Well crud, got an email from Roll Models, they are unable to source a DML Panther G (night fighting). Iwas going to use the night fighting gear for my E100. What other kit has such? Tamiya? That's an expensive kit from what I understand. Who else would have a cheap DML Panther G??

Mike,
Check you PM

DML´s 3´n´1 251 kit. One of the versions has the nightfighting unit. You could buy the kit, build the 251 as another version and have the whole nightfighting for your current project. You could also look to see if someone would sell their not used nightfighting parts. The figures included in this set is also the nightfighting figures.

yup, i gotta agree with Frank

and best of all its cheap! 30 bucks!

i have the said panther G. i build it without the night fighting equipment. if u want the clear night fighting device , pls let me know

Silantra, check your PM

If enough people e-mail DML and suggest they market just the Night Fighting scopes as a separate kit, they just might do that.
As a point of interest, Concord Publications' Panther, claims G's and late A's only had IR scopes for the commander. D's and early A's had the commander's scope, as well as a driver's scope mounted in his view port. As the D's and early A's had binocular sights for the gunner, the binocular sight was removed and replaced with two monocular ones - one for daylight use ( the left one) and the right one connected to another IR scope for nighttime use. The IR searchlight for this scope was mounted to the left of the sights. ( Of course these were only retrofitted to surviving A's and D's near the end of the war.)
DML's commander's IR devise's mount is way too big - it covers almost half the cupola's opening. It would have to be cut back a lot to enable a commander figure to fit in. It's also impossible to close the hatch with the IR devise installed. I don't know what the commanders did on the real ones.

Also remember that there were two distinct night fighting setups...the Tamiya set in its Panther G Steelwheel represents one, and DML's represents another style.

I know there is a build article about it around here somewhere (rummaging through the internet...)

Didn't know Tamiya produced a Panther G with IR devise. But I think DML's night-fighting setup on a G is incorrect. All you have to do is omit the gunner's and driver's IR and apply them to another vehicle. I hope they release a 251/? with the big 'Uhu' IR searchlight.

As an addendum, the Concord book has poor qualty photo of a late D Panther (knocked out) with the triple IR device setup. This, I believe, was referred to as the 'Biwa' solution. The single IR setup on the G's was the 'Sperber' solution. All IR Panthers, regardless of model, was to be equipped with offnenrohr exhausts to make them as invisible as possible at night. The IR devices were tied to grenade bundles or demo charges to destroy them rather than let them be captured by the Allies (obviously some didn't detonate!). Future night-fighting tactics were for triple IR-equipped Panthers to be fitted with an armored box built on the engine deck, manned by three infantrymen armed with MP 44's with Vampir night vision equipment. They were to be accompanied by 251/20's (Uhu) and 251/21(Falke) with more night fighting infantry. DML makes a set of infantry armed with MP 44 night vision equipment, and the 251/21 Falke, so a what if diorama is possible. (How do you imply that a diorama is taking place at night?)

According to The PMMS site under new kit news the
Sd.Kfz.251/20 Ausf.D "Uhu" IR Support Vehicle (Future)

Cheers
Kevin

Check out the link, great references and a beautiful dio:

Panther G Night Fighting Diorama, "The Last Panther in Pomerania"

This is a decent site as well...

http://www.geocities.com/desertfox1891/nightfightingpanthers/nightfightingpanthers.htm

Thanks woodstock, that is what I was looking for...

Not to open too big of a can of worms, or to refer too much to another site...

The 3-set IR DML Night Fighter is a fantasy panzer.

Tamiya's Steel wheeled panther includes parts for a historically accurate IR set, but NOT with the steel wheels, not even with the final station steel wheel.

The pics in the Concord book are generally accpeted and documented as to be fakes/doctored.

There is no generally accepted as valid photographic evidence of the 'solution B' Panther as modeled by DML. Not even on the A chassis as done in the FSM article.
The 'plans' in the Trojka books are beautiful, but are not supported by any other documentation from valid sources.

Tamiya's Steel Wheeled panther G kit includes parts for 3 sets of the one-scope IR gear actually evidenced by verifiable photos. No mg 42, no drivers or gunners scopes, just a mount for the commander in the turret and a metal band through the roof to the gun.

All this was hashed over and over and over and o -well you get the picture- over on Missing Links.

Like the thread about ML mentions, there are some egos there, but there are first rate historians and orig. document searchers as well.
Please use their search function first, it is all in there.

That said, and before I come across as a hugely retentive anatomical construct...and since you'd putting it on a fantasy panzer anyway.. and since the hobby is supposed to be fun..

I say go for it!

Ask around, there are plenty of folks who build the DML night fighter as a decent Panther G, leaving the IR parts for the spares box, likewise with the 2x extra sets in the Tamiya kit.

Mike
-who already has a fictional IR Panther, UHU, and Falke crewed by Nachtjagers dio in the works too-

DOH forgot my main point.. The Night fighter kit was available for about US$20 and shows up on Ebay all the time. There is one there now, packed with Aber grills for $20 w 3 days left.