: February 22, 2002
KitMaker: 11,718 posts
Armorama: 7,138 posts
Joined: February 22, 2002
KitMaker: 11,718 posts
Armorama: 7,138 posts
Posted: Friday, April 02, 2004 - 11:27 PM UTC
First of all - this is exactally what you need to do when doing a diorama. Moch it up and lay it out. Work out the details, work out the "howd it get there" questions.
My question is about the point man and the hill. If snippers are going to hit a convoy they would do it from high ground. Pointing attention to the hill not to the left.
That depends on how high the hill is which is my next question - how high will the hill be? You haven't left a lot of room for a very large hill or much of the base of one.
I'm wondering about the large space for bushes in front. For viewers you'll want to keep the bushes low which doesn't leave a lot of room for creative jungle. Maybe a ditch along the road that fills in for cover, or a bomb crater just off the road.
I would also angle the road more corner to corner so you can involve the viewer with the back side of the convoy. If you don't see the downed GI's you loose some sense of the quickness of the attach.
Just some layout thoughts. I like that you are doing this planning. This kind of thing definitely helps your diorama skills.
My question is about the point man and the hill. If snippers are going to hit a convoy they would do it from high ground. Pointing attention to the hill not to the left.
That depends on how high the hill is which is my next question - how high will the hill be? You haven't left a lot of room for a very large hill or much of the base of one.
I'm wondering about the large space for bushes in front. For viewers you'll want to keep the bushes low which doesn't leave a lot of room for creative jungle. Maybe a ditch along the road that fills in for cover, or a bomb crater just off the road.
I would also angle the road more corner to corner so you can involve the viewer with the back side of the convoy. If you don't see the downed GI's you loose some sense of the quickness of the attach.
Just some layout thoughts. I like that you are doing this planning. This kind of thing definitely helps your diorama skills.
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 12:01 AM UTC
I guess the two guys in front of me more or less said what my first impression was. I would widen the road and have the vehicles at angles as if it was a panic halt rather than a nice orderly, striaght-line stop. Bring the road nearer the front and dont have too much dead space ... leaving more at the back for your hill/foilage´/background!
The lorry door I would leave open to show off the dead figure inside and also to show that the driver got out as quickly as possible. If possible the dead figure inside should be slouched more or thrown back more.
Great idea and good planning ... and the perfect stage to ask for ideas ... beofre you start making solid ground work. Looking forward to more installments!
The lorry door I would leave open to show off the dead figure inside and also to show that the driver got out as quickly as possible. If possible the dead figure inside should be slouched more or thrown back more.
Great idea and good planning ... and the perfect stage to ask for ideas ... beofre you start making solid ground work. Looking forward to more installments!
Sensei
Belgrade, Serbia & Montenegro
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 12:04 AM UTC
Quoted Text
First of all - this is exactally what you need to do when doing a diorama. Moch it up and lay it out. Work out the details, work out the "howd it get there" questions.
My question is about the point man and the hill. If snippers are going to hit a convoy they would do it from high ground. Pointing attention to the hill not to the left.
That depends on how high the hill is which is my next question - how high will the hill be? You haven't left a lot of room for a very large hill or much of the base of one.
I'm wondering about the large space for bushes in front. For viewers you'll want to keep the bushes low which doesn't leave a lot of room for creative jungle. Maybe a ditch along the road that fills in for cover, or a bomb crater just off the road.
I would also angle the road more corner to corner so you can involve the viewer with the back side of the convoy. If you don't see the downed GI's you loose some sense of the quickness of the attach.
Just some layout thoughts. I like that you are doing this planning. This kind of thing definitely helps your diorama skills.
tnx for comments Scott, lets go one at a time shall we?
The "hill" is actually going to be just a bit higher ground so i "cover" the background not THE HILL
Pointer aims to the left becouse thats where the shots came from (the truck windshield has 4 bullet holles on it but i failed to put it on before taking pics ), my idea is that a sniper (or more of them?) is somewhere in far left corner.
