It wouldn't be horribly difficult to make the clear parts for the perisopes/visors from some leftover clear plastic.
If you have any cracked/broken CD-cases lying around you can cut the needed clear parts from the smooth parts of the case. Clear sprues could be used but those require polishing of the visible surface. The inside parts get tinted depending on what type of opening you are replicating.
/ Robin

Good tip Robin,I have a couple kits that are missing their clear parts so I will have to try that.

I had heard that Dragon was dropping the clear periscopes from some of their newer Panther kits, I did not know they were doing the same with the newer Panzer III kits.

There are a number of aftermarket cupolas on the market, TMD makes one: https://tigermodeldesigns.com/product/35-5108-panzer-iiiiv-cupola-with-interior-and-clear-periscopes/

And Fine Molds sold clear periscope sets, I believe German Periscopes Set 2 has the pzIII/IV scopes you would need.

-Nate

There is a lot of useful stuff in a CD-case. Angles/corners for instance.
The older types with the dark coloured inset has a few square inches of coarse surface. Can be used as revetted surfaces for buildings or the less coarse (sand in glue) type of non-slip coating. Not usable for the IDF gravel-in-glue type though ...

Cutting clear "plates" and "inserts" from various plastic cases and such is a great solution for making all sorts of direct-view "windows" - periscope blocks a'la the cased prisms used in Panzer cupolas are a bit more challenging... To get the details and shapes of the outer casings around the glass parts - details molded onto the solid and clear bits provided in kits - needs a bit of fiddly work. This proviso that one desires to actually show those components - the inside stuff seen when one looks down into the Pz.III/IV cupola or into a Panther's prismakoppel, for instance.

Of course, IF one builds the cupola / build in a manner (cupola closed up or filled with a figure) where the inside portions of the prism-and-holder bits are not visible, this detail becomes a moot point, and that clear block cut from a CD case or other clear plastic will do nicely to provide both the external prism face and a light-path. I have cut "prisms" from clear plastic a couple times to replace the kit bits that were supposed to insert from inside the hull up under molded-on covers, as in the case with Panda's "Kurganetz-25" kit, where I couldn't get the kit bits to fit, so I cut my own. It worked out OK, by me.

More to the cupola items; I did, with some modest success, once create a clear prism in a Tamiya solid periscope bit for Tamiya's Marder III kit (one of those movable periscope units used by the crew to peek over the side wall of the Marder and highly-visible to viewers of the model) by carefully slicing off the detail sides from the solid bit and gluing them around a double-angled "glass prism" cut from a piece of clear plastic. It took some fiddle, but I managed to keep most of the painted external seals-and-casing detail and obtained a more-or-less glass-like prism look. I did all of one. I admit to having suffered an attack of obsession and compulsion. But the thought of semi-scratch-building multiples of such bits makes buying an AM set or scrounging the parts from a donor kit MUCH more attractive!

As I see it, it's a decision point... IF the inside detail of the cupola is less visible, the "prisms" themselves are pretty easy, so make them from clear plastic case bits and get some light-path effect. IF the inside details are visible and you want those along with that glass prism look, donor or AM parts would be the easy way to go (unless of course you like to build your own! ).

Bob

I wonder if the whole prism periscope could be replicated by making new clear bits for the upper and lower prism parts and leving the middle bit in grey plastic.
Paint the inside surfaces of the prisms some kind of blue tint to simulate the thickness of armoured glass.


I don't think that the absence of optical path between the two prisms will be visible.

Robin

Great stuff. Like the idea of scratching the lens from plastic bits and CD cases. That kind of attention to detail is what I like. No one item is glaring but its the sum of all those little details that cumulates into a wonderful build. The general person viewing the piece might not notice but I know it's there! lol...

That's a pretty good approach to get the "glass-like face" of the prisms, Robin.

For my Kurganetz-25 build, I did almost exactly what you diagrammed - but only for the top part of the periscope - the top prism, as that was the only visible part. The portion extending down into the dark hull interior was simply left off, as there was no light to be seen coming from down in there, so no optical path would matter.

