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Armor/AFV: Modern - USA
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Are M113A3 Ambulances OIF armored?
Petition2God
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Colorado, United States
Joined: February 06, 2002
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 09:34 AM UTC
Hey, guys,
I plan to build a M113A3 Ambulance in OIF as my next project and was wondering if those ambulances were armed with .50 cal M2's because I actually have not seen any photos of ambulance M113's with M2's on. Does Geneva convention prohibit such arming? Please inform me and thanks in advance.

Btw, the topic title was a typo- "Armed" not "armored" Sorry. =)
HeavyArty
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 10:12 AM UTC
Nope, due to Geneva Convention, ambulances do not carry mounted weapons. M113 Ambulance would either have the pintle with no mount for the weapon, or the pintle mount would have been removed. You can see the empty pintle mount in the below pic from Iraq.


Here's a few good shots of one, including the interior as well. M113 Ambulance

Here is one I did a while ago too.
My M113 Ambulance.

Good luck on yours.
Burik
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 10:14 AM UTC
I'm pretty sure they were armed w/ the M2. I think I have a photo for you. The driver has an M16 too.

Bob
HeavyArty
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 10:28 AM UTC
Bob,
If you have a picture of an M113 Ambulance with a mounted weapon, M2 or otherwise, it is a war crime. Crew members are allowed to and do carry personal weapons, but ambulances are prohibited by the Geneva Convention to mount weapons. Just like ambulances are not supposed to be fired upon either, but I know first hand that this happens all the time. Sorry, but this is Law of War stuff and we are grilled on this all the time. This also doesn't mean the enemy follows the Geneva Convention even though we do.
Burik
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 10:32 AM UTC
Yes, it appears my memory fails me again. However, in this photo you can see the men armed w/ either M16s or M4s.



Gino, you know better than I, but can't the men arm themselves for self-defense, as in this photo?

Bob
HeavyArty
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 10:45 AM UTC

Quoted Text

Crew members are allowed to and do carry personal weapons, but ambulances are prohibited by the Geneva Convention to mount weapons.



Yes they are allowed to. I mentioned it in the line above in my post . A mounted weapon is seen as an offensive weapon, that is why ambulances can't have them. Nice pic from the sand storm by the way. That was a really fun time, I think I still am picking sand out of places I never thought it would get.

Also of note. The entire pintle mount has been removed from the one in your pic as well. Also, the crewmen are both firing M16A2s.
ShermiesRule
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 11:45 AM UTC
HeavyArty was your ambulance interior a conversion kit or a scratch? It looks great
HeavyArty
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 11:49 AM UTC

Quoted Text

HeavyArty was your ambulance interior a conversion kit or a scratch? It looks great



Thanks, I scratched it. Not really that hard. all I added were the chains and rods that hold the stretchers and their mounting points on the floor and ceiling. Stretchers, treatment boxes, and decals are from the Academy M977 HMMWV Ambulance kit.
Burik
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 12:57 PM UTC
I'm off my game today. I swear I read Gino's note, but still the part about personal weapons got by me.
Petition2God
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Posted: Sunday, June 26, 2005 - 01:34 PM UTC

Quoted Text


Good luck on yours.



Thanks a lot, Gino. I know I could count on you for info.

James
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