YES "Bushes" will be a low grass, or something similar, no worries about that
NO bomb craters, this is supposed to be a pretty much "safe road".
and at last, u guessed my biggest dilema, the road position... if i put it corner to corner i will get more view on dead guys...but than the backside of my truck which is planed to be loaded with "ready-to-eat-meals", gas cans and some equipement will be completely put of sight... im strugling with this one pretty much...
Davinator: there were no flat tyres... just sniper fire and they jumped out of wehicles but i will put a jeep under small angle becouse ur thoughts are good, driver should panic a bit tnx for that pointer... about the figs well, the standing guy is pretty much "under cover" behind the truck, and im not too good in changing figure posses, i had trouble making dead captain so far and i like the look of these dragon figs, i dont wanna spoil them becouse i can hardy afford one more set... but u are right, its just my decision not to move them
tnx very much for comments and i hope someone else will write something that can help me
shonen_red
Metro Manila, Philippines
Joined: February 20, 2003
KitMaker: 5,762 posts
Armorama: 2,283 posts
Joined: February 20, 2003
KitMaker: 5,762 posts
Armorama: 2,283 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 01:17 AM UTC
Nice dio! I hope it would be put up soon! Some of my thoughts:
The one kneeling which is carry an M-79 should atleast be worried about his dear life. Since the sniper fire came from leftmost side, he should be on a look on it rather than to reload his arm.
If you ever finish this, add some blood to the killed men.
The one kneeling which is carry an M-79 should atleast be worried about his dear life. Since the sniper fire came from leftmost side, he should be on a look on it rather than to reload his arm.
If you ever finish this, add some blood to the killed men.
Sensei
Belgrade, Serbia & Montenegro
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 01:42 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Nice dio! I hope it would be put up soon! Some of my thoughts:
The one kneeling which is carry an M-79 should atleast be worried about his dear life. Since the sniper fire came from leftmost side, he should be on a look on it rather than to reload his arm.
If you ever finish this, add some blood to the killed men.
The guy kneeling will be well protected with the truck's cabine when i put the wehicles in more angled position he fired his M-79 as a covering/suppresion fire? and now he is reloading safely kneeling behind the tuck
and as i mentioned nothing except the jeep is painted... ofc there will be blood, especially in the truck's cabine, 3 chest hits in small space surely makes a lot of blood on windshiled and around the body
anyway , those were the nice suggestions i recieved from you guys! i will have to reposition the dead guy in the truck, maybe "lower" his head more on the chests and "loosenup" his hands so he looks more convincing... and i will move the road more to the front so i avoid the "empty space".
Im alwasy opened for more comments on this one becouse I cant continue the works before monday, too much other things to do
so more comments/suggestions are most welcome!
I will finish it! i dont have money to waste so i always finish what i started
animal
Joined: December 15, 2002
KitMaker: 4,503 posts
Armorama: 3,159 posts
KitMaker: 4,503 posts
Armorama: 3,159 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 01:53 AM UTC
Great Idea and concept. The only thing is the Jeep is the wrong kind. We had M-38 A1's and the M-151 Mutts in Vietnam. The only old Willy's jeeps that I ever saw were used by a few South Vietnamese Units.And these were usually the South Vietnamese MP's. As was stated earlier the ambush would have been most likely from higher ground. I was in a few ambush's and the NVA and Viet Cong would take advantage of the high ground.
ShermiesRule
Michigan, United States
Joined: December 11, 2003
KitMaker: 5,409 posts
Armorama: 3,777 posts
Joined: December 11, 2003
KitMaker: 5,409 posts
Armorama: 3,777 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 04:14 AM UTC
I would angle the jeep so that the hood was turned to the left of the road so it appears the driver tried to turn away from the gunfire. Then I would angle the truck so that it is very close to the rear of the jeep but off the road on the right like the driver was trying to avoid the sudden stop of the jeep. I think that the vehicles in disarray on the road would add to the confusion of the situation
HeavyArty
Florida, United States
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
Armorama: 13,742 posts
Joined: May 16, 2002
KitMaker: 17,694 posts
Armorama: 13,742 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 05:57 AM UTC
I was also going to point out that the jeep is wrong era for Vietnam, should be an M151A1 or M38A1 as mentioned. Also, why has the convoy stopped? I would make one of the tires blown out or some other damage on the jeep. The standard procedure for an unblocked ambush or a sniper is to speed up and get out of the area. If you stop, you are just making yourself a target for a longer period of time. Also, your dead Captain has a Thompson .45, not a common weapon used in Vietnam. He should have either an M16, or a CAR 15, many officers carried these instead. He should also have a .45 pistol on him as well. Lastly, the doors are reversed on your M34 2 1/2 ton truck. The two handles that are facing out are the window crank and the inner door handle, you need to switch sides and they will be good.
