Armor/AFV
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
For discussions on tanks, artillery, jeeps, etc.
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what makes a good model?
godfather
Joined: June 26, 2002
KitMaker: 817 posts
Armorama: 465 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 07:11 AM UTC
What criteria do you guys use to compare one manufacturers model to another? What do you feel is most important in judging?
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
Armorama: 9,071 posts
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
Armorama: 9,071 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 07:21 AM UTC
Number one would accuracy: Does it have the same shape, details, etc. as the prototype. Second would be quality: cleanly molded, designed to fit well, limited flash, sink holes, injector knockout marks, seam lines.
An accurate kit can be panned if it is a horror in plastic, i.e. bad fit, molding flaws, tricky build. Just like a great fitting and designed kit can be panned if it barely resembles the actual vehicle.
An accurate kit can be panned if it is a horror in plastic, i.e. bad fit, molding flaws, tricky build. Just like a great fitting and designed kit can be panned if it barely resembles the actual vehicle.
TimberWolf
Joined: July 15, 2002
KitMaker: 225 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 07:44 AM UTC
Quoted Text
What criteria do you guys use to compare one manufacturers model to another? What do you feel is most important in judging?
If it has gaps then its usualy not a good model + My 2 cents is if it has a skill leval leave it alone eg. Revell monogram....And if its from Japan then its usualy a good model
I only buy Tamiya, Dragon(DML), and Italeri kits.....but thats just me.
Ps. Dragon kits ARE NOT for the beginer :-)
Abrams101
Joined: July 18, 2002
KitMaker: 146 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 08:08 AM UTC
Acuracy first of all, well I geuss its a toss up between acuracy and biutifuly molded detail ( I can always update the accuracy. Is the company looking for $$$$ , or do they realy care
about a good quality product, Tamiya Has surprised me lately. I picked up the motorcycle ordely kit for just a quick figure practice and opend the box and the faces actualy had expresions( which have been pretty hard to find in plastic (Tamiya especialy)ya know even plastic is a little pricey these days, I think expresions on a figures face arent too much to ask )especialy when it basicly make the figure. Lets say youre a great artist and an excelent figure painter. you buy a kit and the figure has no exspresions. Its like putting crap on a silver platter. so the bottom line is DETAIL. . DETAIL. . DETAIL. The more the better.
about a good quality product, Tamiya Has surprised me lately. I picked up the motorcycle ordely kit for just a quick figure practice and opend the box and the faces actualy had expresions( which have been pretty hard to find in plastic (Tamiya especialy)ya know even plastic is a little pricey these days, I think expresions on a figures face arent too much to ask )especialy when it basicly make the figure. Lets say youre a great artist and an excelent figure painter. you buy a kit and the figure has no exspresions. Its like putting crap on a silver platter. so the bottom line is DETAIL. . DETAIL. . DETAIL. The more the better.
SS-74
Joined: May 13, 2002
KitMaker: 3,271 posts
Armorama: 2,388 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 09:23 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Quoted TextWhat criteria do you guys use to compare one manufacturers model to another? What do you feel is most important in judging?
If it has gaps then its usualy not a good model + My 2 cents is if it has a skill leval leave it alone eg. Revell monogram....And if its from Japan then its usualy a good model
I only buy Tamiya, Dragon(DML), and Italeri kits.....but thats just me.
Ps. Dragon kits ARE NOT for the beginer :-)
Totally agree on the DML kit is not for the beginner part. I summed up my courage after 4 to 5 Tamiyas, before I dare to touch a DML.
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
Armorama: 9,071 posts
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
Armorama: 9,071 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 11:04 AM UTC
Quoted Text
If you are bypassing Skybow and AFV Club kits, you are doing yourself a disservice. They are top notch and the Skybow M38 Jeep and WW2 Dodges (WC51, WC57, etc.) surpass anything Italeri and DML have produced. AFV Club's Wiesels are outstanding kits in the same range as the Skybow soft skins. Even the modern towed artillery (105 and 155mm) are nicely done. Easily two of the best towed artillery pieces done in plastic. Of course, the subjects made by these companies may not be what you are interested in, but I suggest snatching up one of those Jeeps any way.I only buy Tamiya, Dragon(DML), and Italeri kits.....but thats just me.
