thinking off a Viet dio for the M-41.Say an old temple ruin steps leading up to it and an M-41 coming down the trail covered in red dirt and dust with maybe an M-163 behind it .With some VC hidden in heavy jungle behind the ruins awaiting to pounce. Who will prevail the Amercians cause of the m-163 going to smoke them suckers as soon as they step out to fire.
What you think good bad ugly
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Thinking of Nam Dio
sgtreef
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Posted: Friday, September 06, 2002 - 07:39 AM UTC
Sabot
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Posted: Friday, September 06, 2002 - 07:49 AM UTC
VC tended to avoid going head-to-head with the mechanized forces. That Vulcan would tear up the landscape. Sounds like a neat idea though, go for it.
sgtreef
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Posted: Friday, September 06, 2002 - 06:59 PM UTC
Done deal
Thanks Rob
Thanks Rob
TreadHead
Colorado, United States
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Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 05:04 AM UTC
Jeff,
Interesting idea. Rob is correct about the 'Cong not going "head to head" with armour. But applying a little 'artistic license' there are a few ways you could 'tweak' the idea, while still maintaining the ingredients.
How about this:
Same set-up, M-41, followed by an M163 coming down the jungle path towards a small clearing with steps leading up to a temple, enemy skulking behind the ruins, right? Well, you could establish the waiting VC as a decoy to draw the attention and concentrated fire from the U.S. AFV's, who would be returning fire, and engaging what's in front of them. Meanwhile the main enemy ambush force is actually now behind the American force in the jungle foilage both on the left and right of the trail catching the M-41 & M163 in a 'killing zone'. Arm the main ambush force with RPG 7's, or recoiless rifle's or maybe something even more 'meaty'. (though they tended not to carry anything "more 'meaty" to maintain mobility).
Here's another 'quickie':
Same set-up. (it's a 'flight of fantasy' right?) A little further along in the engagement, the VC monkeys have felled tree's that have landed behind the AFV's and cut off their escape route.
Show the vehicles with multiple RPG hit's, and the m-41's turret has traversed around to engage the ambush to the left/rear.
A potential add: If you want to 'nix' the tree idea, depict the M163 with a thrown track, having hit a remote detonated mine in the road leading in to the ambush point .
Just a few idea's for ya......hope that generate's some brain juice. #:-)
Tread.
Interesting idea. Rob is correct about the 'Cong not going "head to head" with armour. But applying a little 'artistic license' there are a few ways you could 'tweak' the idea, while still maintaining the ingredients.
How about this:
Same set-up, M-41, followed by an M163 coming down the jungle path towards a small clearing with steps leading up to a temple, enemy skulking behind the ruins, right? Well, you could establish the waiting VC as a decoy to draw the attention and concentrated fire from the U.S. AFV's, who would be returning fire, and engaging what's in front of them. Meanwhile the main enemy ambush force is actually now behind the American force in the jungle foilage both on the left and right of the trail catching the M-41 & M163 in a 'killing zone'. Arm the main ambush force with RPG 7's, or recoiless rifle's or maybe something even more 'meaty'. (though they tended not to carry anything "more 'meaty" to maintain mobility).
Here's another 'quickie':
Same set-up. (it's a 'flight of fantasy' right?) A little further along in the engagement, the VC monkeys have felled tree's that have landed behind the AFV's and cut off their escape route.
Show the vehicles with multiple RPG hit's, and the m-41's turret has traversed around to engage the ambush to the left/rear.
A potential add: If you want to 'nix' the tree idea, depict the M163 with a thrown track, having hit a remote detonated mine in the road leading in to the ambush point .
Just a few idea's for ya......hope that generate's some brain juice. #:-)
Tread.
Sabotshooter
Mississippi, United States
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Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 09:41 AM UTC
Hey I might be wrong here but I thought that the only tank used by US forces in VN was the M48. The 41 from all references I've ever seen was used by the ARVN. But hey this is an art form and "artistic license" is a topic I preach so I think it sounds like a really cool dio.
Stephen Magee
Stephen Magee
sgtreef
Oklahoma, United States
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Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 10:01 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Jeff,
Interesting idea. Rob is correct about the 'Cong not going "head to head" with armour. But applying a little 'artistic license' there are a few ways you could 'tweak' the idea, while still maintaining the ingredients.
How about this:
Same set-up, M-41, followed by an M163 coming down the jungle path towards a small clearing with steps leading up to a temple, enemy skulking behind the ruins, right? Well, you could establish the waiting VC as a decoy to draw the attention and concentrated fire from the U.S. AFV's, who would be returning fire, and engaging what's in front of them. Meanwhile the main enemy ambush force is actually now behind the American force in the jungle foilage both on the left and right of the trail catching the M-41 & M163 in a 'killing zone'. Arm the main ambush force with RPG 7's, or recoiless rifle's or maybe something even more 'meaty'. (though they tended not to carry anything "more 'meaty" to maintain mobility).