For my Tamiya Marder III, I cut both prisms top and bottom into one clear piece and sandwiched it inside the detail side-plates that I had cut off the original bit. In this case, there was a potential light path thru the periscope and I wanted to capture that if I could.

IF you cannot see both prism faces (as in my Panda Kurganetz-25), just use the one piece that you can see - that gets you the visible "glass face". IF there is some light source under that "prism" piece, you can get some light path effect with just the one visible prism.

IF you can see both top and bottom prism faces, BUT you don't want or don't care about possible light path, the "Robin model" is a great way to go, I think.

The question of approach comes when you can see BOTH prism faces AND you may be able to get a light path effect IF you provide the path. That calls for an entire clear slice from top to bottom.

Options, gents, options!

Bob

I believe the reason that the clear periscope parts were dropped in favour of solid plastic is in reality you do not see the transparency of the clear plastic once the surrounding is painted black and located in the cupola.

If you study photographs of the cupola periscopes on actual tanks you do not see any transparency, merely a blackness, so painting your solid plastic periscopes gloss black on the visible glass areas will create the same effect.

In modern tanks I believe the coating applied to the glass give off a different coloured effect, but its still a more gloss reflection than transparency.

To prove my point, take a look at these photos of the preserved Panther at Bovington, the commanders cupola.
http://tank-photographs.s3-website-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/panther-tank-bovington-museum.html

Drivers visor

Found here:
https://www.britmodeller.com/forums/index.php?/topic/235002554-panzer-iii-panzerkampfwagen-iii-aus-l/

Optics in a Pz.Bef.Wagen

found here: https://www.scalenews.de/pz-bef-wg-iii-ausf-e-walkaround-151/

yes Robin, your examples do show some transparency on the drivers vision block on an actual tank, but how well can that be seen when reduced to 1:35 scale under normal viewing? The picture showing the optic on the Pz.Bef.Wagen
just shows as a glossy blackness to me, and like I said reduce that to 1:35 and I don't think it being transparent is neither here nor there.

Anybody got a built kit with the vision blocks in place they could show the level of transparency of?

Alan

I would say that 3-4 layers of clear lacquer over a dark/black surface would replicate this good enough.

I would agree. So I don't really think its a real issue that these parts are no longer supplied as clear plastic.

ahh, but it is The Knowing of the clear parts being there

Wow, looked for the PE upgrade kit for my Panzer III/J and it's almost as much as the kit itself! Was looking for JO35041 by Voyager and can't find one anyway except from China, and I'm not doing that! The kit itself will be fine and I'll scratch build the conduit and the smoke launch chains. I'll be doing the Ausf.J late with the L60 gun and call it Ausf.J/L. It will be the 7th Rgt., 10th Pz.Div. Tunisia 1943. I wanted to do #221 with Rommel sitting on the cupola as I mentioned, and even purchased the figure set just to get him in that pose. However, can't see enough of the tank in the picture and can't locate any others to make a good model of 221. So, I'll do number 16 per Dragon and a generic DAK camo over the Panzer Grey and still put Rommel up there not glued on just for fun. I'll post the build for for everyone's light entertainment as it will be my first piece of German armor. Much to do before that ever happens though...more later...Ken Posting on ISM as well.

When reviewing the DML instructions I noticed the armor covers for the engine hatches (DML part Y35 x3) and ventilation hatches (DML part C2 x2) are the same exact size. According to the description in Panzer Tracts the Ausf. J had different size (shorter height on short axis) ventilation hatches over the cooling fans compared to the engine hatches which were taller (short axis). This is clearly described and illustrated. With the introduction of the Ausf. L, the ventilation hatches over the cooling fans were increased in size to that of the engine hatches. This is also illustrated and described on page 3-3-48. Dragon does not appear to give the correct covers for the Tp arrangement. My question is, does anyone know if the shorter cooling vent hatches are available in a different kit or aftermarket? Initial production Ausf. J didn't have the covers at all but mine is going to be a later production J and for DAK, which the covers were installed particularly for hot climates so even early ones were probably all fitted with the hatches for North Africa!...Thoughts?...Ken

Hi Ken,

You should have all the engine cover parts for the smaller hatches (diagram on 3-3-43) in the box on the K sprue. See the instructions for the TP deck here (step 10): https://www.1999.co.jp/eng/image/10188195/70/3

That said, I think either engine deck configuration would be correct, the DAK J on page 3-3-44 has the smaller hatches, while the tank with Rommel (L with turret vision ports still present) has the larger hatches.