Whiskey
Texas, United States
Joined: May 30, 2002
KitMaker: 1,038 posts
Armorama: 377 posts
Joined: May 30, 2002
KitMaker: 1,038 posts
Armorama: 377 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 10:16 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Great Idea and concept. The only thing is the Jeep is the wrong kind. We had M-38 A1's and the M-151 Mutts in Vietnam. The only old Willy's jeeps that I ever saw were used by a few South Vietnamese Units.And these were usually the South Vietnamese MP's. As was stated earlier the ambush would have been most likely from higher ground. I was in a few ambush's and the NVA and Viet Cong would take advantage of the high ground.
Animal, since your the one with this exact kind of combat experience, I was thinking that if he is having a diorama of a convoy being ambushed do you at least think if would be more than just snipers? What I mean is that maybe it would look a lot different and more realistic if say, he had VC throwing mortars down on their heads. So that way he could fix the problem of the angle of the jeep by having a mortar land next to it on the right side of the vehicle. Or maybe an RPG, whatever makes a nice crater big enough to have a GI dive for cover in it. Just my two cents.
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 12:47 PM UTC
Looking great, not much I can point out at this stage that has not mentioned already. Be carefull on the blood dont over do it to much. If you need help on the ground work, foliage etc. I may can help you more on that.
animal
Joined: December 15, 2002
KitMaker: 4,503 posts
Armorama: 3,159 posts
KitMaker: 4,503 posts
Armorama: 3,159 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 01:24 PM UTC
Many of the ambush's in Nam would last for only a few minutes. They would sometimes have a disabled vehicle in the roadway or sometimes they would try to disable the second vehicle in line to stop th convoy. (The lead vehicle was usually a jeep with the convoy commander in it or a gun truck) Our standard operating procedure was to never stop if possible and to drive out of the kill zone as fast as possible. Of course this was hardly ever the case. The Viet Cong and the NVA were very smart and even the smallest ambush was well thought out by them. They were not always after the convoy as much as they were after the gun trucks that secured the convoys. There were very large bounties won the security vehicles and they would go after them. If the convoy was carrying fuel, then they would try to hit as many of the trucks in the line as they could because these fires that sometimes occurred would melt the roads and because of the intense heat could keep the convoy ties down for a longer time. So if the second vehicle in Mirko's example is the targeted vehicle than of course it would stop the convoy on a narrow road and he would be correct. My suggestion to Mirko is to make the back side of his Dio a hill side and he will be right on.
Whiskey
Texas, United States
Joined: May 30, 2002
KitMaker: 1,038 posts
Armorama: 377 posts
Joined: May 30, 2002
KitMaker: 1,038 posts
Armorama: 377 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 01:50 PM UTC
I remember reading a book full of stories from many different soldiers from the 9th Cav and one of them was a recoiless rifle platoon sgt. I believe his accounts involved a ambush against his whole squadron and how a VC 30mm(I think it was a 30mm) just decimated everything in its path, being as all it was was a bunch of jeeps and troops. What got them was a two sided ambush, one force on the left and another on the right of the road. Every time the sgt. would try and hustle to another vehicle he said it was like every gun in the country was aimed directly at him. I was surprised though at the fact that there was no supporting units or vehicles with the sgt's platoon or squadron, whatever it was in the book.