Here's another 'quickie':
Same set-up. (it's a 'flight of fantasy' right?) A little further along in the engagement, the VC monkeys have felled tree's that have landed behind the AFV's and cut off their escape route.
Show the vehicles with multiple RPG hit's, and the m-41's turret has traversed around to engage the ambush to the left/rear.
A potential add: If you want to 'nix' the tree idea, depict the M163 with a thrown track, having hit a remote detonated mine in the road leading in to the ambush point .
Just a few idea's for ya......hope that generate's some brain juice. #:-)
Tread.
You got my juices flowing Tread But you are getting all my troops slaughtered I am winning here LOL.
I will email you when this comes together to see what else you can add Sounds good but I am moving away from damage maybe
Thanks Tread
sgtreef
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Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 10:06 AM UTC
Quoted Text
Hey I might be wrong here but I thought that the only tank used by US forces in VN was the M48. The 41 from all references I've ever seen was used by the ARVN. But hey this is an art form and "artistic license" is a topic I preach so I think it sounds like a really cool dio.
Stephen Magee
I know from what I have read this might be true Rob is this so. Okay how about an M-41 ARVN and a M-48 American same setup maybe an M-107 along for the ride what kind of escort for this piece. I had the Vulcan along for escort no escort or what all for Nam guys chime in please. Also at night was a change of bases a go or nogo.
Sabot
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Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 11:12 AM UTC
Doubtful that these pieces would be working together in such a close local. Tanks are frontline vehicles, ADA tracks were used for base defense, convoy escort or infantry support, and an SP howitzer would be centrally located at a fire base of some type. They had ranges in the 20 mile area, so they were fairly static. If they moved, the guns moved as a battery, all together.
TreadHead
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Posted: Saturday, September 07, 2002 - 12:16 PM UTC
As always Rob's input here is invaluable. I had originally typed something to that effect (but not quite as detailed as our good Major 'G's ) but decided to delete it instead and try to go with the original ingredient's of sgtreef's dio idea.
But, now that you're changing the cards dealt.............
Let me know the basic parameters and I'll throw some ideas at ya!
Tread.
BTW, my ideas were meant to generate tension in the engagement (gee, will they get out of this predicament!). I wasn't trying to 'slaughter' your troops. Incorporating 'implied tension' in your dio is a good idea. Especially in competition.
Additionally, (on another point). I believe your question was "...Also at night was a change of bases a go or nogo." Answer: Not unless your immediate desire was to be killed, or, you had a 'butter bar' in command.
But, now that you're changing the cards dealt.............
Let me know the basic parameters and I'll throw some ideas at ya!
Tread.
BTW, my ideas were meant to generate tension in the engagement (gee, will they get out of this predicament!). I wasn't trying to 'slaughter' your troops. Incorporating 'implied tension' in your dio is a good idea. Especially in competition.
Additionally, (on another point). I believe your question was "...Also at night was a change of bases a go or nogo." Answer: Not unless your immediate desire was to be killed, or, you had a 'butter bar' in command.
sgtreef
Oklahoma, United States
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Posted: Sunday, September 08, 2002 - 08:07 PM UTC
Quoted Text
As always Rob's input here is invaluable. I had originally typed something to that effect (but not quite as detailed as our good Major 'G's ) but decided to delete it instead and try to go with the original ingredient's of sgtreef's dio idea.
But, now that you're changing the cards dealt.............
Let me know the basic parameters and I'll throw some ideas at ya!
Tread.
BTW, my ideas were meant to generate tension in the engagement (gee, will they get out of this predicament!). I wasn't trying to 'slaughter' your troops. Incorporating 'implied tension' in your dio is a good idea. Especially in competition.
Additionally, (on another point). I believe your question was "...Also at night was a change of bases a go or nogo." Answer: Not unless your immediate desire was to be killed, or, you had a 'butter bar' in command.
I do love your way with words Tread . Plus I also thought that night time was for the special forces, seals. search and destroy I know we even in training did not like night moves. And the night moves all closing in. okay M-107 is out maybe 2 vulcans oh oh what about an M-42 along also Tread Rob. So one M-41 which was used mainly for infantry support not in its intended roll of head to head to go against the T/34 type 85 or the M-48 and one Vulcan now back to the duster could this have been used also with the Vulcan or are we getting to much stuff here.. This is what makes modeling Vietnam so hard. If this was german ww2 heck could have 250s, motorcycles, panzer IIIs, hummels, tigers, 88s all in same scene too much piece meal in Nam.
Thanks
armyfiremn
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Posted: Monday, September 09, 2002 - 11:45 AM UTC
i'd like to see someone make a dio out of a village on the edge of a rice patty maybe. but deffiently a village of some sort.
sgtreef
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Posted: Monday, September 09, 2002 - 07:38 PM UTC
Quoted Text
i'd like to see someone make a dio out of a village on the edge of a rice patty maybe. but deffiently a village of some sort.
Sounds good Capt Jack and tread would be the ones to get involved in this