Ps. Dragon kits ARE NOT for the beginer
And I agree with the DML statement. They can be daunting.
TimberWolf
Joined: July 15, 2002
KitMaker: 225 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 11:10 AM UTC
Quoted Text
If you are bypassing Skybow and AFV Club kits, you are doing yourself a disservice. They are top notch and the Skybow M38 Jeep and WW2 Dodges (WC51, WC57, etc.) surpass anything Italeri and DML have produced. AFV Club's Wiesels are outstanding kits in the same range as the Skybow soft skins. Even the modern towed artillery (105 and 155mm) are nicely done. Easily two of the best towed artillery pieces done in plastic. Of course, the subjects made by these companies may not be what you are interested in, but I suggest snatching up one of those Jeeps any way.
Oh...I never heard of those #:-) I'll give'em a try...you got a link to them??
SS-74
Joined: May 13, 2002
KitMaker: 3,271 posts
Armorama: 2,388 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 11:20 AM UTC
Sabot again is right, yeah, the AFV stuff is really good, I never had any experience on Skybow, so I wouldn't know anything about it. And since I only build German armors, so I will be more focus on product from DML, Alan or maybe ICM, etc. Sometimes, I buy them first consider the subject they are doing. But this said, I really fancy to get my hand on an AFV 155 towed art. seems to be an interest thing to build.
dencoarty12
Joined: June 21, 2002
KitMaker: 42 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Thursday, August 01, 2002 - 11:34 AM UTC
Greetings, As manufacturers improve their tool and die work, the criteria of good and bad changes as well. What once were good or at least available are improved upon and more subject become available. Case in point, Italeri-Peerless WWII Dodges as compared to Skybow's offerings. Italeri Dodges are a bear to build because of their age and quality of casting whereas Skybow, while more detailed and "complex" are a dream to build. Also the accuracy factor is evident in the two kits. This frontal shot shows clear differences between Italeri on the left and Skybow on the right. These are both Beeps. Italeri being a WC52 (has winch) while I built the Skybow as a WC51 (no winch).
Check out the fenders on this one.
Still, the main thing is to have a good time. Scott
Check out the fenders on this one.
Still, the main thing is to have a good time. Scott
Sabot
Joined: December 18, 2001
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
Armorama: 9,071 posts
KitMaker: 12,596 posts
Armorama: 9,071 posts
Posted: Friday, August 02, 2002 - 12:39 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Go to www.squadron.com and do a search for 1/35 scale Skybow and AFV Club kits. AFV Club makes M113-chassied vehicles like the M548 Ammo carrier, Fire Support Vehicle and Chapparel ADA vehicle as well as the M88A1 Recovery Vehicle (both modern and Vietnam era). They also do the modern M35A2 deuce and a half. The make some British light AFV and the Wiesel in 20mm and TOW version. It includes PE for the sprocket and other fittings. I've grabbed the Wiesels for under $20. Great kits.Oh...I never heard of those #:-) I'll give'em a try...you got a link to them??
Skybow has the M41A3 Walker Bulldog hitting the shelves. First look says it is supposed to be a beauty and will rival the brand new AFV Club one. I still highly recommend searching for the M38A1 Jeep and M38A1C Jeep with 106mm Recoilless Rifle. You will not be disappointed.
Weezul
Joined: May 24, 2002
KitMaker: 151 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Friday, August 02, 2002 - 05:18 AM UTC
For me, parts fit comes first, above all else. I don't like to have to use too much putty, or have to shave parts down etc. This is key.
drewgimpy
Joined: January 24, 2002
KitMaker: 835 posts
Armorama: 388 posts
Posted: Friday, August 02, 2002 - 06:31 AM UTC
I love these threads. I can't tell all you guys who know what your talking about how much you help guys like me that don't. Most of the time I just read these posts and suck up the information and don't post myself. The point I guess I am making is please keep having discussions like this even if a lot of poeple don't post because you help a lot of people who just read. Keep up the great work guys and thanks again.
I have the Dragon MLRS and it will be a while before I build it. It does look like a great kit but a little beyond my skill for now.