-Nate

I believe he has kit DML Kit #6954 not the one you referenced kit number 6543, but it may well be the parts are there knowing how Dragon puts whole sprues in for maybe one or two parts from it.

I have always said "it's not what you know...it's who you know"!!

Nicely done Nate...in my defense, the Dragon instructions for my 6954 kit does not even show that configuration in step 10 at all. There is no reference to the K Sprue items K19 or K15 and in fact, my sprue map has those items in blue. If I use K19 and K15 I would have to use the rear deck of the initial production as it has the smaller cut outs for the smaller hatch. There is also no "spacer/riser" piece like Y37 (later production) that elevates the cover above the hatch. Maybe K19 sits directly on K15 without the "spacer"?. If I use the correct rear deck for later production I would have to use the larger Hatch Y36 (Dragon Instructions have an error and call this piece Y37 also) which has the "riser" Y37 which the smaller cover does not fit (again, unless the smaller cover fits directly on the hatch). Confusing?..."where are my keys??" wait...what am I looking for?? Lol...

I'll review your attached instructions from the earlier kits again for any more info. Thanks for your help it is greatly appreciated.

Nate, Reviewed your attachment again and looks like Y19 attaches directly to Y15, without the "riser". So I'm thinking the only way to use the smaller sized hatch covers is to use the initial production deck...or...use the later deck and put the smaller riser directly on the hatch as the initial. Looks like it might fit but would be sunken down in the recess of the hatch (Y36) farther than suppose to.

Oh, thanks Alan...you're right...different kit. Nate's got just the initial version he's referring to I think. Another weird thing. The sprue map on Nate's attached initial pictures shows K19 in blue and not used, but the instructions at step 9 calls it out?? Hmmm

Hi Ken and Alan,

I have 6954 in front of me, but yes I was referring to initial J instruction sheet since it has correct instructions for the tropical deck (step 9, not step 10 sorry). I am pretty sure 6954 has all of the needed parts, but you would use the 'initial' engine deck B16. Parts K11 and K12 have the risers molded onto the engine hatchs.

This is my (non-expert) interpretation of the engine decks. The tropical modifications were only made to the 'small' hatch engine decks, all the F, G, H and J's sent to North Africa had this modification.

The 'large hatch' engine decks with the armored ventilation hoods (seen on some late J's re-designated L's and all later variants) become the standard on all Panzer III tanks. There may have been internal tropical modifications to tanks sent to Africa, but the engine deck is the same.

So you can follow the engine deck instructions for kit 6543 or use the non-initial engine deck instructions in 6954 and both would be correct. You can find photos of both in north Africa.

Hope I am not spreading too much misinformation and confusion.

Ken, you could get a truly definitive answer on the Missing Lynx forum.

-Nate

Nate, Thanks for that wrap up. I think that sounds great. So...what I did was I cut K-15 (hatch) from the sprue which accepts the "skinny" K-19 armored covers and test fit it to the b-13 early deck and it fits perfectly. So that's what I'm going to do. Later J with an early rear deck and skinny vent covers, up-gunned to the L60, and detailed for DAK in Tunisia. Build will follow the later J except for the rear deck.

I'm almost done with my initial build up of the Panzer III Ausf J. I'd like to post some images and a short review of the build. I assume the "Features" area is the best place to do this? I can see how to start a "Feature" post. All I can do is view...

Found what I was looking for...feature article will be submitted soon.