D-Cycle
Västerbotten, Sweden
Joined: March 09, 2004
KitMaker: 10 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Joined: March 09, 2004
KitMaker: 10 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Saturday, April 03, 2004 - 11:03 PM UTC
I don't know how the roads are constructed in Vietnam, but I believe the standard procedure (at least what I was thought during my military service) when you're attacked, when you're on a road, is to hit for the ditches, on the side of the road. Have that in mind, if you're building an elevated road...
Great idea for a dio! Especially with the planning involved!
/D
Great idea for a dio! Especially with the planning involved!
/D
ShermiesRule
Michigan, United States
Joined: December 11, 2003
KitMaker: 5,409 posts
Armorama: 3,777 posts
Joined: December 11, 2003
KitMaker: 5,409 posts
Armorama: 3,777 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 04, 2004 - 05:08 AM UTC
SOunds like you need a snapped tree fallen across the road to make a roadblock to and continuity to your ambush scenario
Major_Goose
Kikladhes, Greece / Ελλάδα
Joined: September 30, 2003
KitMaker: 6,871 posts
Armorama: 2,071 posts
Joined: September 30, 2003
KitMaker: 6,871 posts
Armorama: 2,071 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 04, 2004 - 08:36 PM UTC
so far so good. Planning is a good step to go further and with all that has been already said, there;s no much to say , just take care of possible groundwork help. i mean form the groundwork in a way that helps posing and settin figures and also increases the drama.
Sensei
Belgrade, Serbia & Montenegro
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Joined: October 25, 2003
KitMaker: 1,217 posts
Armorama: 799 posts
Posted: Sunday, April 04, 2004 - 10:22 PM UTC
Thank you guys for so many comments, yesterday i traded two of my 1/72 planes for an Academy MUTT jeep so im gonna replace the willy, about the thompson gun... well... its hard for me to buy kits so i dont have anything else to put instead ofc, the dead captain WILL have his sidearm Colt pistol (ill attach it when i finish painting).
yes, my idea wass that the truck was a primary target (the dead guy inside hit through a windshield shows that) and i agree with u that i need to put the wehicles under more angle and not straight to the road, ill fix that
there will be no sideroad ditch becouse im not too good in changing poses of figures and i woulda have to if i make the ditch, i will move the road more to front and make a "middle hight" elevation on back ground. and i already "re positioned" the head of the dead guy inside the truck to make him look more convincing...
updated pics will be available tomorow...
tnx
Mirko
yes, my idea wass that the truck was a primary target (the dead guy inside hit through a windshield shows that) and i agree with u that i need to put the wehicles under more angle and not straight to the road, ill fix that
there will be no sideroad ditch becouse im not too good in changing poses of figures and i woulda have to if i make the ditch, i will move the road more to front and make a "middle hight" elevation on back ground. and i already "re positioned" the head of the dead guy inside the truck to make him look more convincing...
updated pics will be available tomorow...
tnx
Mirko
Whiskey
Texas, United States
Joined: May 30, 2002
KitMaker: 1,038 posts
Armorama: 377 posts
Joined: May 30, 2002
KitMaker: 1,038 posts
Armorama: 377 posts
Posted: Monday, April 05, 2004 - 05:18 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Thank you guys for so many comments, yesterday i traded two of my 1/72 planes for an Academy MUTT jeep so im gonna replace the willy, about the thompson gun... well... its hard for me to buy kits so i dont have anything else to put instead ofc, the dead captain WILL have his sidearm Colt pistol (ill attach it when i finish painting).
yes, my idea wass that the truck was a primary target (the dead guy inside hit through a windshield shows that) and i agree with u that i need to put the wehicles under more angle and not straight to the road, ill fix that
there will be no sideroad ditch becouse im not too good in changing poses of figures and i woulda have to if i make the ditch, i will move the road more to front and make a "middle hight" elevation on back ground. and i already "re positioned" the head of the dead guy inside the truck to make him look more convincing...
updated pics will be available tomorow...
tnx
Mirko
Dont worry about the Thompson, there were a lot of GI's that had them over there. Especially the Cav and Special Forces.