#:-) Am I right in thinking that the M3 Lee was known as the Grant in British service? If not, what's the difference? Was the Lee used by the British, if so, where and what colours / markings would be typical?

Thanks to Partsman for the Lee.

The Medium Tank, M3 was given the name "General Lee" by the British. A variant of the M3 was designated General Grant, also by the British. The primary differences in the two vehicles were:
- main turret without the aux. MG turret on top
- completely revised and reshaped main turret that had the radio in a bustle and a smoke mortar in the roof
- revised internal and external stowage including replacing the US radio with the British No. 19 set. (this also included new stowage boxes in a couple of different patterns)

The British (and Canadians) used both the Lee and the Grant, with units in the UK and the desert recieving both. Later as the M3s became obsolete in the desert and certainly too obsolete for Italy and NW Europe they were sent to the Far East where they served effectively until the end of hostilities in 1945. I can't remember seeing any Grants in the Far East, but I'm not certain they weren't there.

HTH

Paul Roberts
Vice President
AMPS Interim Board

Wow, quick answer!!! Thanks mate. So does anyone one have pictures of British Lees in service, ideally with colours and markings?

According to "Encyclopedia of British and American Tanks of WW2"by Chamberlain & Ellis, here are the British designations:
Grant 1 = M3 with turret to meet British specifications, no cupola, (turret rear extended to house radio)(As Tamiya 'Grant' kit)
Grant II = M3A5 with original US turret. (M3A5 had diesel engines and therefore can't be made from the Tamiya kit without modification)
Lee 1 = Standard US model (the Tamiya kit is supposed to represent this version)
Lee II = M3A1 (cast hull)
Lee III = none delivered
Lee IV = M3A3 ( Continental diesel engines, welded hull)
Lee V = as Lee IV but GM diesels
Lee VI = M3A4 (Chrysler engine)

There were others as well such as ARVs, command tanks and Scorpion nine clearance vehicles.
Most British Lee/Grants were used in North Africa, and when replaced by the Sherman were sent on to Burma. Some where also sent to Australia, but I don't know how many and of which types.
I don't know which units used them, but colours in North Africa would be light stone no61. sometimes with silver grey no28, slate no34, or terra cotta no44 overpainting. Colours in Burma would be jungle green no13 or deep bronze green no16.
Tamiya colours Buff, Sky Grey, Field Grey + white in about 1-1 mix, and Red Brown are about the best matches for North Africa, and Olive Green for Burma. (my opinions on the colours, others will probably dissagree!!)
Hope this is useful.

Darn it - Paul got his answer in while I was still typing mine!!

Here's some pics for you:

http://www.dana-nield.com/vimy/Lee.asp

http://apma.org.au/reference/afvs/m3lee/m3lee.html

Wow, cool reference pictures. I think the first one is an M31, the recovery variant. The 75mm sponson has been replaced with a hatch and a fake gun tube.
Great pics,
Thanks.

Shaun.

I agree, cool pics! Good observation skills Keenan, I hadn't noticed that. Anymore for anymore? I would like unit markings and i am interested in the far eastern theatre too.

There were Grants used in Burma and were painted in a two-tone scheme of light and medium green. My uncle showed me a bunch of photos he took of them while training with them and the Stuart in Burma. He never was in them in combat and he doesn't know if they retained this scheme. He transferred to the Chindits before the unit was deployed. I believe the unit was the 3rd Carabiniers.

I posted some photos of the restored M3A1 cast-hulled Lee at Aberdeen Proving Grounds here: M3A1 Lee. This is a rather rare variant with only several hundred produced. The Lee is one of my favorite tanks of all time. This is an early production M3A1 characterized by the side entrance door. Mid production M3A1s had the door welded shut and late production M3A1s had the door deleted entirely.

I had no idea there were so many variants on my favorite tracked fortress. Yowza!!

Now I'm itching to buy another and do some changes.

Actually Rob, that M3A1 is the EARLIEST production - that's the very first M3A1, S/N 1962.

If you were driving to APG you could've stopped in Dover DE and also seen the first production M3 (S/N 2) in the same trip!

KL