Quoted Text
Ps. Dragon kits ARE NOT for the beginer
I have the Dragon MLRS and it will be a while before I build it. It does look like a great kit but a little beyond my skill for now.
Kencelot
Joined: December 27, 2001
KitMaker: 4,268 posts
Armorama: 2,804 posts
Posted: Friday, August 02, 2002 - 10:38 AM UTC
Quoted Text
What do you feel is most important in judging?
I can't resist answering this one...The builder's smile! :-)
screamingeagle
Joined: January 08, 2002
KitMaker: 1,027 posts
Armorama: 595 posts
Posted: Friday, August 02, 2002 - 02:07 PM UTC
I feel a good modeler with above average skills & good reference's can take
any kit and make it a great build, and a very accurate model, especially
with all the aftermarket accessories we have available to us today.
.........I also agree with Sabot .......Skybow put's out some excellent
AFV's.
- ralph
any kit and make it a great build, and a very accurate model, especially
with all the aftermarket accessories we have available to us today.
.........I also agree with Sabot .......Skybow put's out some excellent
AFV's.
- ralph
BillyBishop
Joined: March 20, 2002
KitMaker: 347 posts
Armorama: 167 posts
Posted: Friday, August 02, 2002 - 09:59 PM UTC
My definition of a good model is one that looks reasonably accurate when I compare it to photographs of the actual vehicle (I'm not a caliper kinda guy) and it doesn't frustrate me so much that it ends up sitting on the shelf or desk half finished...
An example of frustration is the Maquette Panzer 38T which fits terribly and had mucho gap/fill work on the main body and mucho cleaning to do on the link tracks (I know, I know most individual track links have becoming synonomous with the word "tedium").
This kit has been sitting on my desk untouched for 2 to 3 months while I research my next project.
MSW
An example of frustration is the Maquette Panzer 38T which fits terribly and had mucho gap/fill work on the main body and mucho cleaning to do on the link tracks (I know, I know most individual track links have becoming synonomous with the word "tedium").
This kit has been sitting on my desk untouched for 2 to 3 months while I research my next project.
MSW
TreadHead
Joined: January 12, 2002
KitMaker: 5,000 posts
Armorama: 2,868 posts
Posted: Friday, August 02, 2002 - 11:29 PM UTC
Hey dencoarty12, (what kind of a handle is that? 
) Very nice WC's there mate! I especially like the WC51 engine detail and interior (what I can see of it).
I don't generally 'do' interior's of my AFV's because I'm an alumni of the school of 'if you can't see it, why spend the time'. But on vehicle's like the WC's, and most softskin's I DO include the interior in the build.
Anyway, just wanted to compliment you on your Dodge's... :-)
Tread.
) Very nice WC's there mate! I especially like the WC51 engine detail and interior (what I can see of it).I don't generally 'do' interior's of my AFV's because I'm an alumni of the school of 'if you can't see it, why spend the time'. But on vehicle's like the WC's, and most softskin's I DO include the interior in the build.
Anyway, just wanted to compliment you on your Dodge's... :-)
Tread.
dencoarty12
Joined: June 21, 2002
KitMaker: 42 posts
Armorama: 0 posts
Posted: Saturday, August 03, 2002 - 07:03 AM UTC
Tread,
Thank you for the kind words. Skybow makes it too easy! DenCoArty12? Denver Colorado 12 pdr. artillery. I used to do Civil War reenacting with a local battery till my hearing went south and I figured I was being jus plain dumb firing cannon anymore. I favor Dodges and build my miniature rather annally as a substitute for the full size one I can't really get involoved with right now. I was thrilled when Skybow released their Command Car as I was working on an old Peerless and getting nowhere but frustrated. Thanks again, Scott
The main thing is to have a good time.
Thank you for the kind words. Skybow makes it too easy! DenCoArty12? Denver Colorado 12 pdr. artillery. I used to do Civil War reenacting with a local battery till my hearing went south and I figured I was being jus plain dumb firing cannon anymore. I favor Dodges and build my miniature rather annally as a substitute for the full size one I can't really get involoved with right now. I was thrilled when Skybow released their Command Car as I was working on an old Peerless and getting nowhere but frustrated. Thanks again, Scott
The main thing is to have a good time.
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